RuneScape Forum Archive | (F2P) QoL Improvements v2

Oct

2013

Rikornak

Posts: 9,169 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Seeing the whole array of the t50 slayer weapons: I do not think it would hurt if they would deal higher than usual damage (50 requirement in the respective style for t55 damage) - it is a legitimate tool within the eoc and could in here perfectly accomodate the slayer level required compared to plain runite weapons

http://oldschoolrunescape.wikia.com/wiki/Rune_spear
http://oldschoolrunescape.wikia.com/wiki/Leaf-bladed_spear

At least for the spears it seemed like it had higher stats pre-eoc. In RS3 the leaf-bladed spear strikes faster than the rune spear, which also should translate into higher ability damage. I am not entirely sure how high its ends, but if it were to balance in at t55 it already would be fine.

- As for the pearl bolts: I guess they really could, as I do not really await Jagex introducing many tx5 weapons at such low levels.
- Special ammo: I am not sure for bone bolts in the modern game, they weren't pre-eoc though. Ammo racks, cannon shots and coral bolts are for their special weapon variants for sure.
- Bakriminel: I must admit the english text actually sounds quite ambiguous (neither confirmed nor denied) and can be interpreted either way, but a localized version explicitely states you'll work with gem tips (which could be surely some freely done translation, but it would make sense not to randomly apply a gem-enchantment to something without a gem tip). We'll have to take a look for how it will work out.
- Gravite bow/crossbow: If the bow were to generate its own ammunition, the crossbow will have to do so as well. For t55 non-quiver ammunition a solution could be buffing up god arrows and bows to this tier (as they both would certainly perform significantly better in a niche tier rather than a main tier). Improvements: Tooltip / (F2P) QoL v2
Quick Fixes: Invention

16-Jan-2018 08:09:53

schlesy

Posts: 123 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Original message details are unavailable.

1.6 Cooking:

- The healing value of pizzas is increased to 700 for plain, 800 for meat, 900 for anchovy and 1000 for pineapple per slice
While I do understand the idea of boosting the pizza to round numbers, in my feeling making pizza healing as much as swordfish, which are the 2nd best food for f2p is too strong. Not to mention anchovy gets up to 1800 while the best f2p food is currently bottles of wine which gives 1500. If you are basing it on the older values, then pineapple should be 1100 per slice. I would go for 550, 650, 750, and 1000, allowing it be equal to best f2p (and even better than, under the expensive spices effect.
Btw, What about the cakes? I would boost them also to 400 and 500 per slice, leading to 1200 for whole cake and 1500 for chocolate cake. Expensive spices effect would raise them 1350 and 1650(making chocolate cake most healing in one inventory space with spices).

In a different note, I was thinking about your claim about all mage cloths being monster drops, and I agree we need a way around it. So I have some half-baked approaches, and would like your feedback about it:
Tier 1:Wool cloth - Sheared(as currently)
Tier 10:Imphide cloth - Add an imp familiar, requires level 5 summoning, gold charm, and any bead. While I would like to use the hunter skill as with the next tier, hunting imps already exist in a different implementation, therefore moving to a summoning solution. The imp will give a boost to thieving(+1 hidden level) and the scroll will allow it to forage an imphide, 1 per scroll.
Tier 20:Spider silk - Catching small spiders bare handed at max f2p hunter level(up to 20) each spider is able to generate 1 spider silk until it is exhausted and dropped.
I still cant think of a solution for bats unless hunter can be leveled more than other member skills in f2p.
I do think that mystic cloth may be coming from farming a textile, like in duneoneering. p2p probably

16-Jan-2018 09:20:31

schlesy

Posts: 123 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Original message details are unavailable.
Seeing the whole array of the t50 slayer weapons: I do not think it would hurt if they would deal higher than usual damage (50 requirement in the respective style for t55 damage) - it is a legitimate tool within the eoc and could in here perfectly accomodate the slayer level required compared to plain runite weapons

http://oldschoolrunescape.wikia.com/wiki/Rune_spear
http://oldschoolrunescape.wikia.com/wiki/Leaf-bladed_spear

