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Can We Talk About MTX Now?

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Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@CaptKoloth

"That is the point, Necromancy has not even been introduced to MTX yet."


TY for admitting MTX not being introduced into Necromancy, unlike Herblore and Construction. If you want to discuss with us about Necromancy xp rate, there are other threads we can go to, and I believe you have already been involved there.

TYVM for agreeing Necromancy has not been introduced into MTX. That served the purpose in the discussion between me and you on this thread already.

12-Sep-2023 19:07:34

CaptKoloth
Feb Member 2008

CaptKoloth

Posts: 10,676 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Dilbert2001 said :
@CaptKoloth

"That is the point, Necromancy has not even been introduced to MTX yet."


TY for admitting MTX not being introduced into Necromancy, unlike Herblore and Construction. If you want to discuss with us about Necromancy xp rate, there are other threads we can go to, and I believe you have already been involved there.

TYVM for agreeing Necromancy has not been introduced into MTX. That served the purpose in the discussion between me and you on this thread already.

No it does not. It just shows the direction the game has gone because of MTX. The developers believe that players expect the crazy exp gains even with a new skill that isn't part of it yet. MTX has destroyed the original feel the game. Which was work to obtain your goals. In a way, the old game was a good way to develop character. Easy exp gains by pay to win is not developing character.n You do know you can buy bonds to get gp correct? So in that way, MTX is even attached to Necromancy by how the Rituals work.

13-Sep-2023 02:21:51 - Last edited on 13-Sep-2023 02:24:57 by CaptKoloth

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Bonds are an interesting topic, because while the simple transaction of buying them and then selling them for GP DOES, 100%, impact a new skill's release if there are buyable elements to it, it's also a generally good thing for the game for two reasons.

1. Players are able to purchase bonds with GP, which provides alternative methods to obtain membership or RuneCoins (I won't list other things you can use them for because I think the other options are more harmful to the game.)

2. Bonds allows Jagex to sell gold to people who - otherwise, unfortunately - would be buying their gold from goldsellers and leaving their information at considerably higher risk.

You mention OSRS. OSRS DOES have bonds.

Now, I -do- think that if Jagex wants to get serious about how MTX affects the games health, they would remove Treasure Hunter outright, but if they aren't going to do that, removing the ability to swap Bonds for Keys would be a significantly more controversial but genuinely helpful step - and removing the ways Bonds can be spent makes them cheaper in-game, which NEEDS to happen in order to more positively impact players who choose to play for free and devote much of their in-game time to up keeping their membership.
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13-Sep-2023 03:15:48 - Last edited on 13-Sep-2023 03:16:32 by H 1 L D A

CaptKoloth
Feb Member 2008

CaptKoloth

Posts: 10,676 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Yes you can buy Bonds to get GP in OSRS as well. But I believe Ironmen cannot do it. The thing is though, it is a bad thing that Bonds can effect the leveling of a new skill.

MTX will never go because it does leave no room for gold farming. It is better to deal with Jagex than an illegal gold farm outfit.

13-Sep-2023 04:14:00

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I don't disagree with you - any buyable aspect of a skill will be impacted by players who can infuse GP into the game with their wallet. That's correct.

I just think that Bonds have more useful qualities than negative ones, so long as they are limited to the purchase of membership or harmless cosmetics. The moment you start adding things like Treasure Hunter Keys, access to things like Fresh Start Worlds, the Mahjarrat aura, extra bank space, etc - is when the "pay-to-win" and extra damaging effects caused by things like dummies or protean packs starts weighing down the scale in favor of the negative.

Not to mention, the more uses a Bond has, the more desirable it is to own them, which produces more demand, which makes the prices of Bonds skyrocket, which makes them harder to obtain through in-game play.

It's good that free players can use RSGP to pay for membership in both games, and it's good to offer GP for those who absolutely have to purchase it safely without risk of identity theft or other malignant behavior.

