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Sharp-shin

Sharp-shin

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Turksta said :
I'd say in a game where the population is slowly decreasing, player satisfaction matters more in this case than catering to a very niche group of players
Firstly, I disagree that it'd only cater to a niche of players; have you forgotten how many players voted against in the poll that this thread is based on? Or how many players voted in favor of adding discontinued holiday items in OSRS?

Secondly, getting some optional cosmetics will not make or break someone's decision to stay playing the game or leave it. The core gameplay and monetization matters, not cosmetics. The game would only decline more if you upset the old players, though.


Turksta said :
That isn't the problem. The problem is newer players being denied of using them whenever they want
Yet the post I quoted, which you also quoted in agreement, said "any players", not just newer players.


Turksta said :
It was a design decision, and also a "correction".
No, a design decision like that is fine either way, so long as the discontinued stuff are cosmetics only, and as long as you don't change it for items that have already had their discontinuity status decided. Historical value adds uniqueness to the game.


Turksta said :
I'm not so sure about the source of Pikachu78. However, i do recall many players happy with the rerelease of the snow globe.
How come that I recall the complete opposite then? As I recall it, older players were upset due to the rerelease itself, and newer players were upset because it was "just" the snow globe (as in, an item that you can't really display to others, because you can't wear it). Neither seemed happy to me.
"Volat Accipiter libera est; venandi sua natura est."
~Accipiter striatus

30-Oct-2018 07:14:49

Whatusaytome
Apr Member 2020

Whatusaytome

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Sharp-shin said :
Turksta said :
I'd say in a game where the population is slowly decreasing, player satisfaction matters more in this case than catering to a very niche group of players
Firstly, I disagree that it'd only cater to a niche of players; have you forgotten how many players voted against in the poll that this thread is based on? Or how many players voted in favor of adding discontinued holiday items in OSRS?

getting some optional cosmetics will not make or break someone's decision to stay playing the game or leave it. your beliefs are centered around a niche group of players. Read every other line in you post, "older players upset" "any players, not newer players"

There are other discontinued items that actually have significance making the game unique. These have no business being discontinued and they don't add any likeable uniqueness to the game. As you said, getting cosmetics won't change your decision on if you play, you will just cry about it for a week and grow up eventually.

No new player likes how their "status has been set" like it cannot be changed. It's just sad that you only care about people like yourself.
Your opinions here can affect us all. Please post for the better

Stepping Stone Partyhats
Update the rules , Trade Lock Scammers

30-Oct-2018 08:36:00 - Last edited on 30-Oct-2018 08:36:53 by Whatusaytome

Ladyolake
Jan Member 2008

Ladyolake

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I can accept "original"

i just figured if they were gonna rerelease them it might be easier to edit the rerelease
than go back and add that also. The richest person is not who has the most. It is who Needs the least.

30-Oct-2018 10:27:54

Whatusaytome
Apr Member 2020

Whatusaytome

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Ladyolake said :
I can accept "original"

i just figured if they were gonna rerelease them it might be easier to edit the rerelease
than go back and add that also. You're probably right about that.. Instead of adding the new overrides, and editing existing items. It might just be simpler to make the new items with the change done on their creation.

Forgive my rudeness Ladyolake, the word copy or the year isn't necessarily bad alternatives if that's what they choose to do. I think it separates people unnecessarily but that's just an opinion of mine. You aren't wrong like I was making you out to be.
Your opinions here can affect us all. Please post for the better

Stepping Stone Partyhats
Update the rules , Trade Lock Scammers

30-Oct-2018 22:21:46

Turksta

Turksta

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"They weren't made rare in quantity, they were made rare by being discontinued. "Rare" in certain contexts like this means a discontinued item, not an item that is hard to get (like a very rare monster drop) or small in quantity. If Jagex didn't intend this, they would've changed it over a decade ago already, but they didn't, because it was a design decision."

They weren't made to be rare though. Being rare is just the outcome that has happened . Doesn't mean it should be that way. They were handed out as candy just like partyhats. The only reason they are 'rare' today is because they are currently untradeable and locked to the accounts of those players who took part in the event. They are untradeable only because partyhats and other earlier holiday items became a get rich quick scheme and promoted unhealthy gameplay including scamming and luring. By being untradeable, players cannot take part in any of these immoral acts.
While i agree they became rare over time by being discontinued, i do not agree that Jagex intended for these items to be anything other than fun useless silly items.


"When it comes to game integrity, one has to be harsh like life sometimes, in order to preserve it. If an item was made available for everyone easily, it'd become worthless quickly."

It would become worthless to those who used the items with the wrong intentions (bragging rights over others).For those with the right intentions (actually using the item as fun items) it won't be worthless :)


"Some players don't realize that new cosmetics can be made that they'll like even more."

