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Anti-skiller tax

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Ruby_Red0
Jun Member 2022

Ruby_Red0

Posts: 188 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Kitten,

I dont Boss. Not that Im not interested, but I feel like I need to max to be of any use to a team. I do die, and incurr degraded armour and weapon repairs. My items arent the best, but they are good enough to cost me to use.

Slayer is a skill that anyone going for a Max Cape has to do. Its PvM that applies to everyone.
There are also Quests where you have to kill monsters, so thats another group of PvM that applies to everyone.

I alched as a low level - not for gps, as almost every item is more valuable to sell - to get to a certain mage level, and after that low mage level that escapes me right now, to continue to alch is not your best way to level. So I really havent alched since then. Most trash gets disassembled for Invention.

No one who bangs on a tree or rock for a living is going to be alching their logs or ores.
No fishermen will be alching their fish.
No runecrafter will be alching their runes.

My point is - who alchs? I dont see many players alching at all, but I know who I see alching at the GE when it happens. Who does everyone else see?

I dont know who aside from Iron- people sell to NPCs. I have never, not even as a little noobcake, sold to NPCs.

If Im to be called a skiller, then rest assured I also die and have my items degrade.

I'm leveling Slayer now and just completed killing 208 Spiritual Mages in the GWD. Aside from some decent (not great, but okay 288 to max 7.5K decent) coin drops, the drops were laughable and the vast majority were disassembled. Banging on an Elder tree would have been a more profitable use of time.

Second point - you do not have to be bossing to pay repair bills. Everyone in the game with I believe higher than rune armour pays repair bills.

I got all dressed up in Pernix and Ascension crossbows to do my task, which is also laughable. Now, I get to go pay to repair it all. If I go thee again, Ill be wearing my Trials armour. Everyone in the game has costs relative to what they do.
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RS3: The game where RWTers are more important than Real Live Players

20-Jan-2023 02:11:09

Mel 624
Dec Member 2021

Mel 624

Posts: 744 Steel Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@Kitten the problem with treating alchemy as entirely separate from PvM in the stats is that you have to look at where the alched materials are coming from. How much of that is PvM drops like salvage? Is it fair to exclude that from PvM gold generation just because it's one step removed? Should it be judged based on the source of the alched item or the person doing the alching? As I said, most people alch their own drops, especially with the spring cleaner and alchemy machine to automate the process. Selling it tends to be more tedious or less profitable. I also wouldn't count shop sales as part of the alching stats but rather its own catergory.

As Ruby pointed out, if skillers are alching things it's unlikely to be something they got through skilling. Even if direct PvM gold drops are only 12%, they're also a major source of salvage and other alched drops that are being excluded from that percentage. To claim they're only responsible for 12% of the gold when fully accounting for alch sources just wouldn't be accurate. We'd need more detailed calculations on who's alching/store selling what, if they generated it themselves or bought it from another player, what content generated the item, etc. Ironman would also have to be taken into account in these stats due to their inability to trade with other players.
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20-Jan-2023 02:44:40

Ruby_Red0
Jun Member 2022

Ruby_Red0

Posts: 188 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Mel 624 said :
Ironman would also have to be taken into account in these stats due to their inability to trade with other players.




There do seem to be quite a few
Ironman
accounts, and I would imagine they might alch as well as sell to NPCs.

Is it possible the Ironman community accounts for what is being viewed as a problem?


Im not casting the shadow of blame on them. Its just the methods they were given to survive ingame.

Maybe something like adjusting the prices NPCs pay to make them competitive to what a player receives from alching would be helpful, as well as figuring out a coin sink specific to those accounts.


@Kitten
- Thanks for sharing your knowledge on the topic.

@everyone else
- its clear the topic is drawing some attention, and hopefully it receives the kind of attention it deserves from those that can do something to correct this issue.


People need to grab a nice cuppa and keep discussing.
New(ish) Player
:
This is YOUR world, and I'm just a squirrel tryin' to get a nut.
;)
RS3: The game where RWTers are more important than Real Live Players

20-Jan-2023 11:31:01 - Last edited on 20-Jan-2023 12:11:06 by Ruby_Red0

Fish Kitten
Sep Member 2013

Fish Kitten

Posts: 1,199 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Mel 624 said :
@Kitten the problem with treating alchemy as entirely separate from PvM in the stats is that you have to look at where the alched materials are coming from. How much of that is PvM drops like salvage? Is it fair to exclude that from PvM gold generation just because it's one step removed? Should it be judged based on the source of the alched item or the person doing the alching? As I said, most people alch their own drops, especially with the spring cleaner and alchemy machine to automate the process.


Don't get me wrong, the catch-all "alchemy" category deserved further elaboration. Maybe for technical reasons Jagex couldn't sort out the details but I agree it would be great to see the source of the alchable materials in more detail. But even if all alchable material comes from PVM (which it doesn't), the fact remains that the prior system disproportionately burdened PVM as the sole gold sink. I was responding to the notion that things aren't fair now with the update, but were prior. The facts don't support that at all. Deaths carried all the weight of purging GP from the economy.

Original message details are unavailable.
I also wouldn't count shop sales as part of the alching stats but rather its own catergory.


What I meant was, those items are locked at low alch value so the net result is the same; they're both a fixed value. Selling something to a store means the game generates GP from thin air. The intent of the update was to trim that figure overall. And 21% of 88B gp/day isn't peanuts.

21-Jan-2023 23:35:01 - Last edited on 21-Jan-2023 23:50:39 by Fish Kitten

Fish Kitten
Sep Member 2013

Fish Kitten

Posts: 1,199 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ruby_Red0 said :
Maybe something like adjusting the prices NPCs pay to make them competitive to what a player receives from alching would be helpful, as well as figuring out a coin sink specific to those accounts.


Changing the sell-to-store price NPCs pay for things wouldn't move the needle on anything because gold is still being generated from thin air. That's what inflation is in a nutshell.

Construction was the original attempt at a serious gold sink. Construction is a 15 year old skill. That said, this is the first time in nearly forever Jagex has attempted to address all the gold being injected into the game on a daily basis. This is years behind schedule imo.

The big takeaway from all this should be that high value drops from PVM aren't what's contributing to this decades old runaway inflation. There's other things Jagex could do to tweak the game economy for the better, and restore some of that lost value to GP, but that's a different topic. The best way to view where the pressure is being exerted on the economy is from the top down (i.e. the fake rare items).

21-Jan-2023 23:45:38 - Last edited on 21-Jan-2023 23:49:17 by Fish Kitten

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