RuneScape Forum Archive | Aftermath: Dead and Buried

Apr

2022

Tomato 56789

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Dilbert you really need to read RS lore before arguing on forums, it's at a point now where I am convinced you are just a troll considering how passionately you argue completely inaccurate information. Many of your claims are debunked within the first few sentences on the RS wiki pages on the subjects.

Casual legacy trash of 19 years in RS, author of 6 books irl

25-Jul-2023 07:53:43

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

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The Fort Forinthry season was clearly described as political and diplomatic before New Foundation. The Misthalin Storyline will likely continue with this political and diplomatic theme, only on a larger scale with Adrasteia and Moia involved.

Population and political influence are all relative. A country with a 5 mil population is really small when comparing to others with hundreds of millions of population. There is absolutely no lore on the population of Crandor. We only know there are only 3 humans from it left, and we can see actual ones living on the Crandor now are all bots programmed to attack the players with no lore. We always see a lot (comparatively) of such bots everywhere like in the Varrock Sewer too, but they are bots with no lore and not "population" of Varrock.

Mod Jack actually have given us nice previews of future story updates. When they told us about the "Misthalin Storyline" and "Age of Chaos Storyline", they pretty much told us they upcoming Storylines are themed around Misthalin and the Age of Chaos. Dead and Buried has clearly positioned toward the upcoming changes in the Kingdom of Misthalin, with hints on the fate of the royal couple, and Lumford on the background picture. The Necromancy seasion will bring us to the biggest Age chaning threats ever, according to the First Necromancer - the everliving First Age "shadow".

25-Jul-2023 16:47:44

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

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There absolutely is lore regarding Crandor.

40 years ago (30 to the start of the player’s journey in 169 of the Fifth Age, 10 more to present day.) Crandor was a highly influential city-state that rivaled the seats of power in the mainland, unknowingly built over the slumbering Elvarg, who was created during the Fourth Age Dragonkin conflicts.

A hapless adventurer comes across the dragon, and fails to slay her, which causes a highly unusual rampage. Elvarg, oddly a solitary creature, also strangely leaves her den and attacks the city above, razing it to the ground. She then tails a caravan to the mainland and destroys their camp, leaving only three - out of “many” - alive. She then returns to her den and goes back to sleep, as word reaches Misthalin of her terrifying might.

Saying Crandor is without lore is objectively false.

—

All I’m suggesting, in lore that has yet to be revealed, is that Queen Ellamaria’s “Batman” arc begins by identifying the cause of her parents’ deaths and her home catching ablaze is Elvarg, which makes the Raptor arc make more sense, and motivates her own desire to become the equivalent of a Slayer Master in skill.

> As a middle-aged woman, Ellamaria’s age can reasonably place her on Crandor.

> We’ve only seen Ellamaria’s childhood home in her nightmares. There is no proof of the house being located any particular place. She’s also noticeably absent from 160 of the 5th Age’s Varrock Census, and has a statue in the Warrior’s Guild in a kingdom she isn’t affiliated with.

> Her home was burned down. There’s no explanation for how this fire occurred.

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- July 31st, 2022

25-Jul-2023 19:44:05

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

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Please read my post again x 9000:

"There is absolutely

no lore on the population of Crandor

."

Please don't misquote me on "lore of Crandor".

There is absolutely no lore of Ellamaria in Crandor. There is absolutely no lore on her age either. We know her parents were killed in a house fire and they lived in Varrock. There is absolutely no reference to dragon or Crandor. We also knew from like 20 years ago only 3 humans from Crandor survived Elvarg and fleed to Asgardia, not any one of the 3 is known to be Ellamaria.

25-Jul-2023 20:38:51

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

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No, I read it right the first time, because regardless of whether you mean Crandor or its former population you’re still being dishonest.

> Duke Horacio is the one who tells us about how much of a thriving location Crandor used to be.

> Dallas Jones tells us his father was one of “many” Crandorian citizens to have been killed by Elvarg.

> Thalzar claimed that Elvarg had ‘devoured’ his family in the letter found with his map piece.

> Wormbrain claims he saw ‘an island with people’ in pictures found in Lozar’s home when he took her map piece.

—

I won’t treat you the way you treat me. You do have a legitimate source in the Champion’s Guild guild master who claims the three wizards are the only survivors from the attack.

There are issues there.

> The Guildmaster isn’t a “primary” source. The closest he gets to proving he is - is knowing that the recently deceased Lozar lived in Lumbridge.

> The Guildmaster may have been sticking to relevant information in order to help the player. The map that the three wizards split up was a better lead than trying to find unknown survivors, so he sends us in that direction.

> The Guildmaster is enough removed to genuinely not know if there were other survivors.

… and we know of course, that Queen Ellamaria is a bit secretive. I have no doubts that the Raptor probably qualified for the Champion’s Guild and could very well be the source of what the Guildmaster knows, omitting her escape intentionally.

—

How do you know Ellamaria’s parents lived in Varrock?

