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RE: Treasure Hunter & RunePass

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Mexk
Aug
fmod Member
2006

Mexk

Forum Moderator Posts: 19,606 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Original message details are unavailable.
Hey,

First of all, thanks for the critical feedback - It's really appreciated at this time.

While I cannot address any individual points I would like to take the time to say that we are reading all player feedback; both here and on Reddit and discussions are taking place internally.

Thanks,

Mod Pebble

Hi Pebble

Thank you for acknowledging my thread and the feedback left throughout by myself and others. I appreciate hearing that you are indeed collecting feedback - though, again, whilst I understand that you are unable to respond directly to the specific points, having your feedback acknowledged should be the norm rather than the exception. I can furthermore only imagine that seeing things being recognised and appreciated only encourage other players to also leave their feedback - which, I assume, is what it is all about!

I will be awaiting the results of your internal discussions.

Thanks!
¸,.•
Mexk
•.,¸

Stand up for what is right, even if you stand alone
¨`'°«„¸¸„»°'
.............................
'°«„¸¸„»°'´¨

06-Jul-2018 07:45:08 - Last edited on 06-Jul-2018 08:30:59 by Mexk

Mexk
Aug
fmod Member
2006

Mexk

Forum Moderator Posts: 19,606 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Original message details are unavailable.
Very thoughtful and well-written post, OP.

For myself, I avoid MTX entirely - I quit completely for 2 solid years after they started selling Squeal spins, and while I played obsessively prior to that time, I play only intermittently anymore.

Much of the game has moved beyond my reach in terms of accessibility, between falling far behind other players who were once peers or inferiors in terms of overall experience and game knowledge, the changes to the combat system, and of course, MTX boosting in all of its many forms.

In addition to content which is inaccessible for those reasons, I deliberately avoid everything I view as even tangentially related to an MTX mechanic(despite grudgingly noting the merits of certain content, such as the purpose bonds serve in combatting botting).

As a result, my gameplay experience is significantly deprecated from what it once was, but there are enough areas of the game that still provide me with some enjoyment to keep me logging back in every so often - despite the intrusiveness of some of the MTX mechanics, most notably treasure hunter.

I'm all for any changes which will mitigate or remove that intrusion and allow me to play in my own limited way without being reminded of the reason I quit completely for so long.

Thank you for continuing the resistance against MTX, and thank you for presenting your case in a more tactful and diplomatic fashion then I believe I was ever able to manage. Hopefully, some good comes of it.

Thank you for your kind words and encouragement.

I think it speaks volume that a player like yourself continue to check in, hoping, I presume, to find that things have eased in a way that allows you to once again enjoy the game to its fullest potential. I moreover think it speaks volume that you, despite being a veteran, feel trapped not merely because of stalled progression and new content released in your absence, but also due to the omnipresence of MTX.
¸,.•
Mexk
•.,¸

Stand up for what is right, even if you stand alone
¨`'°«„¸¸„»°'
.............................
'°«„¸¸„»°'´¨

06-Jul-2018 07:57:23

Mexk
Aug
fmod Member
2006

Mexk

Forum Moderator Posts: 19,606 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Original message details are unavailable.

But frankly, what do you expect them to "address" at this stage? They said Ocean Bounty is an EXPERIMENT. Nothing is concrete at this stage. The only thing any Jmod said was no TH promotion the first week of Ocean Bounty, and added "no. it doesn't carry into the 2nd week". They are doing everything as they said. They said nothing else regarding TH whatsoever. So nothing there to address.

I am not the OP you asked the above to, but since that post agreed with mine, I will take the liberty to respond with my thoughts on the matter. I have a number of long-overdue things, some of which I will summarise below, I feel Jagex ought to address candidly as soon as possible. I need to accentuate, however, that the one thing I want the most is to see Jagex actively engage in a constructive and honest two-way dialogue with the community at large about what ultimately is the future of RuneScape. Not as a one time exception, nor necessarily as a quotidian thing, but rather as a both continuous and conscious effort towards devising a workable path for everyone. In essence, I want Jagex to include us, the players, in the decision making which directly impacts -- right now it impairs -- our game experience.

In the more near term, I want Jagex to address not merely the severe shortcomings in communication and transparency up until this point, but also outline what they want to do better and how they are going to ensure such promises do not wind up broken once again. There is not unlimited trust nor faith in Jagex to do right, and I feel as though they are reaching a critical breaking point in this regard.

I moreover think it is a mistake to view the situation as an us-versus-them thing. I can only assume that everyone wants RuneScape to succeed and flourish for years to come; Jagex and players alike. We have the same mission and wishes, really, but short-term profitability is not key to long-term success.
¸,.•
Mexk
•.,¸

Stand up for what is right, even if you stand alone
¨`'°«„¸¸„»°'
.............................
'°«„¸¸„»°'´¨

06-Jul-2018 08:16:44 - Last edited on 06-Jul-2018 08:41:09 by Mexk

Mexk
Aug
fmod Member
2006

Mexk

Forum Moderator Posts: 19,606 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Original message details are unavailable.
The opening post is (imo) beautifully crafted and this thread is immensely interesting and informative, being able to see both sides of the coin.

Thank you, Mexk.

Thank you, Fifi!
¸,.•
Mexk
•.,¸

Stand up for what is right, even if you stand alone
¨`'°«„¸¸„»°'
.............................
'°«„¸¸„»°'´¨

06-Jul-2018 08:31:39

Big Storms

Big Storms

Posts: 3,932 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Again I agree with you Mexk, but I wish to add some of my concerns based on (the many) previous situations we have had with MTX.