Does that mean we can't reach a compromise on Bonds? Absolutely not, and again, if Jagex really is serious about addressing MTX pain points (and would like to not see their game get review bombed on multiple fronts like it was last week in regard to MTX) - than this is a topic they can absolutely broach with players.

---

MTX as a whole? We literally just watched Jagex back down last week on the MTX aspects of Hero Pass - and this isn't even the first attempt at a battle pass system that Jagex offered a way to progress through payment that the community shouted down either.

Apparently, the community does have a limit. What the question is now is if they would want to press the issue, and whether or not Jagex is genuinely willingly to hold discourse on paid features as a whole.
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13-Sep-2023 08:04:39

BrunoNutto
Feb Member 2023

BrunoNutto

Posts: 3,328 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
H 1 L D A said :

Apparently, the community does have a limit. What the question is now is if they would want to press the issue, and whether or not Jagex is genuinely willingly to hold discourse on paid features as a whole.

Apparently there's even a hidden MTX trap in the latest seasons promo on TH

https://www.reddit.com/r/runescape/comments/16h7y48/im_sorry_but_wtf_who_the_heck_designs_shit_like/

If Jagex really want to change (and if their next owner allows that) they first have to admit how far they've fallen.

13-Sep-2023 11:15:42

Killashandra
Dec Member 2005

Killashandra

Posts: 1,357 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
BrunoNutto said :
H 1 L D A said :

Apparently, the community does have a limit. What the question is now is if they would want to press the issue, and whether or not Jagex is genuinely willingly to hold discourse on paid features as a whole.

Apparently there's even a hidden MTX trap in the latest seasons promo on TH

https://www.reddit.com/r/runescape/comments/16h7y48/im_sorry_but_wtf_who_the_heck_designs_shit_like/

If Jagex really want to change (and if their next owner allows that) they first have to admit how far they've fallen.

Unfortunately, because players can and do spend rl money to get the rewards, Jagex know that they are gaining from things like this.

I said, way back, that I'd prefer to have higher subscriptions than have MTX but it seems that MTX makes them more money so they've gone that way.

At this point, I don't think they are able to admit that they have gone down the rabbit hole and can't find a way back. Gone are the days of the Gowers when it was always ingame effort that got you rewards and xp.

PS Having looked at the Reddit link you gave, I'm so glad that I never chase anything in TH, I spend the keys I have and that's it, if that doesn't get me anything, then I do without.

13-Sep-2023 12:33:24

CaptKoloth
Feb Member 2008

CaptKoloth

Posts: 10,676 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Blame the gold farmers. In a way, Jagex was forced to go the way of MTX. Maybe we should go back to trade limits again. Which was Andrew's idea. It lost a lot of members. But back in the years 2008 to 2011, the game did force players to diy skills.

13-Sep-2023 13:36:45

Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
H 1 L D A said :
Bonds are an interesting topic, because while the simple transaction of buying them and then selling them for GP DOES, 100%, impact a new skill's release if there are buyable elements to it, it's also a generally good thing for the game for two reasons.

1. Players are able to purchase bonds with GP, which provides alternative methods to obtain membership or RuneCoins (I won't list other things you can use them for because I think the other options are more harmful to the game.)

2. Bonds allows Jagex to sell gold to people who - otherwise, unfortunately - would be buying their gold from goldsellers and leaving their information at considerably higher risk.

You mention OSRS. OSRS DOES have bonds.

Now, I -do- think that if Jagex wants to get serious about how MTX affects the games health, they would remove Treasure Hunter outright, but if they aren't going to do that, removing the ability to swap Bonds for Keys would be a significantly more controversial but genuinely helpful step - and removing the ways Bonds can be spent makes them cheaper in-game, which NEEDS to happen in order to more positively impact players who choose to play for free and devote much of their in-game time to up keeping their membership.

Bonds can be used to buy TH keys and Runecoins already. If you have no problems with Bonds because they can be bought with gp, then you should also have no problems because TH keys and Runecoins can also be bought with just gp.

13-Sep-2023 16:00:12

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