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Inactive Clan Owners Thread is locked

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Tigergal44

Tigergal44

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Oaky drunkenness seems an excellent way to sort out all the conflicting opinions on this one!

I definitely support the idea.

It has been suggested that there is a toggle on or off facility that the Leader ticks if they can be replaced this way - I say no to this. If they do not bother to log into the game but still hold ownership then it is for one of 2 reasons. Either they don't care about their clan or more commonly the clan is theirs (not the poor clan mates) and no one else can have it. They still get some personal satisfaction by owning a clan, being the boss, even though they are not there - in both cases they are not going to bother to tick that box.

I am not in favour of the clan voting to replace the leader either. If this comes in it should be cut and dried with no ambiguity - sign in, look after your clan, play the game or lose leadership. Those that rely on reports from admin teams and manage from afar with no intention of being hands on again - why?

Please not a kick from the clan. If inactives are in clan or not is up to us. I would suggest an automatic demotion to the highest non admin role. If the clan leader is going to be absent legitimately for an extended period (illness, study, OE) then they will just have to hand over the reigns to another temporarily, after all we have a responsibility to those in our clans to actually manage the clan for the advantage of all not to own it.

03-Dec-2013 17:56:23

Choobokka

Choobokka

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For perm ban, removal would make sense.
For 3 months inactivity, should allow a senior rank the ability to demote owner to deputy owner.

Our clan has 3 deputy owners. Not sure how/who picks the replacement. Ideally, owner would be able to tag a "senior deputy" who would have the ability to demote owner to deputy and take owner role. And they could leave owner alone if it was a planned absence.

Don't know if that's remotely workable, but support the idea of automating deputy's ability to make the change, but not automating the change itself.

03-Dec-2013 18:04:08

iMatzz
Jan Member 2023

iMatzz

Posts: 455 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@ Mod Matthe
Ah I see! Well, about that I don't think there's a lot to discuss. If a leader is inactive that means he cannot take care of his clan anymore so either another high rank person takes the lead (warlord/council/whoever is capable of leading) or people quit for another clan. To be honest I never had any problem like that before, be it in international clans like Corruption, warring Team like Supremacy/TKO Blitz, or my clans - if a ranked person went inactive we simply called our mobiles/contacted him via msn/forums/facebook. I don't know about "in-game made" clans. And about cc managining - few people should be able to have main admin powers, so they can remove inactive leader. I don't know, maybe this feature is already in game. :)

03-Dec-2013 18:05:36 - Last edited on 03-Dec-2013 18:08:31 by iMatzz

Grey Inc
Jan Member 2012

Grey Inc

Posts: 716 Steel Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I like this idea, an inactive leader can't lead a clan so if a clan leader doesn't login for an x amount of days then he/she should be demoted, not kicked since many people value their clan xp, all progress is lost, orts and so on. The new owner can always kick or derank the ex-leader anyways.
I also agree on a removal when the owner gets perm banned.

Just like MsSantaPawsy said, the amount of days before someone's considered can make or break this. If it's too short it will annoy people but if it's too long and the ownership rank gets tranfered to another inactive deputy then it can lead to a lot of trouble..

I also like the idea of having a "senior rank"
Choobokka said :

Don't know if that's remotely workable, but support the idea of automating deputy's ability to make the change, but not automating the change itself.

A lot of things to think about and discuss :)

03-Dec-2013 18:10:14

Esploratore
Apr Member 2006

Esploratore

Posts: 1,675 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
No support for an automated system to remove inactive clan leaders. The time to develop this would be better used in other clan-related areas.

Clans take so much work to build up and the thought of some automated system determining a clan's fate just doesn't seem right.

If JaGex can't work with the clans that have an inactive owner on an ad hoc basis, they shouldn't intervene at all, imo.

03-Dec-2013 18:15:59

lndi
Mar Member 2008

lndi

Posts: 4,669 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I feel there should be some process in place to remedy a situation where a clan leader goes MIA however I do not support an automated process.

There are too many variables that the automated system would not be able to determine. Also an automated process of picking the next leader without the input of the clan could cause problems within the clan.

IMO having a process in place where a clan can apply to have the situation remedied, with stringent criteria in place would be a better way to go.

