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Salt in the Wound—the problems

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Wahisietel
Oct Member 2005

Wahisietel

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Honestly, I don't think Eva should have been introduced in Salt in the Wound. The finale of a quest series is FAR too late to introduce what is supposed to be one of the main protagonists. Sure, she'd be fine if she was introduced or at least referenced in a previous quest, but she just comes out of nowhere.

If they needed a character to fill the Melee spot, they should have just included Sir Tiffy instead. I imagine they didn't do that because Ritual of the Mahjarrat was in development at the time, but a rework wouldn't have that issue.

Also, some points regarding Kennith. He's definitely not connected to the slugs. Kennith's Concerns shows him to be acting independently of them, and to "simply" be a child with extraordinary powers. Of course, Ezekial does hint that there's more to how he got those powers in the first place, saying that there's something fundamentally wrong with Witchaven.

And while Kennith growing up did make sense, it deserved to get more of an explanation than it did, since it wasn't explained too well, and some players who kind of forgot what happened in the previous quest thought that Kennith having magical powers was an asspull. That said, I disagree with Jagex's choice to age him up in the first place; it had no real reason besides Jagex's reluctance to show a child in combat. (Smiddi Ryak also suffers from this). And yet they allow us to kill gnome children, what blatant racism towards gnomes!

He's definitely creepier as a child, and aging him up kind of got rid of his main attribute, that being a "creepy child with sinister powers". Any SITW rework should have him stay as a child, maybe with a protective shield if Jagex are worried about showing violence to children.
You never were our brightest star, Khazard. 'Vermin slaughtered like lambs'? What does that even mean?

06-Apr-2015 20:56:33

Solanumtinkr

Solanumtinkr

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Lord Drakan said :
I don't see what the White Knights have to do with anything. They are only involved in Wanted! and The Void Stares Back... And that story about Amik and Anlaf - interesting. I wouldn't go as far as saying that's what caused the Siege of Falador though. That was very much Sulla's doing. Also, I don't recall the troll invasions ever stopping... Anyway, I like the story, but not sure if it could work with what's currently canon - certainly it's much darker. ._.

Oh, and, according to Mod Osborne on Twitter, dungeoneering was included because it was a new skill and they wanted it to be a quest requirement. Not a schocking revelation; unlike with A Clockwork Syringe, however, it didn't work here. Nope.
I am saying that their power grab, which included the removal of anything and anyone not under their sway, with the full intention of seizing Asgarnia for themselves.

That action led directly to the Siege of Falador. And if you think the White Knights were not involved in the sea slug quests... O_o

You do know Sir Tiffy is a White Knight and member of their equivalent of the CIA, right?

The White Knights were headily involved in the series and were the people who supposedly locked the mother Mallum away to start with. This means they not only knew about the Mother Mallum, but where to find her as well. That is enough of a connection for someone to have, lets say, checked to see if the prison was still sealed, for example, and start the whole ball rolling, a lot earlier than anyone suspected.
The purpose of adventure is to shine light into dark places,
Poke monsters with a sharp stick, Then steal anything that isn't nailed down!
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06-Apr-2015 21:09:23 - Last edited on 06-Apr-2015 21:11:49 by Solanumtinkr

Lord Drakan
Sep Member 2010

Lord Drakan

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Tiffy is a Temple Knight, not a White Knight. They are related, but totally separate organisations.

As for the Siege, this more or less happened:

1) Vallance falls ill, the White Knights take over
2) Amik declares the Kinshra have no more power
3) Lord Milton declares war
4) Battle of North Falador
5) Sulla assassinates Milton
6) Sulla prepares for war, tired of diplomacy, and tests his chaos dwarf mortars on the monastery
7) Siege of Falador

@Wahi: Good points. I miss child Smiddi. :P But then they did terrible things with a bunch of imaginary children in Vengeance, Tolna and most recently the youngest generation of Fairweathers. I suppose none of those were actually in combat... But what about Philippe?
Bizarre Boron Fusswell, scryer extraordinaire. OSRS: POH ideas & RS3 minigames & achievement ideas !

