RuneScape Forum Archive | Dev Blog: Abyssal Weapons

Stake To Dle

Posts: 10 Bronze Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Formerly Joy said :
To any naysayer concerned about my offered rework:
The Abyssal Dagger can be:
1.) Eaten between hits
2.) Phoenix Necklace can be broken during either/or hits
3.) The DPS is low
4.) The DPS I proposed is still lower than its superiors, but is more on par to make it worth using much like AGS's inferiors.
5.) The best part is that I made it a combo wep. Something we don't officially have. This is brilliant. You are still more likely a low DPS roll, but it is highly likely to hit. This is unique and fun.

Abyssal dagger special attack (+114 strength bonus, +123 stab bonus)
Max hit: 72 (36-36)
Average hit: 11.77
Hit 10+: 31.37%
Hit 20+: 27.67%
Hit 30+: 21.58%
Hit 40+: 13.39%
Hit 50+: 6.59%
Hit 60+: 2.17%
Hit 70+: 0.14%

Data provided by Woox and the Combat Formula Forum.
If this data is correct then I have a perfect fix to the Abyssal Dagger nerf. It needs a slight buff to be sure it is used in PvP and helps bring back Hybrid PK'ing:

Abyssal Punture:

50% Drain Rate.

The special attack hits twice in quick succession (just like the dragon dagger) with 10% reduced damage and 50% increased accuracy. If the first hit deals damage, so will the second. Both hits deal damage or neither do.

This will ensure the max hits at least 40; taking into consideration you are willing to RISK max gear. This will also justify the dagger being without poison and will still be lower damage output than several other Spec Weps.

Seriously, is this not what we need to bring back Hybrids? Please consider this. I do not want to see the Abyssal Dagger become useless.

Note: The Abyssal Dagger is still a low DPS weapon. The Special Attack will more often than not hit too low. This isn't fair for half your Spec-Bar.

09-Jun-2015 01:31:00 - Last edited on 09-Jun-2015 01:33:11 by Stake To Dle

Stake To Dle

Posts: 10 Bronze Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Firstly, WHAT JOY SAID!!!

I tried to quote his recent one, but I could not... So I will add it:

NOTE: I am editing this in. This is the BARE MINIMUM of what this Special Attack should provide. I believe the Drain Rate should be 35% and the damage reduction should be either completely removed, or reduced to 5%. Remember, we are trying to make an "upgraded Dragon Dagger." Furthermore, revive Hybrid PvP which is the most high risk, high skilled, high reward PK'ing in game. If we don't release a proper Abyssal Dagger... People will continue to PK in Rune, AGS, and untradables for no risk. THIS IS WHY PvP is DEAD.

09-Jun-2015 01:31:33 - Last edited on 09-Jun-2015 01:34:10 by Stake To Dle

Stake To Dle

Posts: 10 Bronze Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Secondly, THIS...i used to watch both defil3d and p1stol pk vids : )

Frost Mages said :
Please make the abyssal dagger actually useful? As a pker of 9 years i see this as a chance to make pking enjoyable and exciting again, lets not waste it. Joy multiple amazing points and i fully support his ideas. Theres is zero excuse for a 30k dds to be equal or better than the abyssal dagger. Personally i was just looking forward to maybe a more accurate dds or a few extra max hits higher than the dds. So tired of this fear of overpowered weapons ruining pking. This is 2015. If your not pking with combo foods when pking i dont know why your bothering pking. If you want people to be excited about your game/updates/pking you've gotta add new interesting situations in the game. With ags being the dominant weapon in the game(nothing really compares to the accuracy/dmg output) i feel pking has become very stale. This has led to myself and nearly all of my pking friends losing almost all interest in pking. I really feel the abyssal dagger could mix things up and make the pking scene for intense and exciting if done correctly. Please reconsider the current plans for the daggers special/stats and refer to Joy's post. Thanks for listening!

On a side note. I can't see a lot of people using the abyssal dagger over a zammy hasta.

