RuneScape Forum Archive | On the quest releases' problem

Balustan

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Jagex created 2 Hazeels in TMF alone. Not Zanik btw but they created Hazeels.

When they kill off gods as individual choices they will be creating Hazeels. Certain characters will always want to be involved in things or would always have a goal for all time and can only become Hazeels. Jagex claim many things but a lot of them are not true and I guarantee their so called no Hazeels of the 6th age certainly isn't.

Oh really? Zaros seemed to be pretty adamant you were needed for your power as a world guardian. One of my biggest complaints about 6th age quests because it doesn't actually matter what I achieved but because Guthix gave me some power I am an important tool. There was no reason the way they made it out in the quest. The quest is just bad and quite frankly you could have just left him.

Lewis

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Quester

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Scottish

01-Jul-2014 10:28:32

Autumn Elite

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Lord Drakan said :
I found it terrible that we had a choice of helping or stopping the Cult of Hazeel. The developer should have made that choice. Either help them as the naive adventurer who thinks they're doing the right thing, or hinder them as the noble adventurer hired by Sir Ceril. Or the attempt to make Bandos more appealling to join during WE2: why? He is a villain and that attempt harmed his role as one. Or the completely random choice to kill Zanik during TMF. She was the hero of the series and our best friend. They gave her terrible graphics, but also the choice to *kill* her? No offence, but that was the worst storytelling ever and the most out-of-character thing the player could have done.

There was no problem in allowing us to aid or stop the cult of Hazeel. That was fine and one of the few times in the fifth age where Zamorakian players weren't made to stop characters they might have agreed with. The problem was leaving Hazeel unresolved. He is rather still comatose or back but doing nothing so the choice to revive him for those who did was meaningless as it had zero impact.

What should have happened is that he returned regardless and the choice effected his attitude of us.

Bandos was written as a villain for the cave goblin series. When the sixth age began and factions became a thing, they had to make him more well rounded. It only harmed him as it was underdeveloped and felt tacked on. If they spent the time and effort on it, he could have been a fully fleshed out character.

Yeah the mighty fall was terrible. I like to pretend it didn't happen. I get why they added a choice so bandosians weren't forced to help the enemy of their god but it was handled terribly. One of the games biggest mistakes. What should have happened is a situation similar to the one in Death of Chivalry, where bandosians were given a valid reason to fight for Zanik but could tell her they followed Bandos.

01-Jul-2014 10:51:34

Autumn Elite

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A Wild Zeek said :
Best quest in the fifth age was While Guthix Sleeps, which is LIGHT YEARS ahead of the best sixth age quest, be it FOT* or TWW. Simplicity beats complexity every time.

It really isn't fair to compare the sixth age to While Guthix Sleeps yet. The sixth age started a year ago, it needs time for storylines to build up. Did you see how many quests WGS required at the time? All of them. Sure you can compare graphics and stuff as that is something that should be constantly improving. But comparing the storyline of a quest that took years to build and contained several recurring characters to brand new quests does nothing.

Oh and The World Wakes would count as the last fifth age quest, not sixth age surely? Plus lets not think grandmasters make things great. I would say Death of Chivalry would be a contender for best sixth age quest so far.

01-Jul-2014 11:00:17 - Last edited on 01-Jul-2014 11:00:36 by Autumn Elite

Autumn Elite

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Lord Drakan said :
Balustan said :
Oh btw the 200th quest is going to be a total let down unless it's Myreque now. I think they made things bad for themselves by not releasing enough to make Elf 200th cause let's be honest we will want a great 200th.

IMO number 200 should be another standalone, non-Sixth Age special quest. But an awesome one at that!

I doubt they could get Myreque done in time unless they have started already. I don't mind what age it is as long as it is good quality. The Chosen Commander was great so something of that quality.

01-Jul-2014 11:12:08

Balustan

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Autumn Elite said :
A Wild Zeek said :
Best quest in the fifth age was While Guthix Sleeps, which is LIGHT YEARS ahead of the best sixth age quest, be it FOT* or TWW. Simplicity beats complexity every time.

It really isn't fair to compare the sixth age to While Guthix Sleeps yet. The sixth age started a year ago, it needs time for storylines to build up. Did you see how many quests WGS required at the time? All of them. Sure you can compare graphics and stuff as that is something that should be constantly improving. But comparing the storyline of a quest that took years to build and contained several recurring characters to brand new quests does nothing.

Oh and The World Wakes would count as the last fifth age quest, not sixth age surely? Plus lets not think grandmasters make things great. I would say Death of Chivalry would be a contender for best sixth age quest so far.

I would say undisputedly it is the best quest of the 6th age after OoaK which is the quest I was forgetting about earlier.

I should have made it clear I don't think it'll be Myreque either just that to me without a good Myreque quest at this point will the 200th not be a let down. As such I think it will be a let down.

You are right about WGS and the build up. Largely WGS being possible was accidental and I personally don't think they will ever pull it off again.

