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PvP, Rebirth, and Good Faith

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H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I absolutely love the idea of bringing in other opinions outside of the company as well. I remember being kind of impressed when they announced they were bringing in economics minds to analyze the economies of both RS3 and Old School and getting feedback from them. (Hopefully our side of the community gets some news on what it means for RS3 sometime soon, as that's probably a fairly more prominent issue at the moment across the game.)

When talking about Esports - I am remembering the one time RS3 attempted a PvM Survival mode - Dimension of the Damned - that went horribly wrong and has kind of been the last time the RS3 team has attempted something like that. In fairness to those folks - Deadman Mode routinely sees its fair share of headaches. Like DarkScape, DotD is absolutely something they could try again - along with say - other PvP oriented competitions that would place an emphasis on comparing skill and would incur no risk to their main game progress.

One of the things about RuneScape 3 is that it always seems to play it safe. Questing is a positive experience? "Let's make every update revolve around the active narrative." RS3 is the pinnacle of the game's progression system? "Let's make abilities feel particularly natural when doing PvM." Not a lot of people interested in PvP? "Let's ignore it because the payoff isn't so clear or immediate."

Jagex, if you're doing me the honor of stopping by. Take your chances! Make mistakes! RuneScape is a multi-decade old brand. It's got the stock necessary to be bold. Trust in it, and give it time. Especially regarding PvP if it's still in the cards!
Quest Cape Owner since 2021

Maxed
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30-Apr-2022 21:51:12

I am Test

I am Test

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Really happy about the opt-in announcement. That's a hugely important and very long awaited modernization of this game. At last normal players will be able to enjoy this vast unused area that is the Wilderness again. This area should belong to all players, to the 99.9% of skillers, PvM'ers, questers, peng and clue hunters, rather than being monopolized by a tiny minority of disgusting griefers who call themselves a 'PvP community'.

I do hope that this will finally be the beginning of the permanent end of PvP in this game. PvP has no place in RS3 anymore.

01-May-2022 02:34:54

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I am Test said :
Really happy about the opt-in announcement. That's a hugely important and very long awaited modernization of this game. At last normal players will be able to enjoy this vast unused area that is the Wilderness again. This area should belong to all players, to the 99.9% of skillers, PvM'ers, questers, peng and clue hunters, rather than being monopolized by a tiny minority of disgusting griefers who call themselves a 'PvP community'.

I do hope that this will finally be the beginning of the permanent end of PvP in this game. PvP has no place in RS3 anymore.

First of all, I really do appreciate the free bump, pal - stick around and debate if you'd like.

"At last normal players will be able to enjoy the Wilderness again"

All players have ALWAYS been able to enjoy what the Wilderness has to offer. If anything, Pkers are the ones who have had content wrested away from them in the area throughout the game's history. There's always been skilling resources and PvM encounters there to engage with. Whether or not you engage with the content has been your choice. Most of the unique Wilderness resources are there because of the risk, and everything else has an alternative elsewhere in the game.

"This area should belong to all players."

I agree with this.

...rather than the minority of "griefers" who call themselves a 'PvP community'.

This isn't accurate. There are players who still engage with Clan Wars, players who set up PvP events on social media to provide life to dead mini games like Castle Wars, Pkers who fight other Pkers during Wilderness Warbands. Solo Pkers who kill skillers because that's all they find in the Wilderness are not the only ones who engage with PvP content - and it can be argued that jumping north of the wall is in it of itself "opting in" to said content.

"PvP has no place in RS3 anymore."

Why?
Quest Cape Owner since 2021

Maxed
- July 31st, 2022

01-May-2022 04:17:01 - Last edited on 01-May-2022 05:03:00 by H 1 L D A

A 5 H

A 5 H

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I've been playing this game for almost 20 years now and i know for a fact that wilderness pking will explode if they remove EOC as soon as you step into wildy.

Just like your cosmetic overlay is removed upon stepping into level 1 wild, remove EoC and bring back the wilderness nostalgia. we all remember the dragon dagger special meta fights, which were 50% skill 50% luck

The game wont admit its become way too complicated for players that fell in love with a simple game.

Offer a few more cosmetic upgrades like they did with the wildstaker helmets. maybe kill streak rewards for the chance to open a chest with unique rewards!

ive played allot of mmorpg and rs3 feels like the clunkiest rusty skill bar game ive played. great for bossing but horrible in pvp.

01-May-2022 10:53:08

Hispid Gnome
Nov Member 2011

Hispid Gnome

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just to clarify when I was talking about bringing in outside consultants I was only talking about them looking at the actual pvp mechanics not (for now anyway) even considering any sort of event. Looking at the abilities and making sure they have the right effects and are balanced, how much damage they should do, how much accuracy and how they can be evaded. That sort of thing. I would rather see Jagex put dev time into making the pvp combat system feel nice than make some stupid game that noone plays because they don't like the combat system.

also... As for DarkScape it was perfectly fine till Infamous Traitors lived up to their name and double crossed Wilderness Guardians and sided with Requiem!!!!!
There are 10 types of people in this world. Those that understand binary and those that don't.

01-May-2022 14:59:57

I am Test

I am Test

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H 1 L D A said :

All players have ALWAYS been able to enjoy what the Wilderness has to offer.