09-Jun-2015 01:34:44

Stake To Dle

Posts: 10 Bronze Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Thirdly! My opinion is that

-Abyssal Dagger 35% Drain Rate
-Add 50% accuracy to the special attack as they requested
-I think 0 reduction would be fine? Idk, at worse 5% reduction. Why reduce it in the first place tbh

If it absolutely must be 10% reduced then it absolutely must be 35% drain rate. Period...blood. K?

09-Jun-2015 01:36:16

Feb

2006

JF Kennedy

Posts: 159 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I think these are horrible. The thing which I was looking forward to the most with this slayer expansion was the original abyssal dagger spec. It always seems that the old school team are having to bow down to the demands of the vocal pk'ing community, and ruining what would have been great updates for the PvM'ers. The original abyssal dagger would have finally given the PvM'ers a useful spec weapon (sgs is usless as guthans way outheals it for slayer, ags has terrible consistency against bosses, with dds being the only somewhat decent spec wep to take to slayer) to take bossing and slayer, with the increased accuracy and damage over time being immensely useful for taking down creatures with higher HP.

09-Jun-2015 01:41:26

Starcry

Posts: 1,330 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I much preferred the bleed special attack on the dagger as it was unique. Maybe the numbers could just have been toned down. This special attack is too similar to a dragon dagger special attack I think.

I'm not an expert on combat balance in PvM and PvP so maybe this is a necessary change, but I just preferred the idea of the previous special attack, even though its numbers probably needed lowering.

Also you didn't want the special attacks to punish people for having higher defence, yet the blugeon punishes having higher prayer points. Seems meh.

Summary: Special attacks seem boring and non-unique, but if this is necessary for balance then I'd support that.

09-Jun-2015 01:41:53 - Last edited on 09-Jun-2015 01:44:25 by Starcry

Formerly Joy

Posts: 2,401 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

"It is worth considering that it has been a long-standing request to get a new viable PvP special attack to spice up PKing a little bit. It would be nice if the special attack on one of these weapons was worthy of the wilderness."

-Mod Ronan

The Old School team by no means is "bowing down" to anyone. They kindly approached the community and asked for a PvP weapon. The solutions in this blog are both terrible and I'm fighting my hardest to see Abyssal Dagger buffed properly.

That said, the bleed effect is not able to help PvP. Also, PvM is currently too easy. The last thing we need in PvM is DOT effects. Although, perhaps in Zeah. For now, I gave the ultimate solution to fixing the Abyssal Dagger. The current Special Attack is the right idea, but way too weak.

A proper buff will fix this. But only if it is done correctly.

09-Jun-2015 01:51:04

Formerly Joy

Posts: 2,401 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Remember, PvM is ever so changing. Especially when Zeah releases. I openly welcome the idea of new PvM armors, spells, and weapons. For now, Old School asked and actually desperately needs a PvP weapons.

AGS and no risk is killing the PvP meta. I proposed a weapon rework that has the potential to single handily fix this.

09-Jun-2015 01:52:47

Feb

2006

JF Kennedy

Posts: 159 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I don't think any amount of "weapon spice" will ever make pk'ers not want to take the low risk, easy option. In my opinion it would make my day if the pvp community were left to their own devices, to slowly wither and die away. I thoroughly enjoyed the years when you were not able to attack other players in the wilderness at all. This is just my opinion though.

09-Jun-2015 02:06:42

Mycmbt lvl2

Posts: 505 Steel Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Awful lol

No one is going to use either.

Crush wep sounds like an underpowered version of Statius Hammer that requires you to be on super low prayer risking smite just to hit 50+. Would be easier just to use any godsword or a mace (if on a budget).

With absolutely maxed gear, 98 prayer points drained, and the crush wep in a fight using piety + super str on aggressive you'd spec a 63. And that's a pretty perfect storm of a situation to be in.

More realistically the max hit during a fight for an average pker who has 70 prayer and is maybe using the spec at 15-20 prayer left is going to be 57-58. A dragon mace will spec the same amount with the same gear.

Rather just use the more accurate BGS and have defense drained off my opponent as well as only risking peanuts if I get smited with it.

Dagger is laughable at 50% spec bar

09-Jun-2015 02:34:09 - Last edited on 09-Jun-2015 02:35:08 by Mycmbt lvl2

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Dev Blog: Abyssal Weapons