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- July 31st, 2022

25-Jul-2023 23:35:54

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

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In fact. We -know- the Raptor has access to the Guildmaster because he is a known member of the Legend’s Guild, and the previous two adventuring guild’s memberships are required to start Legend’s Quest.

It is -shocking- what being the Raptor allows Ellamaria access to do, and whatever story they want to be involved in, without betraying her identity or backstory.

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- July 31st, 2022

25-Jul-2023 23:49:14

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

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"No, I read it right the first time, because regardless of whether you mean Crandor or its former population you’re still being dishonest."

I quoted all the lore we can see in the game, as well as the RS Wiki. Nowhere did it say anything about "population" of Crandor. If you think it is "dishonest" or not up to date, you can go correct it please.

You used the Champion Guild as a reference on one hand, and on the other hand you told us the very same Champion Guild is incorrect when they said only 3 humans from Crandor survived. I don't know who is dishonest.

Where in the lore do we see we had to be living in Crandor before Dragon Slayer to be in the Champion Guild? No players can enter the Champion Guild if this is the requirement as none of us have started playing the game before the Adventure quoted in Dragon Slayer obtained the Crandor map.

26-Jul-2023 15:37:08

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

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That’s funny, because that’s what I have been doing (and I’ve been leaving sources each time) and then you sit there and dismiss it with meaningless excuses like “That’s talking about so and so’s lore not that SAME so and so’s population!” as if a city and her people weren’t being talked about in said quote. It’s not my fault you believe Duke Horacio, Dallas Jones, Thalzar, and Wormbrain to be liars.

It’s either that, or you lied above - and you are not seeing all the lore about Crandor in the game. Which is what I think is 100% more likely. Others in this thread have accused you of it.

—

I’ve always affirmed that the Guildmaster says there is only three survivors. My believing that he lacks information, didn’t reveal more due to the lack of relevance it had at the time or its probability to help the player, or was instructed not to doesn’t make him a nonexistent voice. He’s there - and that means what he has to say needs to be discussed.

This is where the conversation is *supposed* to be fun, Dilbert. An example of an in game NPC you trusted once withholding information? Guthix! According to the First Necromancer anyway. That’s a very cool, kinda long-standing faith that a new NPC is challenging.

Would it really be so crazy to think the same couldn’t happen here? For decades, players may have had no idea someone else made it off that island - and then someone very important comes forward with the possibility that they have all this time! C’mon. Players don’t need to be privy to all the details in the first Dragon Slayer quest.

—

I sure as heck didn’t say being a citizen of Crandor is a requirement to join the Champion’s Guild. All I was alluding to above is that the queen assuredly has access to the guild herself - and she could tell the Guildmaster she’s from Crandor and that the information isn’t to leave their conversation in order to protect her identity.

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Maxed

- July 31st, 2022

26-Jul-2023 20:51:18

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,176 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

That's funny! What you quoted from Dragon Slayer and such were just Crandor was once more active before the first adventurer with the map piece saw Elvarg. There is no information whatsoever how many people were there, let alone POPLULATION, which means people who actually lived there with a house. And don't you realize the NPCs talked about more than 30 years ago, and before any players has started playing the game?

You know what makes a "conversation" fun? It is not when one takes some of the words from an NPC and treat them as teachings from the Bible, and at the same time call everything from the same NPC that dismiss their claim as "incorrect".

Nobody knew about Ellamaria is the Raptor before Dead and Buried, and only the player knew it now after the quest. The Guildmaster absolutely didn't know it.

"Mentioned this elsewhere - the Raptor's persona remains He/Him just like it was before. They haven't revealed their true identity to anyone else and are maintaining their persona.

Only you know differently from the Quest and we also don't want to spoil the Quest for anyone who hasn't gotten to it yet."

https://www.reddit.com/r/runescape/comments/15867dv/comment/jt8e1z4/?context=3

26-Jul-2023 21:37:35 - Last edited on 26-Jul-2023 21:41:37 by Dilbert2001

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

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It’s not reasonable to assume people didn’t live on Crandor if it had the same political and merchantile value as Varrock or Falador, which stand as some of the largest cities in RuneScape. I don’t need the exact numbers. There is no possible way to argue that Crandor was always little more than a hovel. We have testimony that suggests many people lived there from more than one NPC. I may not have figures for you, but I’m not arguing without reason here. There is a very strong possibility -many- homes were destroyed. That leaves the possibility that Ellamaria’s childhood home was among them.

—

Where did I do that? The Guildmaster? I’ve called into doubt the statement that only three people survived from the start. That doesn’t mean the guy only tells lies. His information on the map pieces was solid. That doesn’t mean he only tells the truth or is omniscient. People can be right about some things and wrong about others. It happens all the time.

—

You’re gonna complain about me referring to the Raptor as Ellamaria on page 10 of this thread? We. Are. The players. We know the twist already. If a reader has made it to page 10 of this thread it’s on them for spoiling themselves.

It doesn’t make a difference if the Raptor or the Queen tells the Guildmaster they are from Crandor. Both are very imposing people. The Guildmaster would comply with any request made.

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26-Jul-2023 22:00:33

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Aftermath: Dead and Buried