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Solanumtinkr

Solanumtinkr

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William Witt said :
@ Aquamancer

OBJECTION!

If I'm not mistaken, there is *NO EVIDENCE* for seers being Guthixian, beyond the fact that they kind of look like druids - which is a terrible basis of evidence. I believe the village is marked as Saradominist on Jagex's god followings map, and Ariane herself is a nominal wizard of Saradomin (though she's more Godless-ish in her actual outlook). There is no reason that you cannot have Fremennik Guthixians in a nominally Saradominist area. Otherwise it would be like something posting smurf symbols all around the local area and then being told by someone else you are a smurf worshipper because they are there. Would ketchup bottle symbols everywhere make me Ketchupian worshiper?

The fact is the Seers have no real history and with this update is it being laid down for teh first time. There is no evidence aa there is nothing to find in relation to anyone or anything, other than the Fremmy having fareseers. The purpose of adventure is to shine light into dark places,
Poke monsters with a sharp stick, Then steal anything that isn't nailed down!
To the Manor Born QFC 185-186-367-65788716

24-Mar-2017 12:26:25

Crow Crimson

Crow Crimson

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Does anyone think McGrubor's Woods should get some lore? The legendary creators have been long gone from this world. When they return, they'll be surprised and angered of their creations' new sapience. Meanwhile, the world's most elite, summoned to be its guardians, have abandoned their purpose and intend to plunge the world into chaos. -- Bionicle or RS?

24-Mar-2017 19:06:31

William Witt
Aug Member 2023

William Witt

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Eren Lapucet said :
Actually Godwine, Seers Village is marked Guthixian in the god map.

Oh. I stand corrected, then. Shame on me for doubting Aquamancer.

@ Solanumtinkr

My objection was that Aquamancer was presenting it as fact when there wasn't evidence pointing in that direction (or so I thought - turns out I was wrong).
The Asgarnian ale must flow.

24-Mar-2017 19:57:58 - Last edited on 24-Mar-2017 19:58:27 by William Witt

Shadoliax
May Member 2012

Shadoliax

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My thoughts:

The seer's council serves two roles: to train seers (though seers are born, not made), and as an advisory body. They are generally politically neutral, and are respected arbiters of law(thus the courthouse). Anyone can come meet them for a glimpse of the future to help them predict potential problems, although some have an easier time getting an appointment with the council than others.

Seers' visions are usually unclear and require interpretation. Older, more experienced seers are more skilled at interpretations, and part of younger seers' training is discussing and debating the implications of a vision with their elders. Seers' powers may have relationships with the Ijuanaka's Olun'det.

Most of the village is just a normal farming town, just with better foresight of weather patterns. Because of this, I think that seer's village would not be run-down; the merchants are still doing maintenance on their shops. Buildings used by seers would be modest and minimalist, not gaudy due to their lack of concern with the present, that being said they are influential and well regarded, and their building maintenance should reflect that.

While I agree that seers are probably Fremmenik in origin, I feel that they have spent enough time outside Fremmenik society for their culture to have diverged significantly from the other Fremmenik groups seen in game.

As for the stabbing to see the future thing, perhaps the triggers for encountering visions of the future differ between individuals? Ariane might need stabbing, but others might meditate, exercise, or scream incessantly about sin in order to access the future.

24-Mar-2017 23:08:52

AesirWarrior
Jan Member 2021

AesirWarrior

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I'm a bit late so if this has already been resolved please forgive me.

* Possible reasons they moved to the area was out of fear that their 'magic' would be punished after the discovery of rune essence and the resulting tensions. Or maybe they just saw the future and knew they should go settle there?


I should probably know more about this given my username, but IIRC isn't the entire point that Rellekan Fremennik don't actually have anything against magic? It's not magic they're opposed to, it's runecrafting. The mountain tribe left because *they*don't like magic at all, while Relleka is accepting of it as long as it doesn't involve runes. And IIRC wasn't the reason the whole anti-magic thing came into being in the first place was because they believed it was stealing power from the gods? Seers are believed to get their power *from* the gods (although that's likely not true), so that wouldn't apply to them.

* The Seers could have potentially told the Sinclair family to build the castle as they foresaw the arrival of King Arthur and told them that in return they would house a powerful ally who would protect their lands from all threats.


Personally I think I'd prefer if the Sinclairs just built it because they're filthy rich and a bit eccentric, but it works.


