RuneScape Forum Archive | Penguin & Ghost Clues

Nov

2017

GhostPenguin

Posts: 5,828 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

10) Southern border of "where fishers colonise" clue (towards the south of Needle Skips) confirmed

I zapped the ghost whilst it was on the water east and a bit south of the Needle Skip docks just at the right moment. It activated a beyond detection hint. The scanner suggests the ghost was 8 steps south (from a particular tile I was standing on), which I have determined to be 14 degrees, 31 minutes north tile, after tracking rows further east on more expansive land.

Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEeRWOZNnio

North/south rows:

14 degrees, 46 minutes north (the tile I was standing on in the video)
14 degrees, 45 minutes north
14 degrees, 43 minutes north
14 degrees, 41 minutes north
14 degrees, 39 minutes north
14 degrees, 37 minutes north
14 degrees, 35 minutes north
14 degrees, 33 minutes north (southern most point on docks)
14 degrees, 31 minutes north (where ghost was on water according to scanner after tracing number of steps)

As noted above, the southern most accessible row on the docks is 14 degrees, 33 minutes north, which, after bringing another separate penguin there to test, activates a fishers colonise hint.

Based on this evidence, the southern border of the clue (towards the south of Needle Skips) must be:

14 degrees, 33 minutes north (where fishers colonise)
14 degrees, 31 minutes north (somewhere beyond detection)

10/22

22-May-2021 22:03:23

Nov

2017

GhostPenguin

Posts: 5,828 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

11) "where the Fremenik 'heim' and seek" clue run (first ghost run) and town of werewolves hint north of Slayer Tower (second ghost run)

Two separate ghost runs, but I have decided to condense both into this one case file, as they are both related to each other. Some speculation/theory is posted towards the end of the case file. I have posted this after both of the ghost runs as it would seem easier to digest the information that way.

FIRST GHOST RUN

The ghost wandered south of Daemonheim on water, and activated numerous "where the Fremenik 'heim' and seek" hints. To the northwest of the Daemonheim Peninsula resource dungeon isle, it activated multiple beyond detection hints.

Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRyVXgQBoGA

Based on this finding, it would seem like the Daemonheim Peninsula resource dungeon isle and surrounding water will activate a beyond detection hint. However, it did not get close enough for me to fully confirm.

This seems somewhat odd as the ghost is still well within what should be the eastern border of the 'heim' and seek clue (if it was on land towards the eastern edge), and previously I would've assumed the clue region is one big rectangular box, which would be covering the resource dungeon isle as well.

Thinking about it now, possibly the developer of the clue decided to place the borders like this so that the 'heim' and seek clue would cover the the southwest part where one could enter, but not towards the southeast, since no penguin on Daemonheim could go over to the Peninsula resource dungeon, so they felt that the clue did not need to extend to cover that southeastern area. Therefore they were being scrupulous with the borders. Some more speculation on some theory/ideas further below.

11/22

22-May-2021 22:12:35

Nov

2017

GhostPenguin

Posts: 5,828 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

The north/south border between "where the Fremenik 'heim' and seek" and "somewhere beyond detection" (towards the north of the Peninsula resource dungeon isle) seems to be:

15 degrees, 13 minutes north (where the Fremenik 'heim' and seek)
15 degrees. 11 minutes north (somewhere beyond detection)

The east/west border between "where the Fremenik 'heim' and seek" and "somewhere beyond detection" (towards the west of the Peninsula resource dungeon isle) seems to be:

31 degrees, 43 minutes east (where the Fremenik 'heim' and seek)
31 degrees, 45 minutes east (somewhere beyond detection)

I would describe myself as being quite confident in the first border listed and somewhat confident in the second border listed. There was a point in the clip that made me a little wary, but if its not that then it'll be only one row out I'm sure.

The southernmost accessible row on Daemonheim towards the southeast is 15 degrees, 16 minutes north. So if a regular penguin was ever able to reach there again, it wouldn't be possible to activate a Gielinor hint.

