RuneScape Forum Archive | Buying Zuk capes with Tokkul

Nov

2019

Abby Taylor

Posts: 2,206 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

DanzNutz said :
no support, so we can just buy anything now without working for it?
sorry, you got to earn some things.

Technically if you earned the money to pay for an item, then by proxy you earned the item.

Whether you fought a boss and got lucky.
or you grinded at a skilling location for 20 years.

I think they are both valid ways of earning things. and I don't see a reason why not to allow buying stuff.

Many items can be obtained in a variety of ways, and many items can only be obtained one way.
But there is no rule written in stone that a future update can not change this and allow for new ways to obtain items.

Like how Jagex totally ruined the price of birds nests for skillers by having a COLLOSAL ICE MONISTER drop (for some unknown reason) hundreds of noted bird nests

200m Woodcutting: 08/08/2021

Completionist: 09/10/2021

28-May-2022 12:19:59

f a k e news

Posts: 959 Gold Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Why only zuk capes and not fire cape and kiln capes?

Support I guess just make mobs in elder gw zuk entrance drop a new currency specifically for zuk capes and zuk boss would drop the most currency. .

28-May-2022 12:27:54 - Last edited on 28-May-2022 12:32:10 by f a k e news

Apr

2021

Realm Reaper

Posts: 1,421 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

No... we should be locked out of certain content disabled or not. I have one of the worst disabilities you could call someone, but it doesn't mean God should nerf Mount Everest to a little hill so disabled can say they climbed it.

On another note, the igneous rain phase is really difficult with standard ranged abilities, in that there's little time between kills. I can't DPS fast enough even though I can get to the monsters alright. I literally have to use the best abilities, like 3 of the thresholds to kill each one on time, and it makes it near impossible for me. I'm not understanding how people get through this. The cooldowns on the abilities don't match up to the time it takes to kill these guys with t80 gear and t90 weapons with standard abilities. It's almost like Hydrix Bolts and Special Attack EoFs are REQUIRED which a lot of the guides include, but I don't really think it's a balanced game if you have to go out of your way to upgrade something than to use pure skill and still not be able to complete the igneous rain phase.

That being said, I think the phase should give players a tad-tad bit more time on killing the monsters before the insta kill than having to rely on buying a ton of expensive upgrades. Unless, buying upgrades is the concept to keep with dealing with highly difficult bosses.

5.8b XP

28-May-2022 17:50:13

Apr

2021

Realm Reaper

Posts: 1,421 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Abby Taylor said :
DanzNutz said :
no support, so we can just buy anything now without working for it?
sorry, you got to earn some things.

Technically if you earned the money to pay for an item, then by proxy you earned the item.

Whether you fought a boss and got lucky.
or you grinded at a skilling location for 20 years.

I think they are both valid ways of earning things. and I don't see a reason why not to allow buying stuff.

Many items can be obtained in a variety of ways, and many items can only be obtained one way.
But there is no rule written in stone that a future update can not change this and allow for new ways to obtain items.

Like how Jagex totally ruined the price of birds nests for skillers by having a COLLOSAL ICE MONISTER drop (for some unknown reason) hundreds of noted bird nests

The reason to not allow every item to be obtained through currency is to bring a value to the gain in actual skill and not through long periods of time. PvMers would be more valued if this thing couldn't be bought with Tokkul.

As far as there being no written rule in stone on changing content. There should be changes only to revive a game or make content alive again, not to make content easier. It's important to stick to a layout to build up a reputation of a theme of content loyalty, so players would know what to expect and not be disheartened by an abrupt or unexpected change.

5.8b XP

28-May-2022 18:11:08

Nov

2019

Abby Taylor

Posts: 2,206 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

@Realm reaper

I never said "Every item" through currency.
Tokkul is completely reasonable and within the lore to be used in this particular situation.

Your philosophy is a tad silly because what you're promoting is that there should only ever be one way to do something, and by virtue of adding more options or differences it cheapens something?

I don't think so. It doesn't have to be "easier" it can be different, the fact that you AUTOMATICALLY ASSUME that different = easier, shows a lack of creativity and innovation on your part.

That kind of attitude is not going to improve the game or any product for that matter, it's close mindedness.

"so players would know what to expect and not be disheartened by an abrupt or unexpected change."

Jagex has already been making unexpected, random, unprecedented and unwarranted updates to this games for years on end.
There is nothing to be expected from runescape, because the developers of this game do not consider player feedback or enjoyment into the equation.
Whatever they believe makes the most profit will get added, end of story.

Jagex has an awful reputation of changing, tweaking, and botching content with little good reason to do so. Despite their bad reputation they continue to make changes like that and simply ignore any negative feedback.

200m Woodcutting: 08/08/2021

Completionist: 09/10/2021

28-May-2022 20:53:37

Apr

2021

Realm Reaper

Posts: 1,421 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

@Abby Taylor

No, I never Promoted 1 way to do something. You gotta be a complete moron to promote that.

here are my words:
"The reason to not allow every item to be obtained through currency is to bring a value to the gain in actual skill and not through long periods of time."

This promotes the idea of diversity, using the word "Every", in its correct context, as I was mentioning "actual skill" vs "long periods of time" in gaining rewards. It was to show a spectrum.

"By virtue of adding more options or differences" DOES "cheapen something" in that there would be multiple ways to get the same thing, one way could be easier than the other ways. So, if you had tokkul AND killing zuk as ways to get the cape, the cape wouldn't be as valuable in the "actual skill" sense because it can no longer be flashed off solely on "actual skill", now it can be flashed off as "I bought it with a bunch of tokkul".

