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Dev Blog: Abyssal Weapons

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Formerly Joy

Formerly Joy

Posts: 2,401 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
b r ok en said :
I calcd without any strength boosting items at 99 str w/no boosts:

Abbysal dagger = 24x2 max
Dragon dagger = 21x2 max

Abyssal dagger takes 50% vs dragons 25%

Dragon dagger is 30k while im pretty sure the abyssal dagger will cost far more.

In addition to this there is literally only 1 reason to consider this over using the hasta and its not a very good one at that.

Am i the only one seeing how the abyssal dagger is turning out to be kinda meh?

Trust me, you're far from the last. I am really throwing my heart out. I love this weapon and want to see it done right. It kills me to even say 10%. I want to see it given +50% accuracy and 0% damage redux, but if it must have some it must be 0-10 MAX.

08-Jun-2015 23:44:29

Clifton 7

Clifton 7

Posts: 266 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
King Jim said :
Formerly Joy said :
Bludgeon is a mockery.

I pointed out. It gains .3% damage per -Prayer Point. If it were to match the MAX of an Abyssal Tentacle: a 50, that would mean at 1/99 Prayer you can max a 79. OH, and 50% drain rate too?!

Armadyl Godsword SCAPE. All hail. All hail AGScape.

I have the max hit of the bludgeon with 49 strength bonus being the max non weapon gear.
-bcp - 4
-tassets - 2
-serp helm - 5
-zerker i - 8
-fire cape - 4
- d boots - 4
- b gloves - 12
- str ammy - 10

Which gives us 49 for armor then a total max strength bonus of 134 which gives us a base max hit of 48.76

When adding in the spec at 99 prayer so 0.3%*98 which is 29.4% so the max with spec is ~63.

I think this is pretty balanced.
63 isn't including piety is it? You could be 5/99 prayer and have 28% PLUS piety, right? That would be a bit crazy.

09-Jun-2015 00:08:01

Formerly Joy

Formerly Joy

Posts: 2,401 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Jim, I missed your reply.

Woox provided data based upon the common main PK set-up. It's welfare risk with gear you can pick up on death! This is partially why PK'ing is dying off. There is no reward. Fun is only worth so much. Abyssal Dagger if given the proper rework can bring back Hybrids. The highest skilled, highest risking, and overall highest respected PK'ers in game. This is what we need...

Or should we release a downgraded dragon dagger:
-50% Drain Rate is pathetic with the current proposition. Even 25% would be laughable.
-It is severely lacking an accuracy boost.
-The damage reduction is too much. It should be REMOVED, or lowered to 0-10% AT WORSE.

Remember, the weapon has a low DPS output. The chance of hitting a said 40 is not at all common. Especially when the Dagger is based on 1st hit: Both hits land, or none do. This weapon should be adjusted ASAP.

Again:
- +50% Accuracy.
- Remove the 15% Damage Redux. Or lower it between 0-10% because 15 is too high.
- 50% Drain Rate is fine, but a 30-35% could be considered.

Please and thank you. I want to see PvP back to its prime.

09-Jun-2015 00:23:30

Stoic Buu l

Stoic Buu l

Posts: 2,337 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Whoever came up with those special attacks listed needs to slam their head into an oven. I'm glad they weren't implemented. I'd much rather see a damage over time effect for the dagger.

OR you could skip the special attack and just make the dagger a faster weapon. As it stands, daggers by themselves are inferior standalone weapons because scimitars, whips, etc provide much more practicality. If you made the dagger weapons faster, it would compensate for damage difference in hits. Usually smaller weapons in other MMO games are faster weapons. Now THAT would be interesting to see.

09-Jun-2015 00:29:15

Cya Bruh

Cya Bruh

Posts: 15 Bronze Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Don't bother adding any more underwhelming weapons. We got variety with blessed sara sword etc, but it doesn't do anything if these weapons are designed sub-par to cheaper weapons that are already in the game.