SECOND GHOST RUN

In another run, the ghost started roaming from west of Slayer Tower to the northeast. However, it changed course just as it started roaming into what was at the time the presumed 'heim' and seek clue zone (at the time, I had not recorded the ghost run above, so I was not sure exactly which clue it would activate north of the tower).

Unfortunately, I was unable to pick up a 'heim' and seek clue. However, it stood still after roaming for a bit. The scanner suggested it was 27 steps away on seemingly a tile that activated the "near a town of werewolves" hint. It teleported without moving again without moving north, so I was unable to confirm an approximate southern border of the 'heim' and seek clue for sure, which was a shame, but it is what it is.

Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ylW9WI61pH

12/22

22-May-2021 22:39:22 - Last edited on 23-May-2021 20:23:06 by GhostPenguin

Nov

2017

GhostPenguin

Posts: 5,828 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Its clear from the video that the position I was standing on was 14 degrees, 03 mins north. I decided to watch the footage after and tried tracing the number of steps from what the scanner said it was.

After calculating 27 paces south from those coordinates towards the west on more expansive land, I arrive at the conclusion that it must've been on the 13 degrees, 13 mins north row.

It was directly south towards me, generally speaking (was off by maybe one or two rows), and although I haven't done lots of testing with the scanner in other spots, from what I have noticed the scanner does not seem to change the number of paces away even if you move a few steps east or west, so even if it was off one or two rows, that shouldn't have affected the number of steps it determined the ghost was away.

Therefore...

The north/south border between "where the Fremenik 'heim' and seek" and "near a town of werewolves" (towards the north of the Slayer Tower on water) is possibly:

13 degrees, 15 minutes north (where the Fremenik 'heim' and seek)
13 degrees, 13 minutes north (near a town of werewolves)

Looking through various other clue borders, this would seem to be an atypical placement if this is the border. Quite a number of north/south borders are using the 11/13 min degree notation, rather than 13/15.

Of course, its possible the border could be even somewhere a little further north, so take this finding with a grain of salt. Looking around for clues as to why, I noticed a distinctive darkened line running just north of the Slayer Tower, from just to the northwest, which is just the other distinctive blue line which was where I originally expected the border to be.

13/22

22-May-2021 22:42:17 - Last edited on 22-May-2021 22:50:02 by GhostPenguin

Nov

2017

GhostPenguin

Posts: 5,828 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Not that necessarily means anything, but possibly it has some connection. The most northern most spot a Morytania penguin can be taken to is 13 degrees, 11 mins north, so setting it to the typical 11/13 min notation would cover a regular penguin from ever activating (barring any future land changes, of course) an unintentional 'heim' and seek clue, if the developer who made the hint was concerned about that.

Speculation/theory time

I have been wondering why the beyond detection hint seemingly exists near the resource dungeon isle, and also about the apparent border irregularity. Firstly, I checked an old clue map to see whether the dungeons of Daemonheim hint may have had an effect but it was running too far east to be of anything significant.

Here are two theories I had in mind. Keep in mind that all this is speculation of course.

1) Timeline of 'heim' and seek clue introduction into the game

I checked back in this thread to get a timeline/understanding of when the hint was added into the game approximately, and some related updates/possible important information around that time. I thought maybe some change may've affected it. The timeline is below. Game updates mentioned in yellow to help track the changes a little easier.

12 Apr 2010 -

Daemonheim area gets released

13 Apr 2010 - elipile posts that a Wildy penguin activated a somewhere in Runescape penguin on Daemonheim
19 May 2010 - elipile posts that the somewhere in Runescape clue is still activating at Daemonheim
19 Jul 2010 -

resource dungeons added, including the Daemonheim isle one

21 Jul 2010 - elipile posts that a game update changed the structure of Daemonheim, unsure if new clue added
27 Jul 2010 - elipile posts that the clue for Daemonheim area is still somewhere in Runescape
31 Dec 2010 - elipile posts that the Daemonheim area now activates the 'heim' and seek hint

14/22

22-May-2021 22:49:03 - Last edited on 23-May-2021 00:23:16 by GhostPenguin

Nov

2017

GhostPenguin

Posts: 5,828 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

The timeline would suggest the addition of the resource dungeon isle, which wasn't immediately present upon the release of the Dungoneering skill/Daemonheim, would not have had any impact on the placement of the 'heim' and seek clue.