Context context context context context context

"I don't think so. It doesn't have to be "easier" it can be different, the fact that you AUTOMATICALLY ASSUME that different = easier, shows a lack of creativity and innovation on your part."

Nothing is written in stone when being creative. That would actually demonstrate an inability to be innovative. different = easier was to explain something not to literally say different = easier

context context

"Jagex has already been making unexpected, random, unprecedented and unwarranted updates to this games for years on end."

Ya... Jagex needs to fix that last part, straight up

[FYI I live on being creative. THAT is my whole LIFE]
My 2 points were simple
#1 Dont take the value out of "Actual skill"
#2 dont switch up the game so frequently to show an inconsistency

I dont know where I offended you, but don't hop on my creative train like I'm worthless.

5.8b XP

28-May-2022 22:12:17

Nov

2019

Abby Taylor

Posts: 2,206 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

@Realm Reaper

Firstly, I read your entire post, and I never said you were worthless.
"don't hop on my creative train like I'm worthless."
I'm sorry if you felt that way.

I'm a digital artist, and Indie game developer myself, so I interact with and meet creative people all the time.

I just feel like a lot of the responses and lack of support for an idea like this are coming from a very narrow, uncreative point of view.
It seems like a lot of people just want things to be a certain way because that's just how they should be.

There's a really uncritical way of thinking going on here.

For example your argument here:
the cape wouldn't be as valuable in the "actual skill" sense because it can no longer be flashed off solely on "actual skill"

You and many other might believe this is a compelling point, but I simply want to ask "why?"

Why is it a good thing to have an item that's only value is to show of ""actual skill""? and by asking this question please please note that even though I'm asking "why is it good" I'm NOT assuming that it's automatically BAD.

Video games don't have to be fun. They don't have to make sense. They don't have to do anything really, there is no rule or laws stating how a video game should be played or designed. But a lot of people are married to the Idea that this cape exists to display skill and it should only ever be that way.

Personally I want Runescape to be engaging, Fun, and accessible. I love this game and I think that's the most healthy way to continue it's development, both from a business point of view and from my own personal point of view.

I think accessibility is more important than pandering to high skill elitists. Since definitionally most Runescape players do not fall into that category.

200m Woodcutting: 08/08/2021

Completionist: 09/10/2021

28-May-2022 23:29:32

Nov

2019

Abby Taylor

Posts: 2,206 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I just want to add, as an extra little argument to my last post. That when a game developer caters to a niche group of high skill elitist players, then that is the audience that will remain with the game.

From a financial point of view that can really hurt the future of your product, because by the nature of being elite, it means that your updates are not reaching a broad group of people.

There have been many MMOS in the past that died, because the developers perpetually focused on endgame content, resulting in new players being left behind and left out. and the remaining player base existed as an ever waning block of veterans, who occasionally dropped out whenever they reached the limits of their own skill.

I don't want to invoke the term power creep, because that's not what we're talking about. But one of the drawbacks of power creep in games is that it forces devs to focus on end game content instead of general content that all players can participate in.

200m Woodcutting: 08/08/2021

Completionist: 09/10/2021

28-May-2022 23:40:39

Apr

2021

Realm Reaper

Posts: 1,421 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

@Abby Taylor

Okay, I agree with you on that there should be more content for lower-end players. I've suggested some content on it recently. I don't agree that the high-end content should be nerfed down to an accessibility to lower leveled players though. Maybe lower leveled players could get a lower tier cape, like the fire-cape. It's already been designed like that. Sorry, I'm not the politest when I convey my ideas but I'm really just trying to get points across.

So, to answer your question on "why" there should be actual skill involved, I'll go to your idea on accessibility. Yes, the game should be balanced and equally accessible, although that wouldn't mean all content should be equally accessible. So, for example, you would have capes like the zuk capes (requiring skill), but you'd also have variations of other capes (maybe not requiring skill but time). The other variants would be as powerful as the Zuk Capes, in counter-balancing acts, but they won't require actual skill. That would be the balance of accessibility I'm getting at.

To have accessibility for all content, with both options of time vs skill available, it would dilute the game in my opinion. To have both time and skill mechanisms involved, with their counterbalances, would be more ideally healthy, in my opinion. This is why I'm defending the Zuk Capes to require skill, with the potential, in the future, to have releases of capes that may compete with them, not requiring skill, but a ton of time.

So, there's two sides I'm seeing here. There's an equally accessible balance and then there's an equally accessible balance in counterbalancing. My vision for the game, is to have all sorts of aspects of the core mechanics of RS involved in counterbalancing acts. I think your vision is more to have items/rewards accessible to all but with varying options to attain them. Either one would be perfectly beautiful to be honest.

5.8b XP

29-May-2022 01:04:23

Apr

2021

Realm Reaper

Posts: 1,421 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

@ Abby Taylor

Yes, very true, that form of end-game content suggestions could wreck a game if all the suggestions are being fed into that. Newer players should have equally accessible content though, just to a lower degree, based on levels, in that they would still be able to have equal fun. End gaming would just mean higher tier rewards, maybe a higher scaled sense of fun since you've progressed, but generally the same form of content as for newer players.

I'm not against the growth of a game. I understand your idea. When I suggest content, I always include low tiers to high tiered gameplay. Obviously though, the high tier will have you play lower tier more effectively, which does inevitably lean towards end-gaming. So, when people suggest content for end-gaming, it has to reach towards it. I don't see another way out. With the Zuk Capes, you have the fire cape, the lower tiered and lower leveled players can get the fire cape. So, newbies can still have fun, but I think more so, the end of power creeping needs to get integrated somehow. I don't have that answer for here at this moment right now but sounds like fun to work on a suggestion for.

5.8b XP

29-May-2022 01:17:20

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Buying Zuk capes with Tokkul