Not my definition of the term enjoy . Of course these parasitic griefers stalking and repeatedly killing skillers, peng hunters or simply someone who just minding himself to get a quest or slayer task done would probably 'enjoy' this activity. You might have a hard time understanding this, but their victims don't particularly enjoy this.

H 1 L D A said :

and it can be argued that jumping north of the wall is in it of itself "opting in" to said content.

Ah yes, the old argument that you willingly became a victim by crossing the border. Welp. Now Jagex is going to change this and will give us a global opt in. Deal with it. I certainly will.

H 1 L D A said :

"PvP has no place in RS3 anymore."
Why?
Look at the numbers. There's nothing much more to say about this. Sometimes you need to face reality and reality is that times are changing. There's no money for Jagex in PvP anymore, especially as it drives legitimate players away. The PvP griefers always told us normal players we would need to adapt to their personal gameplay so that they could enjoy the game at our costs. Guess what. Now they'll have to adapt to us. And that's a good thing. Because we're the 99% who keep RS and Jagex alive with our cash.

01-May-2022 20:26:20

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@A 5 H

Legacy Combat and Legacy Only PvP Worlds actually already exist! Unfortunately, I think that means that simply having the older combat system be the only useable system out there hasn't done much to compete with Old School RuneScape successfully, nor does it seem like that would bring Pkers back over to RuneScape 3 alone. If only it -were- that simple though, right?

@Hispid Gnome

I caught that, but I might have gotten a little tangential there. Abilities absolutely need to be looked at significantly in terms of PvP balancing - that much you are definitely right about and then some. Sorry!

@I am Test

I literally have a Lava Strykewyrm task right now - and a daily challenge for today was Slayer. I busted out 10 kills out in level 38 or so Wilderness unimpeded by anyone. Made a cool 2m gp off the ashes. The only person stopping you from enjoying the content out there already is yourself, like I had said before. I don't know why waiting for the ability to opt-out of PvP for what will be a few months at the very least makes any sense whatsoever if you are so sure the amount of Pkers out there is so small it isn't worth Jagex's time to make content for them!

I'm not bothered at all by the upcoming Wilderness changes. The much less talked about info drop about the Wilderness update this fall is PvM-focused. If this is basically having similar kinds of Wilderness bosses Old School has, especially if they can avoid having them be so broken the meta is to safespot them like it is in Old School, and especially if you can opt-out of being killed by Pkers while taking them on, that would be a really cool update.

However, you should know that there are more people out there engaging in PvP content than solo Pkers preying on skillers. It was almost as if you made a point out of ignoring when I pointed that out because you know you're being deceitful.
Quest Cape Owner since 2021

Maxed
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01-May-2022 20:46:37 - Last edited on 01-May-2022 20:52:55 by H 1 L D A

I am Test

I am Test

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H 1 L D A said :
It was almost as if you made a point out of ignoring when I pointed that out because you know you're being deceitful.
*shrug*

Honestly, and I realize that may sound egotistical, but I really don't care about them. From my perspective, any PvP related update is a waste of Jagex resources that would be better spent somewhere else where it benefits everybody rather than a tiny minority. Again from my perspective the Wilderness is a huge unused mapspace that could be used for so many other new content rather than being wasted on a dying species so desperately clutching onto the past that they completely missed how the world around them changed.

If you want to PvP, go to OSRS. Or sure, try to fight the roadmap. Who am I to deny someone the moral right to fight against their inevitable extinction. Just understand that I would welcome your end, because it starts a world of interesting opportunities for players like me.

01-May-2022 21:07:16

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@I am Test

I mean, that much was pretty plain.

My goal isn't to fight the roadmap. All the roadmap tells us to this point is that the Wilderness will have a new PvM focus and that players will get to choose whether they want to be able to attack/be attacked by other players while in the area. Nobody, PvMers, Skillers, and Pkers, is worried about the fact that Jagex is looking to add content to the area.

There isn't anything to suggest that Jagex is even remotely trying to sabotage PvP as you seem to hope for. What if - for example - Jagex doesn't take the opportunity to engage with the player base at all and decides to just go radio silent until release day, where we find out the following.

You can opt into PvP when crossing the wall, however...

- Players who opt-in to PvP receive a flat xp buff for all skills trained while in the Wilderness, which makes opting-out of PvP being deliberately inefficient.

- Players who opt-in to PvP receive double drop rate for new unique items dropped by whatever new PvM opportunities exist after the update launches. These items include top-tier gear, and the rates bad enough that you're going to want to double them, while good enough that doubling the rate will make it reasonable to farm.

- Players who opt-in to PvP get to ignore whatever new dangerous foes or environs are introduced in this update to maintain the lack of relative safety an area like the Wilderness is supposed to have.

...among other things that would make "opting-in" not very much of a real choice. Sure, the Wilderness may have a bunch of cool new content, but if you actually want to do any of it in an enjoyable manner, you still have to put up with those Pkers you by self admission don't care for.

Pkers may come to this thread and say "those are good ideas!" - but they are ones that would be balanced poorly. At the very least, we can agree that Jagex should communicate with us on how this update drops - yes?
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01-May-2022 21:26:48

PvPMatter
Apr Member 2023

PvPMatter

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I hope that this brings the eventual rebirth of Minigames as well.
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01-May-2022 21:28:47

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