Lewis

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Quester

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Scottish

01-Jul-2014 11:19:04

Sep

2010

Lord Drakan

Posts: 7,043 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Autumn Elite said :
Lord Drakan said :
I found it terrible that we had a choice of helping or stopping the Cult of Hazeel. The developer should have made that choice. Either help them as the naive adventurer who thinks they're doing the right thing, or hinder them as the noble adventurer hired by Sir Ceril. Or the attempt to make Bandos more appealling to join during WE2: why? He is a villain and that attempt harmed his role as one. Or the completely random choice to kill Zanik during TMF. She was the hero of the series and our best friend. They gave her terrible graphics, but also the choice to *kill* her? No offence, but that was the worst storytelling ever and the most out-of-character thing the player could have done.

There was no problem in allowing us to aid or stop the cult of Hazeel. That was fine and one of the few times in the fifth age where Zamorakian players weren't made to stop characters they might have agreed with. The problem was leaving Hazeel unresolved. He is rather still comatose or back but doing nothing so the choice to revive him for those who did was meaningless as it had zero impact.

What should have happened is that he returned regardless and the choice effected his attitude of us. [/quote]
Yeah, I agree. The problem is that he doesn't appear in RotM for those that stopped him, which is a shame. Impactless choices and Hazeels at the end of a character's storyline (like Zanik or Veldaban - even though there should have been no choice with them) are fine, impactful choices that create different stories for different people and Hazeels such as Hazeel himself aren't. Bizarre Boron Fusswell, scryer extraordinaire. OSRS: POH ideas & RS3 minigames & achievement ideas !

Perhaps you're half right; perhaps we can't win. But we can fight.

— Zanik

01-Jul-2014 12:41:13

Autumn Elite

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Balustan said :
I should have made it clear I don't think it'll be Myreque either just that to me without a good Myreque quest at this point will the 200th not be a let down. As such I think it will be a let down.

You are right about WGS and the build up. Largely WGS being possible was accidental and I personally don't think they will ever pull it off again.

It matters what they do with it. They were planning to do something similar to 150th, finishing a quest line. Obviously elf city has pushed that forward. The only other possible quest series that could be finished in one quest I believe is the gnomes.

More likely it will be a one off quest then unless they go for a continuation. Hopefully they will pick a popular existing character if they go this route. I would love Rite of Passage to finally get a real chance to see Armadyl but it could be anything.

EDIT - What I dislike is how now every quest tries to copy the success of WGS. Now we have far too many grandmasters and sequels trying to replicate how popular it was. They should focus on story instead "look a grandmaster quest, that means its good and important".

01-Jul-2014 12:52:05 - Last edited on 01-Jul-2014 13:12:29 by Autumn Elite

Autumn Elite

Posts: 3,487 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Lord Drakan said :
Yeah, I agree. The problem is that he doesn't appear in RotM for those that stopped him, which is a shame. Impactless choices and Hazeels at the end of a character's storyline (like Zanik or Veldaban - even though there should have been no choice with them) are fine, impactful choices that create different stories for different people and Hazeels such as Hazeel himself aren't.

It would be much better if they dealt with the main characters in a proper way for all though. I don't mind having choices on smaller NPCs like shopkeepers but major ones like Zanik should be resolved definitively.

There is no issue with meaningful choice, just ones that don't make half the players invalid or kills characters. Bad choices like choosing whether to revive Hazeel or kill Zanik should never happen as those who have them alive never see them again so the choice is not really there, the other peoples opinion is forced upon them and the plot doesn't make sense.

One of the reasons I liked Death of Chivalry was the choice at the end. Saradomin got the wand regardless but I could chose whether to help or oppose him. I wasn't forced to hand it over against my will as that was the only option. The end result was the same but our relationship is different and my decision will have meaning in future content.

Choices should enhance the game options, not cut valid characters out of the narrative.

01-Jul-2014 13:39:39

Balustan

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There is no way gnomes can be finished in 1 quest we don't have a clue what's going on. There are no villains or any real plot. I personally blame Prisoner Of Glouphrie which should have moved the plot on which it sadly didn't.

Lewis

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Quester

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Scottish

01-Jul-2014 14:00:09

Autumn Elite

Posts: 3,487 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Balustan said :
There is no way gnomes can be finished in 1 quest we don't have a clue what's going on. There are no villains or any real plot. I personally blame Prisoner Of Glouphrie which should have moved the plot on which it sadly didn't.

I wouldn't say it is impossible to wrap gnomes up in one quest if they started answering questions straight away and planned it properly. It would have to be done carefully to avoid turning out like salt in the wound but it is possible. I would like it done well and hopefully when it is in development, they will release one of those consultation threads of the forums so players can point out plot points that need including/answering. If they are determined to end the series in one quest, then I think it is best we work to make that quest as good as possible.

01-Jul-2014 14:28:33

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On the quest releases' problem