RuneScape Forum Archive | Aftermath: Dead and Buried

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

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It really is not my fault when someone see a building and think it is always a house for a human family, especially when those broken pillars etc aren't remotely what we see in human houses anywhere in Gielinor.

If you can't take the words of a human Guildmaster, why can you take the words of a Dragonkin?

Err, Fort Forinthry, Necrmancy, Misthalin and the Age of Chaos all have their own storylines. Mod Jack drew out the picture (15:10):

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1876103239

He even used the example if Xua-Tak destroyed everything next January they wouldn't be a part of the Fort Forinthry or Misthalin storyline. It would be a new storyline in the Age of Chaos because that's why the impact of it would be.

25-Jul-2023 00:18:47 - Last edited on 25-Jul-2023 00:26:02 by Dilbert2001

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

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Glad you shared that timestamp. Now let me explain that graphic for you.

Fort Forinthry Season 1, Necromancy, and something called the "2024" season sit next to each other on the bottom row, with lines breaking them up.

"Misthalin Storyline" rests above the previous row, meaning that those three "seasons" comprise the Misthalin storyline. (That means that those stories are connected to fit underneath that storyline, even if they are different stories!)

The Misthalin Storyline is underneath "the Age of Chaos", which indicates that the Misthalin storyline is "a part of" the Age of Chaos.

---

In 2024, we move away from the First Necromancer and Necromancy and move toward the conclusion of the Misthalin storyline, which was started at Fort Forinthry and can now involve elements of Necromancy because the skill and its immediate background lore has been released. That's how Fort Forinthry, Necromancy, and whatever we encounter in 2024 fit together as the graphic indicates.

---

We also know that nomenclature used in that livestream is highly vague in order to avoid major spoilers. "Misthalin" could indicate any number of things, such as "this storyline involves the people of Misthalin", which would check out certainly for the Fort Forinthry season - but it isn't super binding.

We also know that the Age of Chaos probably will get another name as more stories have been told. For now, Mod Stu needed a placeholder in his quest sorting update and that's the one they gave him.

---

There had to be houses on Crandor. It was a major political and economic hub in the same vein as Falador and Varrock. Lots of people live in those other two locales.

We also know from various accounts that "many people" were killed by Elvarg on the island. I don't know what your holdup on Crandor is. It -was- a much larger place before Elvarg attacked. That's not up for debate.

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25-Jul-2023 00:35:22 - Last edited on 25-Jul-2023 00:37:37 by H 1 L D A

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

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Watch what Mod Jack said please. Xau-Tak destroying everything regardless it was in Fort Forinthry or Misthalin it would not be part of Fort Forinthry or Misthalin storyline.

The Misthalin Storyline will come AFTER the conclusion of Fort Forinthry (already ended) and Necromancy.

There is really no human living houses seen in Crandor, not even a fireplace. Miners and sailors as well as politicians and traders could be killed by Elvarg. Why not? There were there to take risk for mining profits, hence the politics. Elvarg is dead now, they don't even rebuild Crandor, not even for politics because we have better things to do for profits like Inventions and Archaeology and better places for politics like Fort Forinthry, so nobody cares to rebuild Crandor even Elvarg is dead.

25-Jul-2023 00:45:21

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

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The Fort Forinthry season -is- a part of the Misthalin Storyline. Those are not interchangeable. The Misthalin storyline encompasses Fort Forinthry, Necromancy, and the 2024 storyline. If they didn't, the graphic wouldn't look the way that it does.

It's already been established that people lived in Crandor in Old School RuneScape, and that the city was large enough to rival Varrock and Falador in importance, which would indicate life in RS3. It is simply not reasonable to argue for Crandor having everyone that works there commute from somewhere else. That's not what a civilization that doesn't have today's level of transit is capable of.

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25-Jul-2023 00:56:24 - Last edited on 25-Jul-2023 00:56:55 by H 1 L D A

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

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They explicitly used the Xau-Tak example to tell us the difference between locations and seasonal storylines. They call it the Misthalin Storyline because the story is about Misthalin. Otherwise, why won't have Storylines in other locations?

Your interpretation is also proven wrong when you see Misthalin Storyline above Necromancy Season. We know Necromancy starts in City of Um in Death's Underworld, and not Misthalin.

The Fort Forinthry Season just ended wasn't called the Wildyness Storyline for that reason because the story is specific to Forinthry.

It is not even a matter of OSRS or RS3 Crandor, don't take words out of context:

" Crandor was settled by humans at an unknown time...It eventually grew to become an influential city-state rivalling Varrock and Falador in

political importance

"

They are comparing Crandor to Falador and Varrock only in term of

political

importance, and that was only in unknown Age, probably well before 129 V and well, well before Dragon Slayer.

Aren't we commuting between Crandor and other places even in 2023? That tells you the story already. We don't live there. Our POH aren't there. .What's the problem?

25-Jul-2023 01:28:37 - Last edited on 25-Jul-2023 01:37:55 by Dilbert2001

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

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Again, they call it the "Misthalin" storyline because it doesn't betray the viewers to spoiler territory. The fact that it made it into the video means that it doesn't give people enough hints beyond what they already know (Jack explains how Misthalin, at that moment, really only lines up with Fort Forinthry content so far in the stream)

I am aware that Necromancy's storyline will focus primarily in the Underworld. Jack explains that Necromancy is a bit of an exceptional case on stream. It's very likely that even though it falls under the Misthalin storyline, not much from it, if any at all, will play out in the following 2024 storyline (although you can probably expect to see quests with Necromancy requirements, for starters - Zemouregal is a necromancer, and Vorkath will be an undead dragon someway, somehow.)

