RuneScape Forum Archive | Probation/Cooldown Suggestions

Mod Matthe

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user

antsuOnHead&lookup=view">PantsuOnHead

I don't understand how this is not technically feasible. How else do you add requirements to anything? You're already adding a check to clan-exclusive content to see if someone is actually part of a clan...

Hi PantsuOnHead ,

As I understand it those pieces of content already have existing checks in place - we would have to add different checks to all those pieces of content and there will be technical and testing difficulties in doing so in some cases, but it will be Mod Maz who is the expert on those bits and she will not be able to comment until the morning

29-Jan-2015 17:03:43

Steel Dragon

Posts: 1,271 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

PantsuOnHead said :
I don't understand how this is not technically feasible. How else do you add requirements to anything? You're already adding a check to clan-exclusive content to see if someone is actually part of a clan...

Exactly, most of the code is already there. It it just something they say when they don't want to consider it as an option.

Real life Steel Dragon

| @Marks_Rs

29-Jan-2015 17:04:36

Mod Matthe

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user

Steel Dragon

[ post link ]

PantsuOnHead said :
I don't understand how this is not technically feasible. How else do you add requirements to anything? You're already adding a check to clan-exclusive content to see if someone is actually part of a clan...

Exactly, most of the code is already there. It it just something they say when they don't want to consider it as an option.

Hi Steel Dragon ,

No. There is never a point we don't want to consider an option in that way - but RuneScape operates in a very tight data environment and builds on 14 years plus of coding. This means that while standard coding practices might suggest certain solutions we have to be very careful about what we do and how we do it.

Copy and paste really is not a thing.

29-Jan-2015 17:11:12

DrBrokenBow

Posts: 7,265 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Firstly, I just want to point out why these are wrong and then I'll add my suggestion at the bottom.
These are the issues you highlighted which were "problems" to us before:

Mod Matthe said :
1) The delay on new Clan Members being able to function as a full member of the Clan ie Citadel skilling.
Many clans don't actually focus on citadel, in fact very few have a strict "Must cap" rule. The rest will do it as a side thing, for clanmates to do if they want. So this was never a large issue anyway.

Mod Matthe said :
2) The ability of individuals to leave one Clan and take part in activities, including the Clan Cup, as a member of another Clan straight away. There was a significant issue with this during the Clan Cup and led to disqualifications.

Well, as similar to citadels, very few in the mass amount of clans concentrate on this. I understand that cheaters need to be stopped, but this isn't a way of doing it. This is just as easy as it is before if they prepare in advance.

Mod Matthe said :
3) That "Clan Hoppers" caused significant concern to a number of Clans and were something we wanted to address.

They could be a slight problem, but if clan leaders/admin were taking care of the new recruits (and older ones) they would warn others to not give items to others on loan, ever. Anything traded is final and is the fault of the two traders that it happens. Also, joining and leaving could be a result of them not liking the clan.

Suggestions on improvement.
Firstly I'll say the old system is better, so something similar to that one.
As mentioned, a way of doing it is that they are "queued" to join, and once they can join they are automatically added. But why have this if you could just join immediately?
A "global" citadel cap that resets same time each week for everyone (not recommended though)

-Cont- MrBrokenBow - Former Leader and Founder of

Rebel Rising

Maxed on the 9th July 2017!

29-Jan-2015 17:14:34

DrBrokenBow

Posts: 7,265 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

To be able to join a clan anytime after leaving your previous one, but there is a 7 day cooldown overall on the citadel. ex. Someone leaves their clan, on day 3 they join another. They still have 4 days until citadel. This keeps the 7 days, but allows people to join clans.
Clan Cup - well, there's no way to stop these other than add this current system, albeit temporarily, on clans during the clan cup (if it's not too long) or, if possible, add it to the participating clans only (can't join a clan that's participating in clan cup until 7 days have passed since you left your previous, regardless of if previous was in the CC or not).

Also I'm confused with your point 2 that it must stick to
Mod Matthe said :
To ensure there is at least one weeks delay on receiving Clan benefits when swapping Clans. eg Avatar buffs
Because (until this new system) I believed that you could feed an avatar once you had 300 orts, which is minimum 2 days after joining a new clan?

Now I'll say now that I've taken ideas from our previous thread (which, imo, was unfairly locked because it had that debate which was nice) and a few other threads. I would link original owners, but I honestly don't know them all, so I can't do that.

I'm sure I'll think of more ideas, however, because this new system is god-awful and needs changing. MrBrokenBow - Former Leader and Founder of

Rebel Rising

Maxed on the 9th July 2017!

29-Jan-2015 17:14:39 - Last edited on 29-Jan-2015 17:19:54 by DrBrokenBow

Mar

2018

Scret

Posts: 25,434 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I liked the idea that someone posted in my recruiting thread on CLF here about a probation rank.

