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A Holiday Compromise

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Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
^^

https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Leagues

Again, don't dodge the undeniably obvious fact the OSRS Wiki bought up concerns about the FOMO nature and unfairness of OSRS Leagues. I am certainly not the only one who pointed out such FOMO concerns.

"H'odds are not the only glaring issue with this update. Free players can only access pumpkins through skilling as they are unable to attend Pumpkin Parties"


Completely wrong again. Free players have access to TH and the ability to win Halloween items too, unlike free players in OSRS eventscape like DMM, Leagues and Boss Bash Raffles.

22-Oct-2023 18:56:24

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ok. I won't.

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Developers have also expressed the desire to rerun older leagues in the future for another chance at those specific trophies, and when the content of the game has updated thoroughly enough for the experience to be different enough to encourage new strategies the next time around.


- From the "concerns about reward availability" section of the Leagues wiki page.

As it so happens, they are set to launch Trailblazer League a second time. Here's what the newspost from last August had to say about trophies:

"It wouldn’t be a League without a spot of healthy competition! In previous Leagues, reward tiers (ranging from Bronze to Dragon) were split up based on which % of players you ranked among. The top 1% were Dragon tier, the top 60% were Steel tier, and so on.

While this system helpfully encourages people to play regularly throughout the League, it can also mean logging in to find you’ve dropped a tier and spending the rest of your day frantically catching back up.

In Trailblazer Reloaded, we’ll be experimenting with static rank thresholds to cut down on the frustration of never knowing if you’re performing well enough. You’ll be able to see exactly how many points you need to advance to the next rank, so you shouldn’t feel obligated to log in and fight for a reward you’ve already obtained. This also means that you can jump in and out of the League whenever you like – no FOMO here!"



https://secure.runescape.com/m=news/leagues-iv-trailblazer-reloaded?oldschool=1

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Oh, so not only CAN you receive Leagues trophies when a league is rerun - it's even EASIER to do so as you'll always know what threshold you'll need to hit when competing -and- the goalposts won't move depending on participation numbers! They even use the phrase "no FOMO here!" as if they wrote this newspost specifically for you - Dilbert!
Quest Cape Owner since 2021

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23-Oct-2023 03:20:28

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
> The drop rate for a 3rd Age Platebody from a Hard casket is
1 in 211,250 caskets
in OSRS, which falls significantly short of
1 in multi-million odds
found when calculating the odds of winning various state lotteries.

> You can't confirm what the drop rate for the RS3 big-ticket holiday items are because Jagex hasn't released those odds. While they -might- be higher, they could also be equivalent or even worse. (I personally wouldn't imagine so, for the record) - however, whatever the odds are are also stacked on top of roughly a one month availability period.

> Players - F2P warriors to Premier Club patrons - shouldn't have to pay 100m GP for a holiday item in any ideal sense. If you have to buy the item, it no longer feels like a celebratory moment to receive it.

> Treasure Hunter being "the entire holiday event" for Free players is absolutely criminal, when in many previous years F2P was able to complete the event and receive all of the rewards from doing so.
This is Scummy Business 101, and giving Jagex a pass for it isn't acceptable.
Competitions, especially those like DMM or Boss Bash, are okay to be pay-to-enter because they literally reward money should you win, and F2P wouldn't even be able to win DMM or access most boss monsters anyway.

> You can, in fact, do clue scrolls while playing Leagues. In fact, there are gameplay relics that enhance the process specifically for players that enjoy Treasure Trails.
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23-Oct-2023 03:36:45 - Last edited on 23-Oct-2023 03:37:23 by H 1 L D A

Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
"The drop rate for a 3rd Age Platebody from a Hard casket is 1 in 211,250 caskets in OSRS,"


OMG! No wonder 3rd Age items are so unfair to most players. Even for those who have the requirements to do all hard clues, and they diligently find and complete 10 scrolls a day, it will take them almost 60 years to get a drop. The stupidest thing about clue scrolls in OSRS is they can't stacked like in RS3. Imagine wasting time running leaving what OSRS are doing for more profit to do scroll clue each time, and only get 10k worth of items often from wasting 10 or 20 minutes for it? :(

"> You can't confirm what the drop rate for the RS3 big-ticket holiday items are because Jagex"


We can observe from the price players selling them to tell how "rare" they are. Even Ensouled Mask is now that expensive, suggesting plenty of players are getting it.

"> Players - F2P warriors to Premier Club patrons - shouldn't have to pay 100m GP for a holiday item in any ideal sense. If you have to buy the item, it no longer feels like a celebratory moment to receive it."


You need to blame the Gowers more then. They made Phats from 2001 selling for hundreds of billion of gp, 100m gp is nothing! You should also blame OSRS for making holiday items buyable. It no longer feels like celebratory moment to receive this year's Halloween item as we can just buy them next year.

"This is Scummy Business 101,"


So Mods MarkOS, Kieran, Ayiza, Light et al told us some OSRS events are designed intentionally for members because that's the way OSRS does their Scummy Business to let the game live longer. So what? At least in RS3 free players can participate in almost all kinds of events and get rewarded.

23-Oct-2023 17:17:25

Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
"Oh, so not only CAN you receive Leagues trophies when a league is rerun - it's even EASIER to do so as you'll always know what threshold you'll need to hit when competing -and- the goalposts won't move depending on participation numbers! They even use the phrase "no FOMO here!" as if they wrote this newspost specifically for you - Dilbert!"


