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Alt1 should be banned! Y/N?

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Kings Abbot

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XSlay4DeathX said :
@Mel

You dislike alt 1 because it makes us that do clues way faster at solving them, right? okay off that, that means more tt items are being pumped into the game at a faster rate. Would cause a 'crash' from too much supply. but it didn't things went up and up.


Aren't you forgetting the rather limited supply of getting the clue scrolls in the first place? Kings Eastwood in
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28-Apr-2022 16:14:44

Mel 624
Dec Member 2021

Mel 624

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@XSlay4DeathX

The problem isn't making clue solving faster than it currently is, it's how it's being done. Skipping through what's supposed to take time to solve at a faster rate than even the most skilled players can manage when solving them normally and in turn making more money faster than everyone else actually doing them properly is straight up cheating. What we need are QoL updates to address issues with how the clues currently work to make them more enjoyable and intuitive to solve as they're meant to be. That's where your speed optimization should be. Once that's done they can disallow clue solving programs like what Alt1 is doing with the main concerns over it already addressed.

Removing Alt1 won't ruin the clue economy. With the QoL issues addressed, more people will be motivated to solve them as they should be and it'd hardly stop former Alt1 users from solving clues. They'd just have to settle for the normal and intended time from actually solving them properly like everyone else. How to block a forum user

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29-Apr-2022 02:03:03

Rikornak
Oct Member 2013

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And meanwhile the OS team has included a much more potent clue solver tool into their own official C++ and mobile clients - the latter before that not even able to benefit from that at all - alongside lots and lots of other features stemming from 3rd party clients originally.

And not even that - they even extended what they deem as okay from 3rd party clients, albeit you now will get banned for using anything else than one of their own clients or one out of three approved 3rd party ones. Runelite recently has gotten stuff, which would have been against the rules a few weeks ago.

To be honest - Jagex should do the same for RS3 - or even better - provide some API, which players could use to develop addons to improve the game experience - or just for features, that certainly are not relevant to everybody.

I previously said those are features that easily could be included in the official client as reward space - tools to solve certain TT puzzles wouldn't be too off after all - on a runelite power level - not alt1. For instance a slider solver for 2500 points would make a great progression reward, that will keep tickets relevant as well, since those just are faster than having to click on 100-160-esque tiles - or even 40 if that unjustified nerf was reverted. Similiar things to other kinds of puzzles with adjusted costs.

Other than that - Jagex has to find out why players are using alt1 and how they could incorporate those features in their own client. Not alienating their community by taking them tools away they are using to fix shortcomings on a much lower level, than what OS has to. OS would have to shut down their game a few weeks later if they would do this, but I am sure they'll piss off enough players if this was done in RS3. Improvements: Tooltip / (F2P) QoL v2
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30-Jun-2022 06:27:19 - Last edited on 30-Jun-2022 06:55:35 by Rikornak

DeathslAngel
Mar Member 2020

DeathslAngel

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I don't support banning it. Clues aren't like botting at all, and there is a limited supply, with an okay demand. You have to farm for them. For hours. You have to physically be there, performing actions, over and over and over again.

The higher level clues take a while as it is. Most people can't do "25 elites in an hour". I do 5-7 elites an hour even with alt(without skipping tickets). Not to mention it would ruin the high level PVM market which require the items from clues to continue their use or creation. It's estimated like 1 in 4 Easy clues give a fortunate. That takes 1 hour thieving for about 25 to solve, and you make 5-8 mil in 2 hours. Elites is like 1 in 3 give a fortunate roughly. Not counting "super rares" I only make like again 3-4 mil every 2 hours.

Bossing makes you ridiculous amounts of money. Clues make you "okay" money till you hit that super rare item. Which takes hundreds of attempts.

It also has a lot of other useful tools for users. Not just for clue solvers.

Everyone complaining about using it to help "solve puzzles" obviously have not done hundreds of these puzzles, and they don't understand how carpal tunnel inducing it is. The price of skipping tickets to skip some puzzles is 3 mil a ticket right now. (which isn't affordable)
.
If they do ban Alt1, they would essentially have to hard rework treasure trails, and it's rewards. Not just a simple "QOL" like some of these people suggest.
--
Also you're not "skipping content" You still have to click each square like everyone else does to solve the clue.
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I will say that clues should get a QOL. However at this time till they do a proper rework banning Alt1 is a very bad idea.

07-Jul-2022 20:02:35 - Last edited on 07-Jul-2022 20:20:33 by DeathslAngel

Jack Flac
Feb Member 2022

Jack Flac

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DeathslAngel said :
I don't support banning it. Clues aren't like botting at all, and there is a limited supply, with an okay demand. You have to farm for them. For hours. You have to physically be there, performing actions, over and over and over again.

