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~Woodcutting Rework~

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Deltaslug

Deltaslug

Posts: 32,671 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@A Cole
Absolutely not on degrading, blunting or breaking.

Necronium to Elder Rune Pickaxes and Mattocks don't degrade/break in any way.
The Pickaxe of Earth & Song nor the Mattock of Space & Time degrade in any way.

In addition, they explicitly got rid of the broken hatchets and broken pickaxes from the game back in like 2009 for the reason they were annoying to players and didn't really do anything to combat botting. They were just a nuisance for actual players.

Imagine semi-afking while chopping ivy or an Elder Tree (just long enough to avoid an auto log out) and then only to realize that ... oops ... the tree was an ent ... it damaged your pick axe. The axe head went 5 spaces over. And in the time you turned your attention away ... the axe head disappeared.
A Bane, Elder Rune, or your snazzy augmented T90 tool that combined the Crystal + Imcando Hatchets + some other thing is now ruined and you've lost that piece.
The first time that happens ... you might go "ok ... my fault". But most players won't.
You'll hate the mechanic after the second time. Odds are, that second time happens in under 1 day.

We already get enough inconveniences when competing with bots for resources and the gp/item sink that will be the highest tier woodcutting tool.

09-Aug-2021 05:12:19

Deltaslug

Deltaslug

Posts: 32,671 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
On trees .... tbh ... I think they can keep a lot of trees as they are.
Regular to Maple, Blisterwood, Bloodwood.

The ones that probably needs a change are Yew and Magic.
Just change them up so they use Elder Tree mechanic
Those 2 tree types, yes become Level 40 and 50, but they happen to be uncommon enough around the map that devs don't have to do the location changes they did for mining sites.

Plus low level woodcutting is already pretty easy to level up as it is due to the sheer number of common to willow trees around.

You might get the annoyance of maple trees needing to have something done to help the 30-40 training curve. But it still wouldn't be too awful to keep Willows as they are.

09-Aug-2021 05:17:00

Daddy Roshi
Jan Member 2018

Daddy Roshi

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Ketsujo said :
Bloodwood should follow this suit with Evil Trees. i personally dont think bloodwood trees should be changed mostly due to the wilderness aspect of them all the other ones i can understand though
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09-Aug-2021 07:17:31

A  Cole
Nov Member 2003

A  Cole

Posts: 14,682 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Thanks for your feedback Jaekob.

Ketsujo said :
So if we do a M&S rework on trees...
Trees should have a hardness level and an xp modifier similar to what we see with mining.
Each swing should generate XP, and each successful "gather" should reward a larger chunk of xp, but not soo much that people will literally sit at a standard tree or oak for hours and end up with 70+ WC in a matter of hours.
[...]
Standard, Oak, Willow, Maple, Arctic, Achy, Eucalyptus, Teak, Mahogany, Yew, Blisterwood, Magic, and Bloodwood should follow this suit with Evil Trees. A Health and Stamina bar should also be added so that we can track our progress in obtaining logs and when the tree will no longer be able to produce resources.
[...]
But offering Xp every other swing and full log xp per log obtained, would work better...just saying. Thanks for your feedback Ketsujo.

I agree your suggestion would be a more simplistic approach, meaning less resource will be required to make the changes. It certainly would help in making Woodcutting feel more rewarding, particularly Elder trees.

Gaining XP per swing is a big part of my suggestion as it allows players to feel they're making progress each and every time the hatchet is being swung. XP rates don't necessarily have to increase massively when this is implemented as they can be balanced with the log XP gain. I am in agreement with you here.

If my suggestion is too much work for Jagex to complete, I'd accept your proposal as an alternative. I would prefer to see a more realistic approach however.


~A~

09-Aug-2021 10:07:42

A  Cole
Nov Member 2003

A  Cole

Posts: 14,682 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Deltaslug said :
@A Cole
Absolutely not on degrading, blunting or breaking.
[...]
We already get enough inconveniences when competing with bots for resources and the gp/item sink that will be the highest tier woodcutting tool. I completely understand this, I was just thinking out loud which could spurn more ideas.

I agree that all hatchets should remain non-degradable.

However, I don't see why there couldn't be an alternative high-level hatchet (or pickaxe in Mining, mattock in Archaeology, etc.) that behaves similarly to Barrows armour and weapons. It could have the same stats as another tool of that tier, but has the chance of giving double resources, for example.


