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Grimoire of Gielinor

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AttilaSquare

AttilaSquare

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Jakir said :
Poppy Jungle said :
One issue I see with this is that, as stated by JMods and in-game characters (I believe Zaros and Kerapac in particular) that our universe isn't the first one, and that the Elder Gods are older than the universe itself; they create universes, sleep, and then wake up, eating all the anima that the universe has generated, destroying that universe, and beginning anew.


They were just talking about the planets otherwise Freneskae wouldn't exist.

It seems to me that the elder goddesses somehow maintain their identity from multiverse to multiverse, i.*. through sleeping and rebirth. Mod Ollie said that whatever happened to Mah might have occured in relation to her failure to suppress sentient and sapient life on the homeworld of the dragonkin, perhaps the penultimate world of the previous cycle. Therefore, we have evidence of Mah and the others existing in a previous universe.

25-May-2015 18:42:43 - Last edited on 25-May-2015 18:44:00 by AttilaSquare

Alchimous
Aug Member 2006

Alchimous

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Jakir said :
So it is my theory the Standard Spellbook would be more aptly named "The Unified Spellbook" as it is leftover from the Godwars presumably because Guthix kicked out most of the Gods with 0 notice and they never had a chance to split off.

This is demonstrability false. To quote Archmage Sedridor;
Original message details are unavailable.
The standard adventurer's spellbook and the teleport lodestones are both products of tower wizards' research.

This clearly shows that spellbooks are not the product of the gods, an imprint, or any other nonsense. It is made by wizards and there are other spell books in use by humans, even in the wizards' tower. We have no reason to believe it is different for any other spellbook, just that they are more limited in use due to the nature of their users.
"There is no Good or Evil, no Light or Dark, Order or Chaos. Just knowledge and your own ability to know when to stop. And if you knew when to stop, you'd never achieve the impossible."

26-May-2015 07:21:23 - Last edited on 26-May-2015 07:23:52 by Alchimous

Jakir

Jakir

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Alchimous said :
Jakir said :
So it is my theory the Standard Spellbook would be more aptly named "The Unified Spellbook" as it is leftover from the Godwars presumably because Guthix kicked out most of the Gods with 0 notice and they never had a chance to split off.

This is demonstrability false. To quote Archmage Sedridor;
Original message details are unavailable.
The standard adventurer's spellbook and the teleport lodestones are both products of tower wizards' research.

This clearly shows that spellbooks are not the product of the gods, an imprint, or any other nonsense. It is made by wizards and there are other spell books in use by humans, even in the wizards' tower. We have no reason to believe it is different for any other spellbook, just that they are more limited in use due to the nature of their users.


Except the memory clearing mechanic, the memory giving mechanic, the fact all the other spellbooks are represented by Gods, and all the other things I listed in the thread if you bothered to read the supporting evidence.

Also I never said mortals couldn't develop spells, in fact that is how teleport spells were rediscovered. Given that loadstones are teleports it is possible they were added with the same ritual that added all the other teleports or in a properly performed version/alteration of a ritual to get in contact with one of the divine beings behind the unified spellbook to have it added.

On top of that as with the Plain of mud Goblin lore it is possible the source is simply stating what they have been told/their interpretation and that it is not 100% accurate. If loadstone magic was added with teleports as would be reasonable to assume until a confirmation otherwise then the knowledge of their origin would be just as obscured as that of the destruction of the tower. (And also the exact same which fits my theory perfectly)

I would appreciate less aggressive rebuttals btw.

29-May-2015 00:39:33 - Last edited on 29-May-2015 00:43:08 by Jakir

Jakir

Jakir

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@AttilaSquare Thanks for the responses! I honestly created this thread with the goal in mind of making it the Planar Theory of Anima except less ocd perfectly highlighted with key vocabulary and definitions. Instead I opted to be lazier and just use similes to explain things. :P

1) Now that you mention it this makes a lot of sense, especially considering the spell fatigue mentioned in the novels. I will edit that section shortly. I do believe they still carry some energy as they have been known to cause violent reactions but it is possible they function more as an imprint, like a portable altar except instead of imbuing Anima with the memory of a specific prayer/spell book they instead imbue your own Anima with a map of sorts for how to make specific elements of a spell. Also I want to add some stuff I forgot to include about Dragonkin, Arposandrians, and the Moonclan not needing runes.