Did you read the OSRS Wiki complaint and warning about Leagues?

"It wouldn’t be a League without a spot of healthy competition! In previous Leagues, reward tiers (ranging from Bronze to Dragon) were split up based on which % of players you ranked among. The top 1% were Dragon tier, the top 60% were Steel tier, and so on.

While this system helpfully encourages people to play regularly throughout the League, it can also mean logging in to find you’ve dropped a tier and spending the rest of your day frantically catching back up"


When are we going to get Leagues 1 and 3 rewards? What if they are not being rerun? Even if OSRS players can get League 2 rewards from League 4, it doesn't mean they can get it because they don't have time to grind. And when is the next League 2 rerun after this year? 10 years, 20 years or never.... especially when OSRS fails to exist later?

23-Oct-2023 17:21:30

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Let's talk about the 2001 Party Hat event.

1. I'll absolutely say that the Gowers made a mistake in making PHats tradeable and failing to continue them, in my honest opinion.
Old School, by rewarding you duplicates of the item while leaving it tradeable, has the best of both worlds in that regard
- where if all you cared about was making some GP, you can still sell the item if you want to. If you wanted to wear the item (party hats, even if dirt cheap in OSRS, are quintessential RuneScape fashionscape.) - you can do that too. Hindsight is 20/20.

2. That event was available to all players, and instead of having a pumpkin mostly contain garbage nobody wants and "every once in a blue moon", the hats were just there. On the ground. See it - pick it up. No gimmicks.

3. Jagex had no "get-rich-quick" scheme of their own. The event was simply there to celebrate Christmas with their playerbase - not dive deep into consumerism.

Do you see where this event doesn't measure up?

> There are big ticket items that are entirely dependent on two factors - engaging with the game for every hour on the half hour, and getting good RNG.

> Because of the above factors, there are players who will participate in the event - even so much as to complete the Fresh Pumpkin Mask, and not receive these items, whereas simply logging into the RuneScape was enough for most players to find at least one party hat on the ground in 2001.

> Finally, Jagex is counting on the pressure of the above factors to get people to crack and open their wallets, so they can make a profit off of those with poor luck. Celebrating a holiday like an absolute Scrooge.
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24-Oct-2023 02:25:38

Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
You still have failed to tell us why OSRS intentionally made 3rd Age gear so rare, far more rare than most non-discontinued rares in RS3. OSRS clearly thinks their players like RNG based rares. Why is it fine in OSRS and bad in RS3?

If the pumpkins contains garbage nobody wants, why are ironmen debating whether more rewards should be avavilbe to them? (Quick find code: 15-16-69-66289190)
Why did people ask for how many H'oddments they can convert the Holiday Buffs to? (Quick find code: 15-16-572-66289186)

Clearly the RS3 Halloween Event gives the players all kinds of things of interest, not just a rare item they can sell. Don't get me into keep correcting something you keep playing dumb and misinform us... Everybody can just use our free TH keys and get Halloween items and H'Oddment Store items with almost no efforts. The rewards aren't even on the ground, they get into our inventory or bank at our own discretion. If you choose to skill and kill at your own choice, you get pumpkins to smash too. Again, the items get sent to our bank and not even on the ground.

". Jagex had no "get-rich-quick" scheme of their own. The event was simply there to celebrate Christmas with their playerbase - not dive deep into consumerism."


You are talking about OSRS DMM, Leagues, Boss Bash Raffle which Jagex forced OSRS playes to pay membership for such events, not RS3.

"There are big ticket items that are entirely dependent on two factors - engaging with the game for every hour on the half hour, and getting good RNG


Complete nonsense again. I have corrected you numerous times and you just pretending not to see it. We, meaning we RS3 players who are interested in playing the game our way, can get pumpkins spawned like Seren Spirits. Nobody needs to go to the hourly flash event if they don't want to.

24-Oct-2023 03:09:49

Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
"> Finally, Jagex is counting on the pressure of the above factors to get people to crack and open their wallets, so they can make a profit off of those with poor luck"


You just keep continuing to talk about OSRS. Only these OSRS events like DMM, Leagues, Boss Bash Raffle etc require OSRS players to open their wallets. In RS3, the rare Ensouled Pumpkin Mask can't be won with money because it is not a prize from TH. We have to smash pumpkins to find them and we can't buy them.

24-Oct-2023 03:12:32

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Finally, let's talk about the prices for these items. I'll be using street price here.

The Orange H'ween - which is a pure cosmetic item - is "affordable" at 110m right now.

The Pumpkin Beret override token - a cosmetic override only obtainable through Pumpkin Parties - is worth 410m.....while the event is still taking place.

The Ensouled Pumpkin Mask - an item that has considerable gameplay benefits for being a holiday item, particularly for those looking to get 120 Necromancy on a budget - is 1.1 BILLION GP, while the event is still ongoing.

Even the Soul Dive and Soul Surge abilities - which you can save up H'oddments for if you wanted to - are costing players 15 and 20 million coins a piece.
Quest Cape Owner since 2021

Maxed
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24-Oct-2023 03:20:17 - Last edited on 24-Oct-2023 03:22:35 by H 1 L D A

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