Yes, but Jagex has failed to deliver. So until that gets fixed, more and more players will ask for the older better holiday items. And i am not against this - why should players be punished because of Jagex's lack of effort into bringing out good holiday rewards.

31-Oct-2018 07:43:16

Turksta

Turksta

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"Firstly, I disagree that it'd only cater to a niche of players; have you forgotten how many players voted against in the poll that this thread is based on? Or how many players voted in favor of adding discontinued holiday items in OSRS?"

I was one of those players who voted against it. Not because i do not want holiday items to return but because of the manner they intended to rerelease it. I for one do not want cheap copies of the items to be made. It would only further promote elitism and clutter up the game - which i do not want.


"Secondly, getting some optional cosmetics will not make or break someone's decision to stay playing the game or leave it. The core gameplay and monetization matters, not cosmetics. The game would only decline more if you upset the old players, though."

With that logic, it can be argued that newer players gaining access to the older cosmetics will not make or break a veteran's decision to quit playing the game.

31-Oct-2018 07:57:49

Turksta

Turksta

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"Yet the post I quoted, which you also quoted in agreement, said "any players", not just newer players."

New players fit the category of any players


"No, a design decision like that is fine either way, so long as the discontinued stuff are cosmetics only, and as long as you don't change it for items that have already had their discontinuity status decided. Historical value adds uniqueness to the game."

Well i hate to break the news for you however Jagex have already done a lot of things that go against that stance of yours. Historical value adds unique to the game. Inconsistency of bringing in newer rewards doesn't though.


"How come that I recall the complete opposite then? As I recall it, older players were upset due to the rerelease itself, and newer players were upset because it was "just" the snow globe (as in, an item that you can't really display to others, because you can't wear it). Neither seemed happy to me ."

That is certainly not the case:
"I gotta say I loved this Christmas event. 2007 was my first Christmas event on runescape and getting to relive that and get a snow globe on my ironman was just the right amount of nostalgia. Thanks for another great year Jagex team!!!"
- Blue Falcon


"Thank you Jagex for the nostalgic trip to some of my favorite events, and some of my fondest memories from the past."
- Warix

"Ah, I was pretty thrilled when I saw the 2007 event! It was my first ever seasonal event back then, and it was pretty fun to see it again!"
- FluttersJay


"Probably my most favourite part of the 2016 Christmas event is all those rewards from earlier Christmas events, as I only started playing this game since Nov 2016. Wish that future holiday special events also allow us a chance to win rewards from past holiday events."
-Vile39

31-Oct-2018 08:24:35

Turksta

Turksta

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"I enjoyed it, too. If they bring it back next year and add new wardrobes from other Christmas events, I'll be happy with it."
- S1ngul4r1ty

I'm not denying some players were upset, however to say "Neither seemed happy to me" is a bit ignorant and the players that were satisfied with the snow globe returning far exceed those who weren't happy with the decision. I recall on reddit the one person that complained that his snow globe isn't as special anymore got downvoted to oblivion.

31-Oct-2018 08:33:23

Sharp-shin

Sharp-shin

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Turksta said :
They weren't made to be rare though. Being rare is just the outcome that has happened. Doesn't mean it should be that way. They were handed out as candy just like partyhats. The only reason they are 'rare' today is because they are currently untradeable and locked to the accounts of those players who took part in the event. They are untradeable only because partyhats and other earlier holiday items became a get rich quick scheme and promoted unhealthy gameplay including scamming and luring. By being untradeable, players cannot take part in any of these immoral acts.
While i agree they became rare over time by being discontinued, i do not agree that Jagex intended for these items to be anything other than fun useless silly items.
It seems to me like you're still only talking about "rare" as "small in quantity", even though I explained that in certain contexts like this, it doesn't mean that, instead simply meaning a discontinued item. Some discontinued items may become small in quantity, but an item can be rare because of discontinuity, while still being large in quantity.

Plus, like said earlier, if Jagex didn't intend this, they would've changed it over a decade ago already; so old is the game and for so long have discontinued items existed.


Turksta said :
It would become worthless to those who used the items with the wrong intentions (bragging rights over others).For those with the right intentions (actually using the item as fun items) it won't be worthless
You really shouldn't let elitists have that kind of an impact on your perception of things; elitists are always going to exist, but there are people like me out there as well, who don't care about bragging, but that of the historical value itself. Short term temporary satisfaction is outshadowed by long term appreciation, because if something is easily available, it'll quickly wear out.
"Volat Accipiter libera est; venandi sua natura est."
~Accipiter striatus

31-Oct-2018 11:28:40

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