I can't imagine the 'heim' and seek clue was touched by the Sept 2020 rework, and would go as far to say that it would seem likely that it has not been touched since its inception.

I tried looking through old maps from https://runescape.wiki/w/World_map/History to see if there was something lying somewhere around that may be of interest, but I didn't find anything of use.

2) Rows around Slayer Tower before release of Daemonheim/tower graphical rework

I wondered whether a player before the release of Daemonheim was able to walk up further than the 13 degrees, 11 mins north row (either northwest or northeast of the Slayer Tower, but particularly towards the NE) and whether that would have affected the placement of the clue.

On Old School, I went up northwest of the Slayer Tower (in the wildy):

13 degrees, 28 minutes north (furthest north I can go)
29 degrees, 43 minutes east (furthest east I can go)

These borders have not changed. The same rows are still accessible in today's game. One cannot go east of 29 degrees, 43 mins east still. Now I tested northeast of the Slayer Tower:

13 degrees, 11 minutes north (furthest north I can go)
31 degrees, 45 minutes east (furthest west I can go)

It is still not possible to roam further north than 13 degrees, 11 mins north there, so that part has been unchanged. It is no longer possible to go to 31 degrees, 45 minutes east in that area, unless you roam a bit further south, but it seems unlikely that would have had an impact on the clue placement. The furthest west you can go now there is 31 degrees, 46 mins east.

15/22

22-May-2021 22:52:36

Nov

2017

GhostPenguin

Posts: 5,828 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Leading on from this, here is a random theory - shortly before the developer designed the 'heim' and seek hint, they received notice in advance that the graphics team had plans to rework the Slayer Tower, which they probably were not working on.

They may've thought the update had the possibility of changing/expanding the rows around the tower, and decided they did not want to risk a Morytania penguin being able to possibly activate that clue should the rework had changed the rows surrounding the northeast of the tower, so having a Morytania penguin activate somewhere in Runescape would've been preferable should it come to that.

At the same time, the developer may not have minded so much if it was eventually possible to activate it northwest of the tower in the wildy after the rework. But the 'heim' and seek hint was released sometime in Dec 2010, whilst the tower rework came out 12th Feb 2013 according to the wiki, so there's a large time gap in between.

If it was about a year in between then maybe the idea would be more plausible, but it seems rather far-fetched to me. Unless there was another update planned in the general area, particularly around the northeast of the tower, that was not related to the tower rework which could've changed the structure of the area that they were worried about.

Of course, these thoughts are based on whether the beyond detection hint continues to activate south/southwest of the Daemonheim Peninsula resource dungeon isle, and we don't 100% know that for sure.

Overall, I don't feel as though the theory speculation above has helped identify or narrow down a logical conclusion. My next step to learn more will be to get a ghost directly north of the Slayer Tower (and one that does not hug the north wall like the other one did), which will tell us more. And hopefully one towards the south of the resource dungeon isle one day...

16/22

22-May-2021 22:59:07

Nov

2017

GhostPenguin

Posts: 5,828 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

12) Bloodsuckers rule activating in and around Burgh De Rott, and beyond detection zone activating further south on water

Two separate ghost runs, but I have decided to have two parts to this section as they both relate to one another.

FIRST GHOST RUN ( beyond detection towards south of Burgh on water )

The ghost roamed the southwest area of Burgh De Rott, activating bloodsuckers, and then went south directly on the water shortly afterwards, activating beyond detection.

Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOE8T3fI86U

The video is not conclusive enough to say, but from what I could make out of it, I'd estimate the the southern border of the "where bloodsuckers rule" clue (towards the south of Burgh De Rott) is something like...