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07-Apr-2015 06:46:21 - Last edited on 07-Apr-2015 06:58:40 by Lord Drakan

sir eos lee

sir eos lee

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@Wahisietel
Agreed, there were already established White Knights that could have been used.
You do encounter a few in Recruitment Drive, you'd think an of them could fit the bill.
There's also Sir Owen. If SITW is truly a 5th Age Quest, not much harm in having him in that role ... (heck ... the Signature Heroes were supposed to be "something" right ... might as well toss him into an adventure like this before you put him on a bus in Death of Chivlary)
In fact, aren't Eva's and Owen's characters similar enough that you could swap '** out and keep all of the same dialogue?

07-Apr-2015 06:52:37 - Last edited on 07-Apr-2015 06:53:27 by sir eos lee

Lord Drakan
Sep Member 2010

Lord Drakan

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sir eos lee said :
@Wahisietel
Agreed, there were already established White Knights that could have been used.
You do encounter a few in Recruitment Drive, you'd think an of them could fit the bill.
There's also Sir Owen. If SITW is truly a 5th Age Quest, not much harm in having him in that role ... (heck ... the Signature Heroes were supposed to be "something" right ... might as well toss him into an adventure like this before you put him on a bus in Death of Chivlary)
In fact, aren't Eva's and Owen's characters similar enough that you could swap '** out and keep all of the same dialogue?

...Temple Knights. ._.
Bizarre Boron Fusswell, scryer extraordinaire. OSRS: POH ideas & RS3 minigames & achievement ideas !

Perhaps you're half right; perhaps we can't win. But we can fight.
— Zanik

07-Apr-2015 06:59:35

Enquidou

Enquidou

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I actually agree completely.

The most annoying thing to me was the whole deal potion, the moment I heard of it... I though: "Ah no! Please don't ruin this perfectly fine series, please make am I'm self-aware about the silliness of this and I'm going to tell you this and make it logical again -joke." And then it got only worse... But Kennith was really the bad omen from the start.

I prefer the removal of the quest form the canon (and quest book), ignoring it ever happened, and even never having a finale (not even if it's 5th age, what is should be.. right?), than for this to stay.
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You can always talk to me on Twitter: @Enquidou or Reddit /u/Leon_Art .

07-Apr-2015 14:04:27

Enquidou

Enquidou

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Aenrichus said :
There was a lot of red flags during the development. Mod Trick gave it the codename "Slug 3" even though it was the 4th quest in the series. In the DevBlog he even mention his colleagues questioning why he was working on Dungeoneering.

This quest is in major need of a rework, remove it and replace it with something suitable.
Wow.. I didn't know that... those are rather important things indeed. Might have been hard to wave the white flag for all those red flag, but maybe next time that happens, a more experienced and proper quest writer to take seniority?

Must be really hard and annoying sometimes to stand up for your colleagues in public while you disagree with them out of public.
Revive/Enhance Mage Arena God staffs!
You can always talk to me on Twitter: @Enquidou or Reddit /u/Leon_Art .

07-Apr-2015 14:06:26 - Last edited on 07-Apr-2015 14:25:13 by Enquidou

sir eos lee

sir eos lee

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I was also thinking ... maybe Sir Owen could be Ava.
(Owen was sent on a prior mission, but had to change looks/genders. He finished the mission in record time, but the change was still in effect. He finished just in time to be assigned to SITW. Tiffy being the Sadistic but Magnificent B. that he is, made up a lie about Ava/Owen being his niece, and Ava/Owen just ran with it.)

Temple Knight .... White Knight ... Potato/Pohtahtoe/Cucumber ... not much difference right?

07-Apr-2015 14:23:25 - Last edited on 07-Apr-2015 14:24:42 by sir eos lee

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