We need actual viable weapons that compete with current weapons for kill potential and risk/reward, not weapons designed specifically to be worse than what's currently in the game so the vegans of rs vote for it.

09-Jun-2015 00:29:27 - Last edited on 09-Jun-2015 00:30:55 by Cya Bruh

Formerly Joy

Formerly Joy

Posts: 2,401 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Abyssal dagger special attack (+114 strength bonus, +123 stab bonus)
Max hit: 72 (36-36)
Average hit: 11.77
Hit 10+: 31.37%
Hit 20+: 27.67%
Hit 30+: 21.58%
Hit 40+: 13.39%
Hit 50+: 6.59%
Hit 60+: 2.17%
Hit 70+: 0.14%


Data provided by Woox and the Combat Formula Forum.
If data is correct then I have a perfect fix to the Abyssal Dagger nerf. It needs a slight buff to be sure it is used in PvP and helps bring back Hybrid PK'ing:


Abyssal Punture:
50% Drain Rate.

The special attack hits twice in quick succession (just like the dragon dagger) with 10% reduced damage and 50% increased accuracy. If the first hit deals damage, so will the second. Both hits deal damage or neither do.


NOTE: I am editing this in. This is the BARE MINIMUM of what this Special Attack should provide. I believe the Drain Rate should be 35% and the damage reduction should be either completely removed, or reduced to 5%. Remember, we are trying to make an "upgraded Dragon Dagger." Furthermore, revive Hybrid PvP which is the most high risk, high skilled, high reward PK'ing in game. If we don't release a proper Abyssal Dagger... People will continue to PK in Rune, AGS, and untradables for no risk. THIS IS WHY PvP is DEAD.


This will ensure the max hits at least 40; taking into consideration you are willing to RISK max gear. This will also justify the dagger being without poison and will still be lower damage output than several other Spec Weps.


Seriously, is this not what we need to bring back Hybrids? Please consider this. I do not want to see the Abyssal Dagger become useless.

Note: The Abyssal Dagger is still a low DPS weapon. The Special Attack will more often than not hit too low. This isn't fair for half your Spec-Bar.

09-Jun-2015 00:32:49 - Last edited on 09-Jun-2015 00:40:24 by Formerly Joy

Formerly Joy

Formerly Joy

Posts: 2,401 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Stoic Buu l said :
Whoever came up with those special attacks listed needs to slam their head into an oven. I'm glad they weren't implemented. I'd much rather see a damage over time effect for the dagger.

OR you could skip the special attack and just make the dagger a faster weapon. As it stands, daggers by themselves are inferior standalone weapons because scimitars, whips, etc provide much more practicality. If you made the dagger weapons faster, it would compensate for damage difference in hits. Usually smaller weapons in other MMO games are faster weapons. Now THAT would be interesting to see.

YES YES YES to the oven part. NO to bleed effect.

09-Jun-2015 00:33:17

Frost Mages

Frost Mages

Posts: 72 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Please make the abyssal dagger actually useful? As a pker of 9 years i see this as a chance to make pking enjoyable and exciting again, lets not waste it. Joy multiple amazing points and i fully support his ideas. Theres is zero excuse for a 30k dds to be equal or better than the abyssal dagger. Personally i was just looking forward to maybe a more accurate dds or a few extra max hits higher than the dds. So tired of this fear of overpowered weapons ruining pking. This is 2015. If your not pking with combo foods when pking i dont know why your bothering pking. If you want people to be excited about your game/updates/pking you've gotta add new interesting situations in the game. With ags being the dominant weapon in the game(nothing really compares to the accuracy/dmg output) i feel pking has become very stale. This has led to myself and nearly all of my pking friends losing almost all interest in pking. I really feel the abyssal dagger could mix things up and make the pking scene for intense and exciting if done correctly. Please reconsider the current plans for the daggers special/stats and refer to Joy's post. Thanks!

On a side note. I can't see a lot of people using the abyssal dagger over a zammy hasta.

09-Jun-2015 00:34:34 - Last edited on 09-Jun-2015 00:46:59 by Frost Mages

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