At least for the spears it seemed like it had higher stats pre-eoc. In RS3 the leaf-bladed spear strikes faster than the rune spear, which also should translate into higher ability damage. I am not entirely sure how high its ends, but if it were to balance in at t55 it already would be fine. I looked up the os wiki now, and it seems so unbalanced, I would prefer to ignore it currently. I would note that the sword is comparable to dragon sword, beating its stats, yet lower strength bonus.
Original message details are unavailable.
- Gravite bow/crossbow: If the bow were to generate its own ammunition, the crossbow will have to do so as well. For t55 non-quiver ammunition a solution could be buffing up god arrows and bows to this tier (as they both would certainly perform significantly better in a niche tier rather than a main tier).
God bows are already requiring ranged(and defence) of 55. So all really needed is to make the arrows require level 55 in ranged, as their power, and make them f2p. Still, we haven't solved tier 45, 65 and all newer half-tiers we would create from sighted bows. Also the solution is not useful for Ironmen, and the God arrows are said to have a special effect. I guess they could mark the special effect to work only in member worlds, just like special attacks.

16-Jan-2018 09:52:42

schlesy

Posts: 123 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Original message details are unavailable.
1.1.4 Prayer:

- Make Retribution, Redemption and Smite available to f2p
- Allow free players to learn Chivalry and new ranged/magic equivalents via a skill tome found in the gilded cabbage coffin in the tomb of the fallen. Members can still additionally learn them by completing the Knight Training Grounds. The prayers replace the lower tiered variants as soon as players have unlocked them and fulfill the prayer requirement.

I'd be happy to understand why it feels neccesary to make these prayers f2p. Also, why not make Rapid Renewal f2p, and make it replace Rapid Heal as soon as players have unlocked it and fulfilled the prayer requirement?

16-Jan-2018 10:06:38

Oct

2013

Rikornak

Posts: 9,169 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I wouldn't see swordfish (1400 hp) to be devalued to much if it was to be outperformed by pizzas (1400 plain, 1600 meat, 1800 anchovy - over 2 bites each), chocolate cakes (1500 - over 3 bites) and cheese potatoes (1600): The effort to make them is quite a bit higher than just to cook a few stacks of fish - so they would naturally be still the thing to go for when you need food, but not the best what you potentially could be getting. I do no longer know from which I've compiled my pizza numbers, but we can actually go for the pre-eoc numbers (times 10) - the same thing with cakes: For this the plain pizza also would have restored the same as a swordfish, albeit just over those two bites

I do also not really see the expensive spices as a viable choice for combat (unless used as a switch for combat), but they are not too bad for thieving, agility and certain quests - albeit those all are p2p only. All in all the existince of this item shouldn't be taken into consideration for the base power of this stuff, it would be an extra (as it also existed pre-eoc already). Non-ironmen f2p would stick to an amulet of power from a point very soon after starting the game, p2ps even a glory one. Ironmen would probably go for the amulet of potency and accordingly upgrade later on.

Alternative cloth sources could be an interesting concept for a later point, but it would certainly need some work to get it properly implemented (also in here again for potentially future higher tiers). Improvements: Tooltip / (F2P) QoL v2
Quick Fixes: Invention

16-Jan-2018 10:31:54 - Last edited on 16-Jan-2018 10:50:39 by Rikornak

Oct

2013

Rikornak

Posts: 9,169 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Using pre-eoc values for balancing is rarely a good idea, agreed on that - but it can be used as an orientation point. If the eoc did one thing right, than it was the tier system. What of course was lost was the uniqueness of each item - but the eoc allows for more than enough tools to give same tiered items a niche either: Slightly higher/lower than usual stats (the latter should albeit only be used for items that are easier than regularly obtained and only on high tiers) - players shouldn't suddenly be able to use t80 stuff without requirements again, passive effects and set bonuses, special attacks, shifting stats (increased accuracy at the cost of damage like done for the gwd2 t85 stuff - or vice versa),...

- God bows/arrows: This more was intended for p2p - and maybe they could work better as shortbows (while the composite bows are buffed up to a x5 niche as well) - that certainly is a lot of stuff that could be looked at when basic tierscape is fixed

- Prayers: I didn't added Rapid Renewal as it is a bit too high levelled. I try to draw the line from f2p to p2p roughly around level 60 content. It isn't really fun having to grind through to low levelled stuff in order to unlock features. A replacement in its current form wouldn't work either as it consumes significantly more prayer points than rapid heal, but would be a good idea if the costs of renewal are brought down to the levels of heal - and the healing factor was reduced to x3 (instead of 5) Improvements: Tooltip / (F2P) QoL v2
Quick Fixes: Invention