MTX communication is just really bad, and sadly has a track record of ignoring the players. Yes Jagex has become a lot more transparent when it comes to discussion in game content. Jagex is also more visible when it comes to MTX, explaining why they are so careful before sending any statements (since they will be examined in minute detail by the community) and trying to respond when they are able to.

However, and this is the problem: none of the promises ever get fulfilled. The closest we got to a MTX related promise being fulfilled was with elite skilling outfits and the Hanto set being available in game. And that is it. Elite skilling outfits even now have no clear release schedule (so a half fulfilled promise) and the Hanto set being released in game in my opinion ended up just being damage control (for it being on TH already tainted the set).

Other than that we heard time and time again "we are taking your feedback seriously" and "we will focus on balancing the MTX with actual content". Just look at the 2013 what's coming and what's going blog:

" At times in 2012, it felt like the SoF and SGS releases dominated our release schedule and news feed, and that some of the content just didn't feel like RuneScape. The team is certainly moving towards a better balance as time has gone on "

The removal of Second change Tuesdays was yet another 'experiment' that failed. This is the state of MTX (updated till April):



It is this that makes me a very skeptical person when it comes to seeing changes. I can suggest them and I know there now will at times be responses. Yet actions are lacking. So while I do still give the occasional bit of feedback, do note that I know it would be exceptional if it actually gets acted upon. I put the effort in because I care, but my expectations are exceptionally low. "One should not mindlessly follow gods or the godless:
follow
your
own
path
"
~Big Storms

06-Jul-2018 10:50:06

Pachuli714
Mar Member 2008

Pachuli714

Posts: 4,549 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Mexk, what I find truly ironic is that you, of all people, would have written a thread like this. What I found most unbelievable was the introduction of Premier Club Memberships and that people would opt for that in the first place.

The game had always been Free-to-Play or Members. Introducing Premier Club Memberships (with additional tiers to boot) only served to divide the community and tell members that they now were no longer considered "good enough" because they weren't willing to pay more for cosmetic items. That folks like you were willing to do so made you seem shallow and foolish for being ready to shell out more money for essentially virtual items that meant nothing other than to single you out as elite over the rest of us.

But what that did long term was to alert Jagex to the fact that they then could introduce pretty much anything and elitsts would be willing to pay for it. Elite content, elite items, elite junk and there go those wallets.

It's a trend that many of us argued against way back when. We saw this coming. We tried to warn all of you but we were shouted down by claims that all we had to do was ignore it since it had no impact on the game itself.

Yet now we are witnessing how it is impacting the game. Content is released with only the upper echelon of the game community in mind. Ignoring it is easy enough since most of us will never be able to do most of it. And that, unfortunately, is where the Jagex mindset seems to be stuck.

It can only think in terms of what you and others like you would be willing to pay extra for. The content is secondary. The only thing that matters is "are those Gold Premier Club members willing to pay more for this is we slap a label on it and call it a promotion?" They seem to be caring less and less now for even the Silver and Bronze members. I guess they're not quite as elite nowadays as the Gold folks.

You've made your bed. This is the situation you contributed to when you opted to pay extra for Gold.

06-Jul-2018 13:11:39

Illyric
Jun Member 2009

Illyric

Posts: 1,951 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Mexk, I applaud you for making a well thought out constructive criticism of Runepass/TH however Pachuli's post (above) pretty much cuts through all the crap and gets to the heart of the problem.
I find it hard to disagree with any of it.

06-Jul-2018 13:32:06

HopelessHalo
Feb Member 2005

HopelessHalo

Posts: 666 Steel Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
The parallelism in this You tube video on EA is eerily similar to the path Jagex is exploring......

Some of the video is irrelevant, but the majority of it you could literally replace "EA" for "Jagex" and most would apply.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxnPffoyGAc

It would probably be a good view for any J-mods out there to know exactly how the majority of their player base feels.
I don't have a signiture

06-Jul-2018 14:44:56

Sereg

Sereg

Posts: 9,292 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
In defense of the premiere club memberships, I will say this - they are a better deal if the player knows (or reasonably expects) that they will be playing continuously for the specified timespan then simply purchasing regular membership for the same timeframe. Cosmetics and other "elite" features aside, the decision to purchase such a package can be made solely on the basis of total cost for a certain period of membership.

That said, I have my issues with them as well - I had actually just purchased such a plan back in 2011 or whenever it was that squeal was made buyable, following its initial free trial. Had I not been so deadset against it that I was willing to sacrifice the several months of membership I had already paid for(as well as my legacy membership price - I was at the $5 a month level at the time), I might have simply played through it, telling myself I'd quit after it ran out - and I fear this was the case for quite a lot of players who otherwise would have quit immediately in response to that travesty. However, when the time came, they were all still invested, the outrage had waned, and probably far fewer players ended up quitting in protest then might have had they not been involved in a longer term membership contract.

It's pointless to speculate on the direction MTX in Runescape might have gone had that initial statement of players quitting been that much stronger, but it's something I wonder about, regardless.

My playstyle now reflects this - I rarely tend to hold membership continuously for more then a handful of months at a time anymore(my current stretch is longer then usual), and I always purchase it one month at a time, despite it being a better deal to go for one of the bulk packages. This is partially because my interest in playing Runescape is no longer as constant and unfailing as it once was, but certainly also partially due to my reluctance to participate in any sort of long term contract to keep playing, as I see it.
Carve our dreams in sanguine stone/Strength corporeal and of mind
Walls of our flesh, bricks of our bone/Deadly intent to defend our kind

06-Jul-2018 15:40:05 - Last edited on 06-Jul-2018 15:45:48 by Sereg

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