RuneScape Forum Archive | 'Fresher' Start Worlds '2'

Hueless

Posts: 94 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

"

Please go check how low the percentages of RD3

[RS3?]

players are in Legacy Only Worlds, The mechanics are totally different between Legacy and EOC/Revolution Modes too.

"

As someone who regularly hops between Legacy and EOC worlds, it's not *that* different mechanically. Much simpler, actually. Anyone who can handle Revolution should be able to learn Legacy.

The main issues are that Revolution combat tends to be more efficient (more xp/GP over time), and some post-EOC combat content is outright impossible to do in Legacy because they weren't designed for it. As such, attempting those things on Legacy worlds is mostly pointless. There's also the issue of losing Surge as a movement option, which impacts non-combat activities.

And for players who are doing things that don't require combat or even Surge, it can just be a social matter. If you want to hang out around people, and most people don't want to be in Legacy worlds, then you aren't going to hang out in those worlds, either.

26-Aug-2022 20:50:36

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,176 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

@H 1 L D A

Players can play over 9,000 games all with fun but if they all use over 9,000 different characters with over 9,000 profiles, with non-transferrable stats/items they are always over 9,000 different games.

That said, not saying the like of Darkscape will never be fun in RS3 or even more so in OSRS in that respect, but it can only be a different game if they don't share any data and pixels.

26-Aug-2022 21:28:17

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,176 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Hueless said :
"

Please go check how low the percentages of RD3

[RS3?]

players are in Legacy Only Worlds, The mechanics are totally different between Legacy and EOC/Revolution Modes too.

"

As someone who regularly hops between Legacy and EOC worlds, it's not *that* different mechanically. Much simpler, actually. Anyone who can handle Revolution should be able to learn Legacy.

The main issues are that Revolution combat tends to be more efficient (more xp/GP over time), and some post-EOC combat content is outright impossible to do in Legacy because they weren't designed for it. As such, attempting those things on Legacy worlds is mostly pointless. There's also the issue of losing Surge as a movement option, which impacts non-combat activities.

And for players who are doing things that don't require combat or even Surge, it can just be a social matter. If you want to hang out around people, and most people don't want to be in Legacy worlds, then you aren't going to hang out in those worlds, either.

Wouldn't Darkscape be a better game mode for OSRS if it got resurrected then?

26-Aug-2022 21:29:53

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

In regards to your discussion with Hueless, Dilbert, maybe. They could also just revamp DarkScape and roll with the EoC system if there is a concern the combat system is too dated for the current playerbase to recognize.

Old School probably doesn't have as much as of a 'need' for a PvP-everywhere mode because Deadman Mode is a very similar concept, operated seasonally with a focus on climbing the ranks so that one can shoot to be the very best. (If there's a reason DMM isn't permanent, I don't know why that is, maybe currency swapping or something, not a usual participant.)

I think DarkScape is something Jagex could bring back for RS3 though. There is next to no reason to PvP in the main game because either the risk is too high or there isn't anyone to fight depending on where you're looking. If there are players who like PvP in RS3, it's been a while since they have gotten content that has successfully held their interest -and/or- satisfied their style of play.

Of course, (just reining in the conversation here back to rewards in FSW), I would not want something like a skilling pet skin or cape override to be locked behind a game mode that would require player skill to be a certain premium. You don't need to be a sweat to get 99/120 in a skill, and it just requires luck to earn a skilling pet.

Quest Cape Owner since 2021

Maxed

- July 31st, 2022

26-Aug-2022 21:54:27 - Last edited on 26-Aug-2022 21:55:56 by H 1 L D A

Mar

2014

Jazz X

Posts: 147 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I'm constantly amazed by people who seem to think RS can be/should be free. What do you think developers live on stream water and air?

Every time you complain about Jagex doing something that's relatively "fair" it only forces us closer to them having to charge for items in game. Which I assure you you won't like at all if your shallow enough to be complaining over people earning a few cosmetics or having a new account they leveled fast by paying when IT DOES NOT AFFECT YOU AT ALL!

You want to do the same, fine sign up, you don't? then keep playing and don't say anything, or leave now please so we don't have to hear the completely un-realistic prattle about how it should be free. It can't be free, they have to pay people to make and maintain the game!

But sure, keep complaining about "nice" things like Fresh Start which are optional. It won't take long till they have to add things in regular RS that you "have" to buy to play if you stop them from making money in "nice" ways. And won't that be fun?

26-Aug-2022 22:52:51 - Last edited on 27-Aug-2022 00:43:36 by Jazz X

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,176 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

H 1 L D A said :

Of course, (just reining in the conversation here back to rewards in FSW), I would not want something like a skilling pet skin or cape override to be locked behind a game mode that would require player skill to be a certain premium. You don't need to be a sweat to get 99/120 in a skill, and it just requires luck to earn a skilling pet.

Where did Jagex say skilling pet skin or cape override will be loked behind FSW (which, again, is not a game mode)? All I see what they wrote is:

"We're committed to ensuring the majority of items from Fresh Start Worlds are available again in the future."

26-Aug-2022 23:19:56

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,176 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Jazz X said :

But sure, keep complaining about "nice" things like Fresh Start which are optional. It won't take long till they have to add things in regular RS that you "have" to buy to play if you stop them from making money in "nice" ways. And won't that be fun?

Jagex have this kind of free player can participate but only members can get the rewards content in the games already. We see free players being able to participate in some events but only members can win/use the rewards like the Spring Festival Butterfly jars in RS3 and lifetime membership from OSRS Boss Bash Raffle. Oh... maybe just an oversight!

