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YOU Are Not Essential

https://youtu.be/zUEwKCsBaww

If you wonder why I question things the way I do? It's stuff like that.

Outdoor patio = dangerous and banned

Unless... you have lots of money, in which case, you can put up 20 outdoor tents, right beside that dangerous and banned outdoor patio owned by a small business.

Like, somehow the logic is that covid doesn't shop at Walmart, so Walmart can stay open, but covid likes to shop small businesses, that's why a mom and pop shops get shut down. There's no logic there. Or nightly curfews for the public, because, you know, covid spreads in the dark more efficiently somehow?

And this whole time, public transportation is still running, because packing people into an enclosed bus or subway car is safe, but having people over for Thanksgiving is not safe. I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

07-Dec-2020 13:21:38

Miles Prower said :
NexOrigin said :
But we did. At least, the people who were paying attention did. The media made sure the rest of you were not paying attention.

Sure, love this attitude; to paraphrase: "I'm right, you're all wrong." With nothing to back it up.
Were you watching the outbreak unfold in China in late December and Early January? Like, the actual news happening in China, and all the leaked videos that were only managing to stay up on places like LiveLeak (where almost anything is allowed) for only an hour or two before being removed with no explanations? The spread was extremely fast in the first days. When I say they were barricading people in their homes, they would literally show up with portable welders and weld bars across the door so they couldn't open it. If there was any sign that you had even been near someone that was sick, you were physically quarantined in your own home, unable to physically leave because they barricaded you in.

They were trying to silence all of this. There were videos popping up of people inside their homes, when guys in hazmat suits show up and start asking questions about something they had posted on social media about what was happening. Then it would turn to "you look sick, you should come with us to get tested".

I watched this all unfold in the first early days. Everyone else who was paying attention knew it. It's only the people who weren't paying attention that didn't know, and the media was intent on making sure people didn't know.... throwing around terms like 'fearmonger" and "conspiracy theory".

What do you expect me to back it up with? Deleted videos from LiveLeak? Deleted social media posts? Deleted Chinese news articles? They were actively trying to keep it from spreading on the internet. China is no stranger to internet censorship. Afterall, they do have the Great Firewall of China specifically for that purpose. I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

07-Dec-2020 14:15:38

Miles Prower said :
NexOrigin said :
Advice should based on science, not feelings, and not false data from the media.

It would appear that you are happy to support the media providing and spinning data you agree with, rather than the original source. What? The advice was given by the CDC and The Surgeon General, based on false data by the media.

I was literally saying the opposite of what the media and the CDC/SG were saying at the time.

The source, literally all the leaked footage and news from China, was what I was basing it on.

Who am I going to trust? The CDC saying "masks don't prevent covid"? Or the people in China all wearing masks to prevent the spread? If masks don't work, then why did China secure so many masks, leaving other countries low on supplies? Why did China secure mask trade arrangements from numerous countries so early on?

Miles Prower said :
If a problem comes your way, it is on you to competently seek to resolve that problem. The source is not relevant and the constant blame game to distract from this fact is disingenuous. Suppression of the facts in China is absolutely true, but pointing that out does not magically solve the problem.
The source lied. The source claimed it there was no human to human transmission, while they knew there was. The source claimed that the number of infections and deaths were significantly lower than they actually were. The source knew about the SARS infection, and actively tried to suppress the doctor who first reported on it. He was arrested, and later died in the hospital. I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

07-Dec-2020 14:28:24

Miles Prower said :
The virus spreading rapidly across southern Europe was a significant enough warning. It does not have to be vocal. We should have acted as soon as this became obvious, preferably before. You realize that happened long after those of us who paying attention tried warning everyone, before it had even managed to leave China. We were mocked, and ridiculed, and called fear mongers and conspiracy theorists for having the audacity to try and warn people of a massive outbreak that was potentially threatening the world.

"Ohhh, end of the world.. oooh, I'm so scared"
"Stop fear mongering"
"Kinda sounds like a wild conspiracy theory to me"

Oh, well, holy cow, now it's a worldwide problem... and all those people who said we were lying... are now saying the same thing we said at the very start.

Even CNN at this point is saying "China lied about the data". They're only like 10 or 11 months late, but whatever, right? At least they've finally changed their narrative to reflect the actual details. 10 months ago it was "fear mongering" and xenophobic. Now it's "China mishandling".

I totally agree with you when you say "We should have acted as soon as this became obvious, preferably before".

People tried to warn everyone. You know what the problem is?
I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

07-Dec-2020 14:44:27

Pointing out that a specific country was deliberately lying to the rest of the world, which resulted in a massive worldwide outbreak isn't "absolving themselves all responsibility".

Are you trying to absolve China from all responsibility?

I'm not saying that other leaders haven't acted poorly in regards to the outbreak, but why are you trying to absolve those we know intentionally mishandled the situation at the start?

There's plenty of blame to go around. It's not like the blame bucket is going to run empty if China is blamed for their part in the outbreak. I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

07-Dec-2020 20:36:04

Miles Prower said :
Constantly pointing out the handling of a problem by somebody else when faced with criticism about one's own handling is an attempt to distract and absolve responsibility. What criticism am I facing about how I handled my own affairs, and what responsibility do you believe I'm trying to absolve myself from?

Miles Prower said :
If I am asked about China then I will comment on China. If I am asked about the UK then I will comment on the UK. Do you believe that no one else should comment unless specifically asked?

Miles Prower said :
China has nothing to do with the way the UK, US, or other hotspots are handling the pandemic right now, and it's a complete mess. Didn't those countries react based on the information being provided by "official sources" from China? You know, those sources that people were trying to warn everyone about in the beginning, but got mocked and called xenophobic for?

It's not like a virus hit in China, and then China tried to control the spread, and warned everyone about it. Instead of trying to warn other countries about this outbreak, they tried to hide it from the rest of the world. But even with all their efforts, things were still being leaked out of China.

If China had come out right from the beginning, and made the world aware of what was actually happening, other countries would have reacted much differently, and the outcome would have been significantly different, thus, those countries would not be in this predicament in the first place. I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

07-Dec-2020 22:36:42

Think about this; America has around 330 million people. China literally has a billion more people than that, 1.39 billion people. Both countries are roughly the same size in area. So how is it that China "claims" to have only had 86,634 while America has had over 14 million cases?

Ask yourself which country controls the market for N95 masks? That's China. That's the country that all the Western countries sent their N95 masks and other PPE to by the billions.

After all the PPE was sent to China... China stopped filling orders from other countries for N95 masks and other PPE.



You keep asking why the West had so many more cases and hotspots.... but you're not asking who had all the masks and PPE?

China is the largest producer of PPE for the entire world. Everyone shipped their PPE to China when the outbreak started. Then China refused to export any PPE to other countries. They had all the masks...

China, with all the masks, claims 86k cases. America, who sent their PPE to China and told the public that masks do not prevent the spread of covid (by official sources) claims 14m cases.

Do you see any correlation here?

If you believe that masks help stop the spread of the virus, then you should be able to see the correlation between the numbers. China had already put mandatory face masks orders in place by Feb 8th. The CDC was still discouraging people from wearing face masks at end of February.

China had all the masks, China forced the public to wear masks, and the outbreak was substantially less severe in a country with over a billion more people in it. America gave all their masks away, and told people not to wear masks, and ended up with 14 million more cases (over 140 times as many cases). And then when they decided people needed to wear masks, China wouldn't sell them the masks. And when China finally started shipping out masks later on, there was a high number of defective masks and masks that didn't meet health standards.


Food for thought. I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

07-Dec-2020 23:03:06