The higher level clues take a while as it is. Most people can't do "25 elites in an hour". I do 5-7 elites an hour even with alt(without skipping tickets). Not to mention it would ruin the high level PVM market which require the items from clues to continue their use or creation. It's estimated like 1 in 4 Easy clues give a fortunate. That takes 1 hour thieving for about 25 to solve, and you make 5-8 mil in 2 hours. Elites is like 1 in 3 give a fortunate roughly. Not counting "super rares" I only make like again 3-4 mil every 2 hours.

Wait, since when do clues give anything mandatory for high level pvm? You don't need Luck of the dwarves for anything. I mean, it's nice to have, but it's not mandatory in any sense. And you certainly don't need Grace of the elves, which is for skilling, or Dyes, which are cosmetic luxury items which sole reason for existing are to allow you to repair degrade to dust gear, or to simply flaunt your wealth.

If anything, PvM profits need to be nerfed. PvM is too profitable. Leader of The Enemy ||
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08-Jul-2022 00:57:37

Mel 624
Dec Member 2021

Mel 624

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@Deathslangel

I've solved plenty of clues and never used a clue solver for it. programs like that aren't a solution for QoL problems with the content. You fix those with actual QoL updates. The rare clue items are meant to take a while to get since you're not actually supposed to be grinding clues continuously like that. If you're physically straining yourself overdoing the clues then that's on you for not minding your limits. The solution for that would likely end up being to cap how many clues can be done within certain time increments to enforce breaks, which I don't think anyone would like.

A few M is plenty affordable for clues, you're just meant to use them sparingly rather than for every single clue of a particular type.

I disagree with clicking the squares meaning you're not skipping content. You're spam clicking so fast you don't even need to think about the puzzle. There's no actual engagement with it. It's only not skipping in by the loosest definition, which isn't how the word is being used.

I actually made a thread discussing QoL improvements for clues. It's a pretty simple fix to address a lot of the issues people have mentioned with them, so I don't really see how a 'hard rework' would be the only solution. Most of the people advocating for removing Alt1 have also said they support QoL improvements being done beforehand, so there's no need to worry about that. How to block a forum user

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11-Jul-2022 23:51:03

Draco Burnz
Dec Member 2011

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Mel 624 said :


I disagree with clicking the squares meaning you're not skipping content. You're spam clicking so fast you don't even need to think about the puzzle. There's no actual engagement with it. It's only not skipping in by the loosest definition, which isn't how the word is being used.


Yet arent ppl who can solve puzzles in mere seconds doing the exact same thing?

Plus theres also the fact that ppl can start doing them faster and faster once they get the hang of it.


So how exactly is this any different than that?
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12-Jul-2022 01:12:50 - Last edited on 12-Jul-2022 01:13:49 by Draco Burnz

Mel 624
Dec Member 2021

Mel 624

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I highly doubt people are actually capable of solving it that fast without something telling them where to click with no thought. There's a limit to how efficient people can get while actually paying attention to where the pieces go and the skill they gain at doing it faster is earned through experience rather than something coming from a program they shouldn't be using. The same goes for its theoretical use to help cheese bosses, which was one of th concerns with allowing its use in the game. How to block a forum user

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12-Jul-2022 04:04:32

Zarudon
Mar Member 2018

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Tbh, it probably should be, but let's be honest. By now Alt 1 is widely used and accepted by Clue hunting community and others that do clues. Banning it would simply result in people getting upset and some quitting or finding other ways to solve clues faster. Tbh, i think this is why Jagex just said it's okay to use. The fight for this is just not worth it.

Tbh, this would be the least of worries, there are plugins that also help with Croesus boss fight, there is also of course macros that ppl in the pvm community use and it is widely accepted as well as considered necessary for some. There is also the use of gaming mouses which have more buttons and allow for easier use of abilities. Without a doubt these things do provide an advantage to those who use them. The problem you see is, where is the line drawn? Just ban alt 1? What about a gaming mouse? What about using two monitors so people can look at guides and the game at the same time? What about people that use discord and have headsets and can VC while doing boss kills? What about using Rs wiki or quest guides? They tell you the answers to quest puzzles and clues too. What about using yt for boss guides and learning all the mechanics of a boss before fighting it, is that cheating? All of these things still require some human input. While sure alt1 does tell you the solution to a puzzle skip tickets still make solving the puzzles faster. I don't think these should be banned, simply because once again drawing the line is difficult, and it would affect the community which has already accepted them in a negative way, causing less players to play which Jagex probably doesn't want. There's not much of a difference then having rs wikis clue solver in another tab anyway.

If anything Jagex should make their own add-ons, but they probably don't for reasons we already know. $$$$ why do something when the community is more than willing to do it.

13-Jul-2022 06:33:26 - Last edited on 13-Jul-2022 06:49:51 by Zarudon

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