Is it not possible to create a brand new rank, probation rank which is active in all clans and incorporates the cool down system they remain on this til their probation is gone and then they move onto recruit. Probation rank cant be changed or utilised in any way like the other ranks can.

So essentially they would still be part of the clan, able to be in the chat (without having to be a guest) yet still have the same probationary measures on them.

Also 100% enjoying the clan merger tool and D&D timer to citadel resets, top ideas.

`*•.¸(*•.¸(`*•.¸+¸.•*´)¸.•*)¸.•*´
+«´¨`•°

SKILL SCHOOL

•´¨`»+
. .•*(¸.•*´(¸.•*´+`*•.¸)`*•.¸)*•.

29-Jan-2015 17:19:02 - Last edited on 29-Jan-2015 17:29:32 by Scret

Mod Moltare

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user

Mod Matthe said :

antsuOnHead&lookup=view">PantsuOnHead

[ post link ]

I don't understand how this is not technically feasible. How else do you add requirements to anything? You're already adding a check to clan-exclusive content to see if someone is actually part of a clan...

Hi PantsuOnHead ,

As I understand it those pieces of content already have existing checks in place - we would have to add different checks to all those pieces of content and there will be technical and testing difficulties in doing so in some cases, but it will be Mod Maz who is the expert on those bits and she will not be able to comment until the morning

Mod MattHe
Community Development
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(In this case the difficulty arises as follows:

Yes, there's checks existing for "This Clan Member Is On Probation" in the code.
However, it's stored in their clan profile using clan data and clan-specific engine commands.
Under the new mode I've seen suggested, they can be on their 7-day cooldown while not a member of a clan.
While not a member of a clan they have no access to their clan data (on account of not having a clan to have data for) and therefore the clan-specific engine commands are not of use.
Therefore we can't reuse any of the existing probation code.
Similarly, clan probation code as it stood was centralised such that it could be referenced in other content that used clan-specific commands - like the citadel. We'd need, to get use out of your proposed system, to include checks for things like Clan Wars... and Clan Wars is not clan-specific content, was written before clan-specific code existed, and doesn't have that framework available.
Therefore the architecture of the existing probation code wouldn't be much use either.
We could store clan cooldown information on the player - although that would defy the extant convention of storing clan information within clan data, it would be justifiable in this case with some fast talking - but we'd need to reference that through a new check added to each individual piece of relevant content and then test every bit of content we've added it to.

That's not the trivial job some believe it is. Joys of working with a legacy codebase, I'm afraid - there are some very obvious and simple solutions that become a nightmare when you have to factor around what would take significant time investment to rework.)

29-Jan-2015 17:25:27

Steel Dragon

Posts: 1,271 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

@Mod Matthe

"No. There is never a point we don't want to consider an option in that way - but RuneScape operates in a very tight data environment and builds on 14 years plus of coding. This means that while standard coding practices might suggest certain solutions we have to be very careful about what we do and how we do it.

Copy and paste really is not a thing."

I didn't mention a copy and paste but surely the code is there for you to implement these suggested improvements. Even if that does mean altering to code slightly.

Real life Steel Dragon

| @Marks_Rs

29-Jan-2015 17:26:00

Mod Matthe

Jagex Moderator Forum Profile Posts by user

Steel Dragon

[ post link ]

@Mod Matthe

"No. There is never a point we don't want to consider an option in that way - but RuneScape operates in a very tight data environment and builds on 14 years plus of coding. This means that while standard coding practices might suggest certain solutions we have to be very careful about what we do and how we do it.

Copy and paste really is not a thing."

I didn't mention a copy and paste but surely the code is there for you to implement these suggested improvements. Even if that does mean altering to code slightly.

Hi Steel Dragon ,

Please see Mod Moltare's explanation above

29-Jan-2015 17:29:38

Oct

2007

Old Nairb

Posts: 3,980 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

@Mod Matthe / Mod Moltare / Mod Maz

So something or anything in my suggestion (on page 2) wouldn't be possible under the current code limits (that I somewhat understand)? Under the now new system of probation, its clear that for the people who leave a clan, they shouldn't be able to participate in any official clan activities for 7 days, for the first 3 reasons for requirements you explained at the beginning. But that also restricts some of the social aspects of being in a clan I think and is one of the problems that could/should be solved.

I know from experience and many others I have talked to, said that people "treat" guests in clans much differently than regular ranked people. Just saying or seeing that you are apart of an organization or a group, makes a whole difference in attitude and tone.

If my idea isn't feasible, then that's ok

, I'll try to come up with another idea/concept to solve the problem hopefully

•--- Old Nairb
the Ultimate Quester
---•

29-Jan-2015 18:06:48

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Probation/Cooldown Suggestions