RuneScape Forum Archive | 120 Summoning Familiar Ideas

Deltaslug

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My appologies for introducing a competing design theory.
I had this on Reddit.

But see what you think:
Personally, I'm not entirely for this. To exclude a "I don't want to grind yet another skill that high" reason. Part of the problem in my Point of View is that Jagex would need to create at least 20 distinct new Summoining Familiars.

Also, I'm not sure where balancing would come in. Players won't get behind a massive jump in requirements only to get skilling familiars that only increase efficiency by 1%, combat familiars that only up dps by 2%, and beasts of burden that are only +4 inventory spaces over the Pack Mammoth.

In addition, we are currently lacking in alternative training methods for directly gaining Summoning XP. Pretty much: make pouches, weekly capping if in a clan citadel, xp rewards (ie: quests, TH), and scant/trace amounts for using movement scrolls.

Flaws aside, Jagex mentioned doing something like "Ancient Summoning" or splicing together familiars. If you think about it, they are kinda taking a page from what they did in Invention.

So what are some of the changes?

Familiars

Rather than creating 30 (or more) unique designs, developers could focus on 3 or 4 core designs with minor differences between then.

Combat - melee, range, magic, and hybrid variants

Skilling - Passive and active boosts/support variants

Support - Beast of Burden, Healer, etc variants

Misc - for those familiars that kinda fall in the oddball category (ie: forager)

The number of models would be cut down, but would still be distinctive enough to know what each one does.

07-Nov-2018 23:44:23

Deltaslug

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Leveling

Rather than just using Pack Yak pouches all the time, or a specific combat familiar, the Level of the more generic familiar would scale up to your Summoning Level.

So if your Summoning Level was 115, you could create familiars that would scale up to Level 115 ... but ... you would have a probability of creating familiars that were levels below that (ie: 112, 111, etc). This would fall in line with the player's chances of getting say a tier 5 perk in Invention vs a Tier 4 or 3.

Attuning your familiar

In Invention, we toss random components into the gizmo shells to try to get certain perks. Higher/rarer tier components are more likely to get a certain perk or combination that lower tier components.

A similiar thing happens here. You can toss in multiple Iron Titan pouches to improve your odds of getting a higher tier melee familiar. Or throw in multiple Pack Yaks or Pack Mammoths to get a higher tier Beast of Burden.

The level/tier of the familiar would then determine it's stats.

So a Level 115 Beast of Burden carries more items than a Level 110. A Level 115 Melee can dish out more damage than a Level 110.

Mixing and Matching

Just like Invention, nothing is stopping you from trying to get random perks from the materials you toss in.

Want a melee familiar that also boosts your own DPS? You could toss in 5 Blood Nihil pouches for a chance at a Melee Familiar that gives you more than a 5% boost at the expense of dealing less melee dmg than a 5 x Iron Titan fed familiar. Conversely, you could try to mix several Iron Titans and Blood Nihils to balance out the strength of the familiar and the increase in dmg you do.

Note: These are only examples.

What about the lower level familiars?

Developers may need to disregard the chances of the familiars below Level 50 influencing the leveling attributes of what you create.

07-Nov-2018 23:44:40

Deltaslug

Posts: 32,671 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

What about the lower level familiars?

Developers may need to disregard the chances of the familiars below Level 50 influencing the leveling attributes of what you create.

You may be able to get the creature's effect (ie: Spirit Wolve's Howl ability or Dreadfowl's ability to boost Farming) but it shouldn't be used to determine the difference between a Level 110 and Level 119 familiar.

Movement Scrolls

One minor drawback to the current Summoning skill is that all of the movement scrolls are dependent on the unique familiar. There isn't a generic scroll for all combat moves or all skilling moves.

Here, we would need to create 3 or 4 distinct types of movement scrolls to go with each type of familiar. So all combat familiars would utilize the same pool of combat movement scrolls, regardless of their combat style. Skilling familiars too would use their own pool of skilling movement scrolls regardless if they helped you passively or actively. New Charms

Right now, we have 5 charms used in the creation of pouches: Gold, Green, Crimson, Blue, and Elder. (There are Obsidian, Talon Beast, and Abyssal, but those are used as Summoning Ingredients.)