2) I really wish I had more info about Sacred Mud. The best concept I can come up with is that it is like matter and when a crap ton of Anima condenses it changes from an incorporeal state to a corporeal one like a gas changing to a liquid.

3) I have not but I will add it to my list now. I actually watched a lecture on the origin of the universe that was hosted on youtube as research for this thread lol. Video id = 7ImvlS8PLIo

4) I'm mostly interested in this topic to find a method of making Gods mortal again because I'm a Godless follower and would rather not have anything that powerful lumbering around. What with the wars, involuntary mind control of mortals, risk of being killed by a bad guy and creating an evil super God.... ect; I just think we would be better off without Gods posing that risk but I would not kill an innocent God either so I really want there to be a way to just make them mortal again.

Side note: Also planning on using a reserve to talk about other universal mechanics like time travel and alternate timelines/parallel universes.

29-May-2015 01:13:47

AttilaSquare

AttilaSquare

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Hey, Wolfie!

I'm glad you liked my planar theory thread. I just posted a new thread , on topics very similar to this one! There is only a little overlap though, so I hope there's no stepping on each other's toes.

I like your thoughts on sacred clay. A gas > liquid transition works, but perhaps we could also draw conparisons with liquid > solid , plasma > gas ...or if we follow Einstein energy > matter transitions.

Another approach might be to look up 'hylomorphism' and the related ancient and medieval theories of matter. I think sacred clay is somewhat based on Aristotle's idea of prime matter .

Your idea of giving up godhood is intriguing. I may have some thoughts loosely related to this in the first appendix here . I'll give it some thought.

And I look forward to those topics in your reserves.

01-Jun-2015 16:33:11 - Last edited on 01-Jun-2015 22:24:36 by AttilaSquare

A Mighty

A Mighty

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Just finished reading, great thread!

The only thing I can really offer to this thread regards Demons and the number 8. I know there is something from a JMod that talks about the number 12 being that number for the demons. I think it had something to do with how many Demons there were on Infernus or something. From that piece of lore, it was inferred that the "Number of the Beast" in RS is 121212, although your evidence suggests it is 888, so there is a contradiction there :P
To those cursed by war and pest, Come into the light of Armadyl and rest. This is the law of Armadyl.

04-Jun-2015 16:09:28

Jakir

Jakir

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A Mighty said :
Just finished reading, great thread!

The only thing I can really offer to this thread regards Demons and the number 8. I know there is something from a JMod that talks about the number 12 being that number for the demons. I think it had something to do with how many Demons there were on Infernus or something. From that piece of lore, it was inferred that the "Number of the Beast" in RS is 121212, although your evidence suggests it is 888, so there is a contradiction there :P


Zaros did take 12 legions and the legions groupings are made up of multiples of 12 I believe but it appears for all the actual rituals and things they perform that 8 is used somehow and holds a lot of significance. The best answer I can give is maybe 8 it significant to magic rituals themselves and 12 is just a number demons like that has no magical properties to it. (At least that have become important/shown thus far)

06-Jun-2015 21:57:09

Ren_Derek

Ren_Derek

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Great thread, Wolfie! Loved the detail, especially on matters this esoteric. One thing to note on the nature of Bik is to recall what Zaros says of the Elder Gods. They can not see the future, which led to them not being able to predict all of the goings-on of Gielinor. This is what gives the Empty Lord his confidence in his ability to persuade or stop the Elders from wreaking havoc.

Would this affect Bik's ability to "change" time? And is he capable of moving back and forth through time at will anyway?

Otherwise, keep up the good work!
The Empty Lord awakens.

09-Jun-2015 18:05:38

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