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Can We Talk About MTX Now?

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H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Dilbert, what are your points?

Those exclusive worlds were limited time accessible before Soul Wars was accessible to everyone else. Essentially, Jagex let people pay for the ability to beta test Soul Wars. That's what early access looks like.

Are you saying that the meta should be that if auras are offered through bonds, you should prioritize making enough money in-game in order to purchase them that way instead fo actually playing the content associated with them? Because while that may be the case, I'm -always- going to encourage players to actually play RuneScape and go through the grinds everyone else does. Whether it is one method of avoiding MTX or two, it doesn't make a difference - nobody in their right mind should be spending money on bonds just to use them on auras they can earn through gameplay.

What you did say, was that TH and Solomon's Store was less predatory than using Bonds. Now you're saying that they are "equally" pay-to-win? I'm more inclined to believe this sentiment because I'm of the belief that any advantage paying for something gives over a player that plays the game straight-up is considered paying-to-win.

However, I would take that to mean that at best, Bonds are equally as harmful to the game's integrity as Treasure Hunter keys and Bonds, and on the other side of the coin, "equally" as predatory, since this creates a desire to pay for the advantages.
Quest Cape Owner since 2021

Maxed
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15-Sep-2023 01:16:05

Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@H 1 L D A, what's your point?

If limited time exclusiveness is fine then why so many players asked for bonds being able to unlock FSW? Limited exclusive buy to win is still buy to win.

Bonds are more pay to win than TH keys and Runecoins because they can be used to directly get endgame content like tbows. Bonds can be converted to TH keys and Runecoins, so essentially Bonds can buy whatever keys and RC offer too. The converse is definitely not ture. We can get endgame like tbows with TH keys and RC.

"Bonds can be directly used to get TH keys and Runecoins. The positive is a strong, yet unfortunate one - that people sell bonds for TH keys and Runecoins and avoid farmers who are less than ideal to do business with. TH keys and runecoins can't be converted to gp, unlike bonds. Hence, TH keys and Runecoins are less predatory than Bonds."
- Page 1, Post 6

Pay to win and being predatory aren't the same thing. We can pay to win something with all of TH keys, RC and Bonds but there are things Bonds can but TH and RC will get get.

15-Sep-2023 01:25:16

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
It's kind of boggling to me that you would suggest players spend their in-game GP on bonds but in another breath call them the blackest of MTX marks the game offers.

If you care about how MTX should be handled, be consistent with it.

If I got -my- way, RuneScape would have a flat subscription service, and that was it. There wouldn't be any Treasure Hunter. Or Solomon's Store. Or promotional partnership items. Or -additional- paywalls to changing my RSN or accessing my gameplay data through RuneMetrics. Or battle passes.

I'm not going to get my way, but apparently the RS3 community can decide what is and isn't okay with them and act on on part of what I listed above. And they can apparently absolutely pummel Jagex for stepping too far out of line.

I want Jagex to open up a line of communication on ALL of the above. Let's see what the majority of players REALLY think about every avenue of MTX Jagex is offering. Every iota of pay-to-win. Every treasure hunter gem full of harmful items that discourage players from every really truly playing RuneScape properly. Every nonsensical payment option for items that otherwise can be accessed in game already.

In my eyes, if Jagex takes a step back, treats people like suckers a little bit less. Maybe offers a little bit more service up front. Maybe suggests a higher membership price if they have to in exchange for good will and kindly removing their empty hand from the pocket my wallet is in, it's a win for everyone. Jagex sees more players subbing up than ever before. RS3 sees more positive reviews than ever before. Players are happier than they have been lately.

That's MY point in engaging in this debate.

Why do you white knight for Treasure Hunter when it has so many glaring issues? Why are you seemingly waffling on Bonds?

This is a safe space, friend. If you got an MTX thing you don't particularly like. Share it with the rest of the class. Its okay to have other players agree with you!
Quest Cape Owner since 2021

Maxed
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15-Sep-2023 01:29:16

Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
H 1 L D A said :
I did NOT say that early Soul Wars access was fine. And neither did the OSRS community.

Neither did I say FSW without being able to access with Bond was fine. I believe I was the very first one in the RSOF to voice out and asked if we could pay with Bonds, and if not, then I wouldn't play it.

15-Sep-2023 01:33:23

CaptKoloth
Feb Member 2008

CaptKoloth

Posts: 10,676 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
TH would of been fine if it had just stuck with experience lamps and experience keys. But it went on with proteans, portables dummies and gave gp. RS always had the genie which gave small experience lamps and the dragon who gave experience books. So experience lamps were always with the game. Just not to the extreme of TH. As for Bonds, I honestly do not have a problem with them. But issue is people can actually buy new skills which are created buyable. People created Ironmen to have a diy feel. But to be honest, the limited trade setup thought up by Andrew was just that. Forced people to diy. Though you could buy a limited supply of buyables at GE.

15-Sep-2023 02:23:15

Mixed Slush

Mixed Slush

Posts: 299 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
CaptKoloth said :
TH would of been fine if it had just stuck with experience lamps and experience keys. But it went on with proteans, portables dummies and gave gp. RS always had the genie which gave small experience lamps and the dragon who gave experience books. So experience lamps were always with the game. Just not to the extreme of TH. As for Bonds, I honestly do not have a problem with them. But issue is people can actually buy new skills which are created buyable. People created Ironmen to have a diy feel. But to be honest, the limited trade setup thought up by Andrew was just that. Forced people to diy. Though you could buy a limited supply of buyables at GE.

No. It would've been just as shit.
Actually can't believe anyone could be so mental to put it in this game. Must be a name for it.

15-Sep-2023 07:58:33

CaptKoloth
Feb Member 2008

CaptKoloth

Posts: 10,676 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Mixed Slush said :
CaptKoloth said :
TH would of been fine if it had just stuck with experience lamps and experience keys. But it went on with proteans, portables dummies and gave gp. RS always had the genie which gave small experience lamps and the dragon who gave experience books. So experience lamps were always with the game. Just not to the extreme of TH. As for Bonds, I honestly do not have a problem with them. But issue is people can actually buy new skills which are created buyable. People created Ironmen to have a diy feel. But to be honest, the limited trade setup thought up by Andrew was just that. Forced people to diy. Though you could buy a limited supply of buyables at GE.

No. It would've been just as shit.
Actually can't believe anyone could be so mental to put it in this game. Must be a name for it.

I warn you that OSRS is going the direction of RS3 because players demand new stuff. OSRS should of never brought in all the OP stuff it did. Should of stayed with T70 weapons and armor and continued on with the RAID idea. But thing is the RAIDs had crazy rewards like Tbow. OSRS has bonds and they added GE. They even pushed to get curses. It was a good idea not to add them. Curses are way too over powered and should of never been allowed without high level defense requirements. Heck Piety required 70 defense. Both games are having issues because of demands from players. Heck look at what Elf City did to getting insane experience rates. I still say ok add Master Skill Capes. But don't make them so insanely easy to get. That is the problem. The players demand this stuff. Checkout the things happening on OSRS. OSRS is totally losing the game's retro feel.

15-Sep-2023 13:09:23

Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
H 1 L D A said :
It's kind of boggling to me that you would suggest players spend their in-game GP on bonds but in another breath call them the blackest of MTX marks the game offers.

Let me further correct your misquoting of me.

I would suggest players spend their in-game GP on bonds
if they like playing the game for fun and entertainment like what a game is supposed to be, and pay to win doesn't bother them
, but in another breath bond is the blackest of MTX marks the game offers
for those who are bothered by other players getting their in game status instantly bought with in real life wealth.

15-Sep-2023 16:38:09

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