~A~

09-Aug-2021 10:08:36

Ketsujo
Nov Member 2022

Ketsujo

Posts: 1,980 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
When it comes to time consumption and how long it took them to roll out the Mining and Smithing rework properly and 100% correctly, I'd like to see them just take the approach of making woodcutting take on the Evil Tree mechanic.
Giving us the newer metal hatchets, and from there...let us enjoy ourselves as we finally get XP for WC'n...hell, if we all end up with 99 WC in a matter of a week, then WC should be the next 120 offering us newer trees and tweak the fletching skill to match...meaning its time that we all can see Rangedscape make a comeback? *sarcasm*

On the real though, fletching while tweaked to be more feasible in terms of training...it's still lackluster in terms of utility considering that we require a high level in order to fletch a lvl 50 short/shieldbow...and ammunitions.
So if WC gets this change, fletching should as well, and I have a means to take a large crack at the fletching line up and the whole skill itself, but my work's not finished. lol

tl;dr
Woodcutting needs changes. Desperately.
Lumberjack outfit, Sentinel Outfits, Augmented Crystal Hatchet with Honed6, Pulse Cores, Core Aura, BXP, and all other kind of boosts...doesn't help the skill get any faster.
Cutting Yew Logs at 92 still feels like a chore and a half with Crystal Hatchet + Beaver Familiar along side the Sentinel outfit on...don't get me started on log splitting scrims either. I'm ready for more, and a large diverse change to the skill.
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09-Aug-2021 17:43:30

A  Cole
Nov Member 2003

A  Cole

Posts: 14,682 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I'm intrigued as to what you have in mind for Fletching.

Personally I'd like some sort of "Ceremonial Bow" type feature similar to "Ceremonial Swords" in Smithing. I know these are currently useless, but I'm sure creative people can think of a use of Ceremonial items. There could be a whole skill based around them, with other ceremonial items being created in Construction, excavated and restored in Archaeology, mixed in Herblore, stolen with Thieving, or rewarded from bosses, quests and minigames.


~A~

17-Aug-2021 09:26:52

Ketsujo
Nov Member 2022

Ketsujo

Posts: 1,980 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
A  Cole said :
I'm intrigued as to what you have in mind for Fletching.
[...]
~A~

Fletching just requires other metals to be incorporated.
I still don't see the reasoning behind why it takes us 65 fletching to make a t40 weapon, and higher levels in fletching to make t50 ammunition like rune arrows...and even further for a t50 and t60 bow. With the other trees we have readily available to us and them only having Crossbow Limbs viable for use (i.e. Magic for Dragon Crossbows) urks me.
I'd like to see all trees have a use in terms of making Spears and Hasta's...as well as furthering the use of logs to make Hatchets for more "fletching" potential.

Think about it.
Regular Logs for Bronze and Iron Hatchets
Oak for Steel and Black
Willow for Mithril and Adamant
Maple for Rune
Yew for Orikalkum
...
Elder for Bane and Elder Rune
See where I am going with this? Of course, smithing would have to be adjusted to only make the heads of the axes (which should be untradable) and we just fletch the handles for our hatchets for a reasonable amount of XP, add the heads of the axes for another chunk of XP. Hatchet Heads should be stackable and to craft them should be allowed practically anywhere, so...bank standers anyone?

As far as the other metals arrowheads, darts, throwing axes, and other melee weaponry...should be allowed to be created. It's been long enough for these metals to be incorporated...and the dwarves, goblins, and various smiths around the world to finally perfect the makings of the new metals weaponry.
Sure, we could go the route of learning things via Archeology or spending 5 up to 25% respect to learn how to make Main Hand or Off-Hand versions of the gear in question from the artisans workshop...hell, we could even pick them up from random digging in various dig sites that sit close to the metals in question even! Of course, it could be an uncommon drop.
But to see the new metals incorporated into fletching and wc is needed
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24-Aug-2021 05:34:01

A  Cole
Nov Member 2003

A  Cole

Posts: 14,682 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I agree Ketsujo.

There's certainly a lot of scope to play around with the Fletching skill, and bringing in the content developed for the Smithing rework would work well.

I'd also be interested in seeing a race / kingdom specialise in the Fletching skill. We already know the Dwarves are the masters of Mining and Smithing, and the Druids of Taverly are the experts of Summoning and Herblore. This could help with the backstory of expanding the Fletching skill out from what it is now.


~A~

25-Aug-2021 17:02:51

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