As Unity's CEO's words of wisdom to us: game developers don't think about monetization in designing games are <censored> idiots.

26-Aug-2022 23:28:35 - Last edited on 26-Aug-2022 23:32:10 by Dilbert2001

Apr

2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Okay Jazz, before you start calling me shallow let me show you what RuneScape actually looks like, on both sides of the community. It's important to understand this, because I think it's the root of where many players heads are at with regards to F2P.

1. 'RS3' and 'Old School' are both F2P games currently, and RuneScape as it's known within and beyond the community has been a F2P since 2001 (Membership wasn't an available option until it was introduced in early 2002)

2. Fresh Start Worlds is a F2P experience in Old School RuneScape (although the only similarities come in the form of a wiped GE and everyone starting a new account from scratch.)

3. Jagex has cited the reason behind Fresh Start Worlds -not- being F2P as "competition" and "rewards.", along with a simply incorrect quote from a moderator about the game being subscription based. You're going to need to be a member to win the competition regardless, so that reasoning is moot, and as Dilbert alluded to above, you can always lock the rewards behind the paywall -without- blocking the entire experience with it.

4. Microtransactions have already been introduced, so as far as "more aggressive", or "mean" paywalls are concerned - we're already past that point, girl. Some people think it's so egregious that they choose to play as an Ironman simply to avoid seeing the Treasure Hunter screen.

Now, what does all that mean? It means that people have been able to play RuneScape, and even occasionally participate in limited-time events in RuneScape, without an active subscription, for over two decades. I don't think Jagex moderators have routinely starved to death in that timeframe.

I love me some cosmetics. I really do. Fashionscape takes up a good chunk of my in-game day sometimes - but lets not criticize the F2P crowd during a period of celebrating 300 million accounts that are often created by players who didn't pay Jagex to play in the first place.

Quest Cape Owner since 2021

Maxed

- July 31st, 2022

27-Aug-2022 00:40:05

Mar

2014

Jazz X

Posts: 147 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Hilda,

You have good points. The issue is free to play players are not the ones paying for the game.

It's subscription members and TH spins that are paying. And active members have been falling while costs go up.

So what I'm saying is:

If you want RS to stay pretty much as it is, the F2P options you mention, SOMEBODY has to pay for it.

The real questions are whom? and how?

In War of Legends (failed Jagex game) to be a top player cost me $600 a year. I quit when they introduced a single piece of leg armor that you "had" to have to compete and it cost $50.

Is that what you want for RS? It's already failed once and destroyed the underlying game?

So how does Jagex try to make money to maintain and expand the game (and yes make a profit too)?

Fresh Start was a good idea, with the original design it would have been attractive. But apparently so many people complained they've nerfed it already and I don't see it as attractive anymore (I wanted the 120 capes and maybe a gold halo if I could).

So what just happened? Jagex's projected revenue just fell by 20% with the nerf.

Many here think that's great. That's a foolish way of thinking though because if Jagex can't make money one of two things must happen.

The game will die as they can't continue to update and maintain it OR they will have to start charging $5 to do a quest, $10 to unlock the latest weapons, $100 to unlock something that will make you into superwoman. Are you, and others reading, willing to play/pay this way? Where you "have" to pay to play? And if you pay more you get super-powered and can beat those who won't pay for more than a basic subscription?

If not, you should support Fresh Start type type ideas that are "optional" and that only players who want to do whatever it is will be paying for. Because the alternative is to slowly lose what you cited above in F2P and "force" players to pay in game instead.

27-Aug-2022 01:07:24 - Last edited on 27-Aug-2022 01:17:49 by Jazz X

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,176 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

@H 1 L D A

I have to correct you again in several things:

(1) OSRS FSW is not free to play although free players can access. They will still need to pay extra membership to play member content there.

(2) Whether certain content is free to play or requires members is not specific to a game but the desire of Jagex to monetize it. While they allow free player to access OSRS FSW, they don't make the same offer to free players in Leagues, DMM etc where they certain can allow free players to play but they desire to monetize them.

(3) Isolating Ironman from MTX is getting very lame now, as IM are allowed to get heaps and heaps and heaps of MTX benefits like Legendary Pets, Auras, Premier Club items, cosmetics etc, and that's because they asked for those things, not Jagex intentionally let them have them:

Microtransactions
Treasure Hunter is completely disabled.
This includes non-cosmetic items (such as silverhawk boots) which are sometimes obtainable outside Treasure Hunter (like in the Thaler shop or Advent calendar).
Many Treasure Hunter promotions with free aspects are partially completable by ironmen, for example Attack of the Zombie Sprouts allowed ironmen to do the 200 daily fatigue (for experience and to unlock one set of wings) but they could not obtain the additional sprays needed to fully complete the promotion
Wicked pouches, challenge gems and clan citadel boosters cannot be purchased (or used) from Solomon's General Store.
Some Legendary pet features cannot be used: life saver, slayer finisher, repair and fertiliser.
Recruit a Friend does not provide any bonuses to Ironmen (however, those recruited will still get their bonus).
Dwarven instinct aura rewards are reduced.
Mahjarrat aura's 50% monthly boost cannot be used.
Some Desert pantheon aura effects cannot be used: Scabaras, Apmeken.
VIP chat badge cannot be toggled on.
Premier artefact cannot be used to gain 10% increased XP.

https://runescape.wiki/w/Ironman_Mode

27-Aug-2022 02:03:24 - Last edited on 27-Aug-2022 02:21:34 by Dilbert2001

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'Fresher' Start Worlds '2'