You conveniently forgot to highlight the word "grew" - you can't have a hovel on an island grow to political importance rivaling the seats of power in two kingdoms without population growth. Without population, you don't have political influence. That isn't how civilization as a whole works.

The player themselves traveling by boat doesn't explain any city's population being able to do the same thing. That's simply not reasonable. It's more likely that people lived on the island. We get confirmation that people did in Dragon Slayer II, as Dallas Jones' father was among the "many" deceased.

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25-Jul-2023 01:47:15

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

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The Necromancy Season is clearly not any part of the Misthalin Storyline. I don't doubt they will have a different name for it when it is released. Mod Jack called it Misthalin Storyline to show us it is about Misthalin, and not just happen in Misthalin. Age of Chaos being on top of the Misthalin Storyline in Mod Jack's picture clearly shows it is not based on location, but content of the story. I don't think I need to explain Age of Chaos is not a location like Misthalin or Fort Forinthry.

Political impact has nothing to do with "population". Don't forget only 3 wizards survived Crandor and now nobody lives there in 2023. So much for its impact and (negative) population growth. Everything is dead on the old Crandor Island, even after Elvarg is dead now and they still can't recover. We still have to commute there for different kinds of activities. I really don't see any impact of a dead Elvarg that its creator can't even remember, nor Crandor has anything to do with Fort Forinthry.

25-Jul-2023 01:59:45

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

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You can't have political operations that rival Falador or Varrock without having significant population. The meaning of "politics" literally is "the activities of governance of a country or other area."

Without people to govern, you can't govern at all, and population is a direct measure of political influence because of this. If Duke Horacio is saying that Crandor's government had the political influence to rival Falador or Varrock, he's saying that there was a very large population on Crandor that its government served.

On the contrary, politics has EVERYTHING to deal with population.

---

Again, Necromancy as a season is a bit of an exceptional case. It -is- in the Misthalin storyline by virtue of "our new skill is ready to be released now, so it has to come here"

Jack explains seasons are primarily important for marketing purposes, not for sorting content out. When Necromancy releases, the marketing arm around it will have a short period of time to established thematic Yak Tracks, for example, as well as advertising material, before moving on to the next season.

An example, of how flexible all of those labels are, that he gives is that he was asked by someone whether a piece of content (presumably a quest) that is to be released during the Necromancy season needs new assets as opposed to the same quest icon or being in a different area of the quest list from the Fort Forinthry storyline, and Jack told them "No."

While Necromancy season may not really at all be a part of the Misthalin storyline on its surface, it very well will have tie-ins. Again, the diagram he uses wouldn't look the way that it does otherwise.

"Because of the complexities of Necromancy, the Misthalin storyline needs to be flexible in how we think about it and where it goes."

- Mod Jack.

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25-Jul-2023 02:39:48 - Last edited on 25-Jul-2023 02:43:16 by H 1 L D A

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,176 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

"You can't have political operations that rival Falador or Varrock without having significant population"

This is just utterly untrue, otherwise we wouldn't have built Fort Forinthry from 0 population. Fort Forinthry was built on the most politically confronted land between Daemonheim and the Wildyness. People, both real life and virtual, always fight to control resources politically. Don't tell us the tiny Kuwait with less than 5 million people aren't politically more important than a lot of countries with populations of hundreds of millions of starving people living in failed economies. There were only 3 humans in old Crandor anyway, and now down to 0 permanent and just a few visitors once in a while. It is totally dead and not even have modern transportation like Lodestones, not even a fairy ring, let alone a POH.

Mod Jack clearly showed us with his picture and Xau-Tak example names of the storylines describe the impacts of the stories, not where the stories take place. Necromancy is not a location, neither is Age of Chaos. Don't tell us Age of Chaos, the highest tier of the storyline is not a good example.

EGW has tie-in with Varrock and therefore Misthalin too as Sentistlen lies there. Why is it the EGW storyline and not the Misthalin storyline? The answer is incredibly clear because the EGW storyline is about the Elder Godwars, not Misthalin. On the other hand, when Mod Jack told us about the Misthalin Storyline, he told us the next storyline, a new one, is about Misthalin, not just tie-in Misthalin like Sentistlen in EGW.

25-Jul-2023 02:59:16 - Last edited on 25-Jul-2023 03:15:39 by Dilbert2001

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

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Fort Forinthry is a great example, on the contrary, of multiplicative political influence gained by population. The grieving vale had a population of zero inhabitants at the start of New Foundations, and that number has grown nearly fifteen-fold (which would be astronomical population gain if we weren't starting with a number like zero). We now have a lumber and ranged equipment industry. Our walls are fortified and secured. There's religious institutional presence and even a couple of local government buildings. Those wouldn't hold any value without added personnel.

If Crandor had Kuwait's 5m+ population, and Elvarg killed almost everyone, that would be an insanely catastrophic death-wave. There's a decent chance Queen Ellamaria's parents could be counted among a number that large. Whether or not Kuwait has a more "effective" government doesn't account for size, but efficiency and attention to detail. Improvements to how those larger countries manage their hunger levels, along with other public services such as defense, crime prevention, and education, would quickly cause their political influence to overshadow Kuwait's. And I will go ahead and tell you, bad political influence can still be greater in larger nations than smaller nations with good political influence.

Claiming that Crandor's largest-ever population threshold is 3 just because that's how many "known" NPCs were from the island is a laughable hand-waiving of holding intellectual bearing on this conversation. According to you, if the NPC wasn't known, they didn't exist. That means that Lumford's population is 1, as we only know of the Duchess who oversees it. Absurd, no?

Mod Jack was incredibly cagey about what content you can expect to see from any future "seasons", because he didn't want to give spoilers at that moment. He did however, go out of his way to point to flexibility, whether you liked it or not.

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25-Jul-2023 04:00:37

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Aftermath: Dead and Buried