Aquamancer said :
Helring said :
I understand the original Seers Village seers being Fremmenik in origin, but possibly include some others? If they accept other cultures, I imagine that others that might possibly have access to that magic might have joined them, perhaps a couple seers of alternate races.

The ability to be a seer is likely a hereditary trait, not a learned one: therefore, only the descendants of the Fremennik seers can ever become seers.



The Burning Tower Lore & Histories story supports this. -
I have noticed your kind does tend to blindly stumble forward towards danger simply because it exists. What is your word for that?
- We call it being a hero.

24-Mar-2017 23:24:23 - Last edited on 24-Mar-2017 23:25:12 by AesirWarrior

Aquamancer
May Member 2011

Aquamancer

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William Witt said :
Eren Lapucet said :
Actually Godwine, Seers Village is marked Guthixian in the god map.

Oh. I stand corrected, then. Shame on me for doubting Aquamancer.

Well, a lot of the lore I got was very obscure, so it makes sense for people to be worried about lorefails, and rightfully so: everyone can make mistakes, and when we are participating in the creation of lore for a region that previously had very little of it, it makes sense to be worried of lorefails: that's what most of my participation on this thread has been mostly about.

That said, though, I did not find a single reference to the Seers being Saradominist, and even if there would be no mention about Seers' association with the gods, it makes more sense for the Seers to be Guthixians than for them to be Saradominists.

Crow Crimson said :
Does anyone think McGrubor's Woods should get some lore?
Sure, why not? All we really know that it's a large swathe of private land filled with trees, owned by a wealthy family known as the McGrubors, who hire foresters look after the area's trees and wildlife and guard dogs to protect it from any intruders, but knowledge about the back entrance to the forest is known by Edmond (and possibly by Grandpa Jack), suggesting that information about the woods is rather common knowledge; the forest has a fairy ring; Tam McGrubor, the hander of wicked hoods, does not own the woods, but used to live there (possibly illegally); that Sparky the Squirrel used to live there; and that it's been around for quite a long time, as Grandpa Jack refers to how he used to get red vine worms from the woods, implying it used to be private land even when he was at his prime 20 years ago, and quite likely even earlier than that. We know nothing about the McGrubor family or why they own the forest, for example, so learning more about the forest's lore would be nice.

24-Mar-2017 23:29:18 - Last edited on 24-Mar-2017 23:41:15 by Aquamancer

Rondstat

Rondstat

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I think a Seer's Village rework provides unique opportunities. Unlike Falador, or Catherby, or Al Kharid, this location has sort of fallen off the radar. Outside of maple and Camelot teleport bots, no one really spends much time there. It has become disused in the lexicon of Runescape settings, and thus can be the kernel of nearly anything you'd like.

Thus, I encourage you to be bold. Do something unexpected, something strange, something risky. Don't make it a generic medieval town.

While I greatly appreciate all the work Aquamancer has done on this thread, I think he has occasionally made the mistake of presenting inference as fact. It's absolutely possible that the village has Fremennik origins. However, even if that is true, it seems so far in the distant past, that they have had time to become culturally VERY distinct entities. Besides that, nearly all mainland humans came from the Fremennik homeworld. They could just have easily been from an independent group that discarded the old customs (unlike the Fremennik), but managed to hold onto the tradition (genetic predisposition?) of seers for millenia.

The point I'm making is, don't feel restricted by implied settings, to think you can only present the town one of two ways. I'd like to see something that surprises and delights us, that introduces something we've not seen before in Runescape.

At the same time, I'd also encourage you to remember the successes and failure of past reworks. Like Catherby, present the trappings of a living world - whether it's animals/NPCs with animated reactions, vendors audibly hawking their wares, evidence of commerce, transport, life, detritus. Build the landscape out of unique elements, with examines and interactive elements - not static setpieces. And expand on the fantastic stylized graphical palette you've pursued over the past few years, but avoid the poorly realized attempts at textural complexity.

25-Mar-2017 01:09:12

Rondstat

Rondstat

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Just to be clear, I'm not sure if I came across in any way as dismissive, I do not want to belittle others' ideas at all. There have been some fantastic contributions on this thread.

Just pointing out that Seer's Village, as a location that sees little practical use and has very threadbare lore/backstory behind it, offers Jagex a freedom for reinvention that few other locations in the game would provide. I'd hate to see them squander the opportunity to do something truly distinctive and unexpected.

25-Mar-2017 02:01:19 - Last edited on 25-Mar-2017 02:02:31 by Rondstat

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