00 degrees, 09 minutes north (southern-most point on docks, where bloodsuckers rule)
00 degrees, 07 minutes north (where bloodsuckers rule)
00 degrees, 05 minutes north (???)
00 degrees, 03 minutes north (???)
00 degrees, 01 minutes north (leaning towards beyond detcetion, but ???)
00 degrees, 00 minutes north (somewhere beyond detection)

There could be a logical reason for this - if you use the Quick Chat option "I found a penguin at ...", there is an option of Burgh De Rott as a spawn. I wonder whether the bloodsuckers clue has been intentionally drawn down south like this because the developer (presumably Mod Nancy) intended to place a 2-pt penguin spawn there.

But whoever it was decided against it because of the Vyrewatch towards the east side (could be considered too dangerous), or they had to gain approval whilst detailing where the 2-pt spawn locations were planned to be to other developers, and they advised against it.

18/22

22-May-2021 23:56:29

Nov

2017

GhostPenguin

Posts: 5,828 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

The southern most walkable row on the docks in Burgh is 00 degrees, 09 minutes north. This next part I am about to talk about may be completely unrelated, but I should probably mention it here as it seems relevant now.

A few months back I did some testing with Morytania items that provide special effects, but only whilst you are in Morytania. These two items were the Drakan's medallion (ability to teleport anywhere without using a charge whilst in Morytania) and mixing Prayer renewal potions whilst wearing Morytania legs 4 (20% chance to mix a 4-dose pot rather than 3-dose) from the Achievement task set.

I tested it in various places around Morytania, to see where those two items considered the player to be in Morytania, what the boundaries of those effects were, if that would relate to clues in some way etc etc etc. I'll just mention the parts I explored that seem most relevant here.

I was able to create 4-dose pots:

* on the southern most point at Burgh docks (00 degrees, 09 mins north)
* the southern most boat at Meiyerditch (the same one as I use for testing the medallion, more on that just below)

As for the medallion:

The southernmost point on both of the docks at Burgh does not use a charge, with the southern-most row possible being the docks in the middle of town, row 00 degrees, 09 mins north. The southeastern most point just north and a bit east of there by the vyrewatch does not use a charge either.

However...

The medallion DOES use a charge when you use it on board the boat at Meiyerditch (after you've travelled there from Burgh). Remember that as I mentioned above, I was able to create 4-dose pots there. So the medallion considers that I'm not in Morytania whilst the 4-dose pot effect considers I am. The sextant is giving me 00 degrees, 00 minutes north here.

19/22

22-May-2021 23:57:55

Nov

2017

GhostPenguin

Posts: 5,828 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

When I jump onto the rock just north of it, and use the medallion, it does not use a charge. I am still able to make 4-dose pots here. The sextant gives me 00 degrees, 03 minutes north on this rock. That means there is a 00 degrees, 01 minutes row that can't be tested.

The medallion DOES use a charge in the area northwest of the Amphitheatre, and it appears the border for this seems to be 39 degrees, 37 minutes east (no charge used)/39 degrees, 39 minutes east (charge used)

Note that that area activates a Gielinor hint, as before the Sept 2020 rework and also afterwards. Panpei confirmed the border some months back (many thanks to Panpei for figuring these out and providing them):

The east/west border of Bloodsuckers and Beyond Detection near the Amphitheatre are:

39 degrees, 43 minutes east - "... where bloodsuckers rule"
39 degrees, 45 minutes east - "... somewhere beyond detection"

This led me to believe that the medallion is likely not following the penguin clue borders. But still, maybe there is something there. The potions and medallion seem to be using different code for determining whether you are in Morytania or not from what I can tell (I tested a number of different places, not just these spots).

Based on the medallion, the southern border of the "where bloodsuckers rule" clue (towards the south of Burgh De Rott) could be:

00 degrees, 03 minutes north (where bloodsuckers rule)
00 degrees, 01 minutes north (somewhere beyond detection/where bloodsuckers rule)
00 degrees, 00 minutes north (somewhere beyond detection)

20/22

23-May-2021 00:03:35

Forums

Penguin & Ghost Clues