03-Dec-2013 18:47:23

Warlock
Jan Member 2005

Warlock

Posts: 4,899 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I would be in favour of this if it were optional, and the 'leader' was demoted, rather than removed from the clan.

For example, A is a clan leader. B is a deputy leader.

A doesn't log in for six months (the amount of time your GE offers cancel themselves after - seems like a good period of time to me).

B is then (after six months) given the option to become leader and A becomes deputy leader (or a new 'ex-leader' rank), meaning that if A were to return at some point, they wouldn't have lost all of their orts/ability to contribute to the citadel/clan hiscore xp gains/etc.

If B (as the new leader) wished to remove A from the clan, they would have that power once they became the leader, but it wouldn't be forced upon them.

If B wished to remain as deputy leader, despite A being inactive, nothing would change except for an option in clan settings that would allow them to assume ownership at any time, should they wish.

Obviously, if A returned, this option would be removed. The timer would also be reset if A were to log in.

Also, while we're on the topic, can we get a way for a leader to voluntarily step aside without having to leave the clan?

03-Dec-2013 18:50:52

Shadesidhe
Feb Member 2009

Shadesidhe

Posts: 2,265 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
There is a lot to think about here. I have heard several people state that they cannot move their clan forward, get seconds recommended for here and various other things because their leader has simply disappeared. And not all of us have real life contact with these folks. In our clan it is basically skype and if the person doesn't answer, there is no other option.

I believe an automated system to give the deputy-owner (or next highest rank, how ever that works out) the option to take leadership would be a good one. This would allow the clan to continue to grow (stagnation means death to most anything).

I do have a concern though. If a clan leader has stepped back and only runs a clan through other officers in the clan and does nothing in game or in forums, and if this clan leader were demoted, they could potentially become vindictive and create all kinds of havoc in the clan if they remain admin.

I'm not sure how rogue admins are handled outside of a clan trying to do damage control, but would think if the clan leader could not be contacted, or refused to respond, but still knows what is going on, this could become a mess in a matter of a few minutes to 1/2 hour.

I'm not sure if this is clear or not. As always, if not please ask me to clarify. But mostly I support this.
Shadesidhe - Deputy Owner of
Blue Phoenix

03-Dec-2013 19:05:35

Zyphix
Sep Member 2010

Zyphix

Posts: 3,919 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Amryine said :
Demote the inactive leader after sai leader fails to log into the game for 45 calendar days, IMO.
6 Months, no less, no more.

Blair said :
Kicking seems a little harsh seeing as they are the Clan Owner, maybe demote to something like deputy leader instead? ;)

Also, how will the automated system pick the new Leader? :O
The first Co-Owner should be promoted by seniority.

Esploratore said :
No support for an automated system to remove inactive clan leaders. The time to develop this would be better used in other clan-related areas.

Clans take so much work to build up and the thought of some automated system determining a clan's fate just doesn't seem right.

If JaGex can't work with the clans that have an inactive owner on an ad hoc basis, they shouldn't intervene at all, imo.
I fully agree with this sentiment however. Instead of demoting or removing anyone though, just putting the original owner(s) on the fly (a list of "senior owners&quot ;) would suffice. When one returned, they would be able to be instantly re-instated. Depending how "high up", all the way to the original Owner, would be able to resume command over somebody added to the "senior" list based on tenure of the Co-Owner, then Deputy Owner spots. If there are NO players remaining in either of those lists, the clan should be considered disbanded, and removed from the game.

That's the best scenario I can come up with right now. It's fair, if you feel you MUST have a system. I don't think it's anyone's place however to do this. I just think there needs to be a BETTER idea conceived to remove inactive clans.
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Void Nation
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03-Dec-2013 19:17:49

Zyphix
Sep Member 2010

Zyphix

Posts: 3,919 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
*It may be worth looking into:

Have the game's automated system check the Clan Chats for activity. If there's less than three people in the Clans Chat over the course of six months at any given time, it's definitely safe to say the clan is inactive. Perhaps a tether of the system to the Clan Chat would work, to gauge activity of the clan overall - as the clan's activity is non-exclusive to that of its owner(s).
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Void Nation
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20+ Veteran
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03-Dec-2013 19:20:53

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