16-Jan-2018 10:40:59

schlesy

Posts: 123 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Original message details are unavailable.
- Prayers: I didn't added Rapid Renewal as it is a bit too high levelled. I try to draw the line from f2p to p2p roughly around level 60 content. It isn't really fun having to grind through to low levelled stuff in order to unlock features. A replacement in its current form wouldn't work either as it consumes significantly more prayer points than rapid heal, but would be a good idea if the costs of renewal are brought down to the levels of heal - and the healing factor was reduced to x3 (instead of 5) Drain rates are increased in every Replacment, as could be noticed here:
http://runescape.wikia.com/wiki/Incredible_Reflexes
http://runescape.wikia.com/wiki/Improved_Reflexes
http://runescape.wikia.com/wiki/Clarity_of_Thought

Comparing the stats with the draining to the Rapid Heal and Rapid Renewal, it is actually the same ratio of the other lowest tier and highest tier replacements. Of course, the wiki might be outdated about the current draining rates.
Also, in my opinion, perhaps to level could be lowered, as the level difference is much higher than other prayer differences. Following these differences its level should have been 22+(45-9=36) we would get to 58. As such, it could be lowered to this level which is in the f2p range.
Also in consideration: Why not remove Rapid renewal from dungeoneering rewards into the direct gameplay? The task which uses it could be switched to use the new quick home teleport within Daemonheim.

16-Jan-2018 12:02:42

Oct

2013

Rikornak

Posts: 9,169 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I do not think you can compare those prayers like that: While you would naturally use the most powerful combat prayer you've got available, the regeneration ones are something you'd use with moderate incoming damage (likely again thieving and agility). The issue in here would be that renewal would only be useable in a situation where you've got an altar, but no bank available (and the only I case I can recall that would be in the underground pass at a point on which you shouldn't have it available yet). All in all, it would feel like a downgrade if it replaces heal in its current form.

Furthermore the proportions are off: While the strongest single stat prayer has three times the effect for ten times the cost, regeneration would be 2.5 for 10 times. I guess to keep it useful they should lower the drain to 1 point every 4 seconds and the regeneration to 3 times. Enabling combat regeneration with it also wouldn't hurt.

Also I do not see why it would needed to be removed from the dungeoneering rewards: It could be an ability upgrade just like the mutated dazing shot from shattered worlds. Maybe-ish it also could upgrade the health regeneration of fortitude to 3 times as well as an extra. Improvements: Tooltip / (F2P) QoL v2
Quick Fixes: Invention

17-Jan-2018 08:00:30

schlesy

Posts: 123 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Original message details are unavailable.
1.1.4 Prayer:
- Allow free players to learn Chivalry and new ranged/magic equivalents via a skill tome found in the gilded cabbage coffin in the tomb of the fallen. Members can still additionally learn them by completing the Knight Training Grounds. The prayers replace the lower tiered variants as soon as players have unlocked them and fulfill the prayer requirement.

1.2 Dungeoneering:

- Free players are granted access to the Varrock Sewer and Al Kharid resource dungeons at level 65 and 75 in order to allow them to obtain magic logs and semi-precious gems respectively.
I figured now a problem with the replacement. The Amulet of zealots doesn't work with these higher prayers, but does work with the lower prayers. Replacement of the prayers would render the amulet useless in high f2p. I'd suggest removing the replacment, but maybe replace them with the tier 70 from Knight Training Grounds. It would need to be replaced back when the person becomes f2p again.

On a different note, I understand you consider level 75 as f2p content for dungeoneering? Or it is simply because of the newly addition of semi-precious gems to f2p?

17-Jan-2018 08:18:20

Oct

2013

Rikornak

Posts: 9,169 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I considered the dungeon for f2p for multiple reasons

- As dungeoneering has 120 levels, the experience rates and potential maximum is higher than for any other skill, as a matter of fact the last free floor unlocked is done so at level 69. This surely doesn't lead to optimal experience rates, but on the other hand free players aren't required to grind through extremely low levelled content
- Furthermore the ability to acquire experience rises with every progressed level, which is fairly unique when no new features are unlocked
- The dungeon also just would offer an additional source for semi precious gems besides the dwarven army axe, not the sole one

For the prayer: Fair point, I'll adjust it accordingly Improvements: Tooltip / (F2P) QoL v2
Quick Fixes: Invention

17-Jan-2018 08:47:50 - Last edited on 17-Jan-2018 08:48:16 by Rikornak

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(F2P) QoL Improvements v2