It's possible that a new tier of charm(s) would need to be added.

If so, players would need to have the ability to gather them either from combat, hunter, other skilling methods, and/or being able to transmute Blue Charms.

It is possible that we could try to do this without the creation of a new charm (afterall, this theory is suggesting that we consume Summoning Pouches, which is pretty cost intensive to start with.)

07-Nov-2018 23:44:56

Deltaslug

Posts: 32,671 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Summoning XP

In line with Invention, players would get Summoning XP in 2 methods.

1) The creation of the new familiar. With the tier of the pouches you toss in, much like the XP rating for the different components in Invention, players would gain a base amount of XP for creating their new familiar (or monstrosity).

Note: players should be able to do something with the familiar pouch afterwards. Disassemble it, being able to swap it for a large number of shards, or getting a chunk of added Summoning XP to trade it in to a certain NPC.

2) Summoning Familiar "XP". Much like how your tool, weapon, or armor gains item xp when you use it, the Summoning Familiar would also gain "xp". When you're done with your familiar, you can dismiss it (or some mechanic) to gain an added chunk of Summoning XP for all the familiar's hard work.

Note: this would probably mean having a mechanic in place similar to the Charge Pack and Divine Charges used in Invention.

I do apologize if this might not seem too original of an idea since it borrows heavily from existing mechanics in game.

Oddball/random example:

07-Nov-2018 23:45:08

Deltaslug

Posts: 32,671 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Player is Level 119 in Summoning.

They opt to combine several Macaw Pouches, Bunyip Pouches, and an Abyssal Lurker Pouch.

These familiars have the following abilities:

increase chance of better herb drop

forage for herbs/seeds

special move to get an herb

heal over time

transmute fish into water runes

special move to eat a raw fish to heal (if you have the cooking level)

carry rune ess

special move to boost thieving

The familiar's abilities would pull from the list, and the familiar's special move would pull from 1 of the 3.

You could combine them and end up with:

Level 111 pure ess BoB that transmute's fish into water runes and special move to get an herb

Level 117 thieving boosting familiar that can heal over time

07-Nov-2018 23:45:21

Legendair

Posts: 1,141 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

i love the amount of work you put into this post, however i dont see a need for 120 summoning, why not just rework the current summoning skill with all your ideas put into place? think about how many summoning familiars are currently in game that are completely useless. i say remove them or rework them to make them relevant but of course this is just my opinion.

Legendair

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Runescape mobile please

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RIP Darkscape

08-Nov-2018 02:04:50

Aug

2023

UrekMazino

Posts: 7,214 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

@Yusou Bhoroi For the tertiaries, I'm not too particular about what they should be, as long as it makes sense. Some of the elemental titans I suggested have blood and death tally as their tertiary ingredient. I think that invention would be the best sink for tallies since a useful/unique comp can remove a lot of an item from the game. That said, I am aware of the impact of summoning as an item sink by just looking at the price of water tally. One way to circumvent the crash in price would be to make the titans that use tally and a tert more useful/powerful so that people will still make them for PvM/skilling purposes.

As for your other ideas, I'll add them if you could perhaps flesh them out a little more. The tele a friend one can actually be really useful, reminds me of Warlock portal gate from WoW, a much better version of the gorup tele that we have. °l||l° Modest Skillers T7 Citadel | Skilling clan recruiting players. °l||l°
•ï¡÷¡ï• Cwar United for CW games/Ardy task/Trim req. •ï¡÷¡ï•
120 Summoning Familiar ideas .

08-Nov-2018 07:36:23

Aug

2023

UrekMazino

Posts: 7,214 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

@Deltaslug

Part of the problem in my Point of View is that Jagex would need to create at least 20 distinct new Summoining Familiars.

20? I've got over a hundred in this post, you can definitely find 20 "distinct" familiars.

Players won't get behind a massive jump in requirements only to get skilling familiars that only increase efficiency by 1%, combat familiars that only up dps by 2%, and beasts of burden that are only +4 inventory spaces over the Pack Mammoth.

You're right, the players are in no way obliged to further train their summoning level if they feel that the new benefits are not worth getting.

In addition, we are currently lacking in alternative training methods for directly gaining Summoning XP.

Same can be said for divination, but that's not really a problem, is it? Plus, this thread isn't for discussion whether 120 summoning should be a thing but rather just a compilation of familiar ideas for the theoretical scenario where summoning was raised to level 120. Of course, any ideas for alternate training methods would be great.

Rather than just using Pack Yak pouches all the time, or a specific combat familiar, the Level of the more generic familiar would scale up to your Summoning Level.

That would be a bit like the existing DG familiars then, same model but reskined for each tier. Only difference is that they don't scale. The problem here is then how would you fix the tertiaries? °l||l° Modest Skillers T7 Citadel | Skilling clan recruiting players. °l||l°
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120 Summoning Familiar ideas .

08-Nov-2018 07:51:37

Aug

2023

UrekMazino

Posts: 7,214 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

So if your Summoning Level was 115, you could create familiars that would scale up to Level 115 ... but ... you would have a probability of creating familiars that were levels below that

This one is just bad, this kind of mechanism is more of a frustration than a engaging mechanic. If I want to make a BoB that can hold 30 items, I will make one that holds 30 items, I don't want to get bad RNG and make a BoB that holds less and then have to get rid of it and make more pouches because I didn't manage to make the amount of pouches I needed due to bad RNG. This isn't like Invention where perks are permanent, pouches are a one time use thing.

Attuning your familiar

Could be interesting as an item sink but we already have invention as an item sink and can swap the pouches for spirit shards anyways.

Mixing and Matching

Same as above, pouches are a one time use thing and would be frustrating if you don't always get what you want, Invention is a different story.

One minor drawback to the current Summoning skill is that all of the movement scrolls are dependent on the unique familiar. There isn't a generic scroll for all combat moves or all skilling moves.

I don't see this as a drawback but rather a game mechanic that makes sense. Why should my Bunyip be able to use Titan Constitution ability?

Skilling familiars too would use their own pool of skilling movement scrolls regardless if they helped you passively or actively. New Charms

I can get behind this. °l||l° Modest Skillers T7 Citadel | Skilling clan recruiting players. °l||l°
•ï¡÷¡ï• Cwar United for CW games/Ardy task/Trim req. •ï¡÷¡ï•
120 Summoning Familiar ideas .

08-Nov-2018 07:58:00

Aug

2023

UrekMazino

Posts: 7,214 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

They opt to combine several Macaw Pouches, Bunyip Pouches, and an Abyssal Lurker Pouch.

Sounds way too op, imagine being able to combine Titan, Nihil, Yak, and Bunyip/Unicorn effects/actives. Imagine a 32 slot BoB that gives 5% more accuracy, imagine a Titan that deals high damage and gives you 5% more accuracy, imagine 32 slot BoB that can heal you over time.

@Legendair
That's a bit unfair because most lower level players don't make use of summoning and at higher levels, the low/mid level familiars become obsolete. That'd would almost be like saying bronze armour is useless because it is becoming increasingly easy to level up and its not worth to bother getting bronze armour, plus new players will get pathfinder amour anyways. Does that mean we need to remove or rework bronze? No. How often do you find a player skipping past a tier of armour because its expensive or hard to obtain, I'd say quite common. Same thing with the low level familiars. °l||l° Modest Skillers T7 Citadel | Skilling clan recruiting players. °l||l°
•ï¡÷¡ï• Cwar United for CW games/Ardy task/Trim req. •ï¡÷¡ï•
120 Summoning Familiar ideas .

08-Nov-2018 07:59:58 - Last edited on 08-Nov-2018 08:09:07 by UrekMazino

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120 Summoning Familiar Ideas