RuneScape Forum Archive | Stop TH Promo Oversaturation

Johan Rayne

Posts: 478 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

In the real world, there's nothing stopping someone from investing in a particular stock or "hoarding" shares at low prices.

the ge doesn't sell shares, it sells commodities. someone buying up every ounce of steel not because they will use it but in order to raise the price by 10k% is at the very least unethical. defending this action shows the core value of a person.

sprite has already stated unfair practices and monopolization. the only argument is what side you are on. free market of value for value or a capitalization profit at the expense of another.

capitalization in this game equals stealing real life time from the player. time = gp/hr. the cost is not in pixels, it is the purposed devaluing of a human life.

as to your pride of having a cosmetic that other players don't have based on rng and flipping, i disagree with this pride and believe that jagex needs to stop creating it with the limited content that they do make.

being elite is great, an elite bosser or staker. however being a predatory elitist i take exception too. feeling pride that one group dominates another in pixels is pathetic oh i want other players to feel like shit because i have a cosmetic they will never be able to have. oh joy, oh rapture. mental illness maybe?

18-Nov-2019 17:24:05

Aug

2008

Theos

Forum Moderator Posts: 23,574 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Johan Rayne said :

In the real world, there's nothing stopping someone from investing in a particular stock or "hoarding" shares at low prices.

the ge doesn't sell shares, it sells commodities. someone buying up every ounce of steel not because they will use it but in order to raise the price by 10k% is at the very least unethical. defending this action shows the core value of a person.

sprite has already stated unfair practices and monopolization. the only argument is what side you are on. free market of value for value or a capitalization profit at the expense of another.

capitalization in this game equals stealing real life time from the player. time = gp/hr. the cost is not in pixels, it is the purposed devaluing of a human life.

as to your pride of having a cosmetic that other players don't have based on rng and flipping, i disagree with this pride and believe that jagex needs to stop creating it with the limited content that they do make.

being elite is great, an elite bosser or staker. however being a predatory elitist i take exception too. feeling pride that one group dominates another in pixels is pathetic oh i want other players to feel like shit because i have a cosmetic they will never be able to have. oh joy, oh rapture. mental illness maybe?

Let's agree to disagree. Not everyone plays Runescape the same way, and the bias toward skilling, PvM as the "normalized" or "acceptable" form of gameplay doesn't take into account other interests that players may have.

Treasure Hunter tokens are not commodities necessary for skilling, or essential to one's gameplay. There is no reason for Jagex to interfere with that market. Folks advocating for keeping them common, or oversaturated don't take interest in merchanting or investing. Simply because those activities aren't of interest to you doesn't mean that other players don't find that to be their hobby, or even a major part of their gameplay in RS.

Forum Moderator

18-Nov-2019 17:48:42

Aug

2008

Theos

Forum Moderator Posts: 23,574 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I think "monopolization" is thrown around way too liberally here, and the assertion and accusations toward merchants or investors "manipulating the market" are unfair.

Let's look at rainbow items for example, which are actually quite difficult to win on Treasure Hunter. How many of you have actually won a red slot rainbow item? There are folks who use 1000+ Treasure Hunter keys to no avail. Some rainbow items such as the amulet, and halo are in the 100k-200k price range. While most people purchasing or using keys for this promotion are likely after the XP due to the high multipliers, an oversaturation of rainbow items isn't a byproduct that we should accept as a norm.

There is a way to make Treasure Hunter rewards feel special, without making them insanely rare and unattainable. I'm not saying Jagex should make all TH tokens discontinued, they can and likely will proceed with recycling promotions. Adding new rewards helps spice things up but what happens to all the tokens that people unlock? When the Tomb Gorilla token from the boneyard is under 100k GP, it ends up becoming junk. There are some tokens out there where the total supply likely exceeds the number of active RS players and the bulk of members have already unlocked the said token making it utterly useless.

There are ways Jagex can encourage tokens to exit the game, thus allowing them to retain valuable. I'm not saying every token should be in the 100m+ range, even 10m+ range, but when you have TH tokens trading for 5k-10k on the GE that's when you know you have a serious oversaturation problem.

Forum Moderator

18-Nov-2019 17:58:54

Mar

2014

ELITE STACK

Posts: 8,082 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Johan Rayne said :

In the real world, there's nothing stopping someone from investing in a particular stock or "hoarding" shares at low prices.

the ge doesn't sell shares, it sells commodities. someone buying up every ounce of steel not because they will use it but in order to raise the price by 10k% is at the very least unethical. defending this action shows the core value of a person.

sprite has already stated unfair practices and monopolization. the only argument is what side you are on. free market of value for value or a capitalization profit at the expense of another.

capitalization in this game equals stealing real life time from the player. time = gp/hr. the cost is not in pixels, it is the purposed devaluing of a human life.

as to your pride of having a cosmetic that other players don't have based on rng and flipping, i disagree with this pride and believe that jagex needs to stop creating it with the limited content that they do make.

being elite is great, an elite bosser or staker. however being a predatory elitist i take exception too. feeling pride that one group dominates another in pixels is pathetic oh i want other players to feel like shit because i have a cosmetic they will never be able to have. oh joy, oh rapture. mental illness maybe?

3 people bought out around 5k santas from 660m to 988m yet the price crashed back down to 750 and now stable at 840. No one is guaranteed profit whether it's a discontinued item or not. None of them even sold yet. I need my blue charms back.

19-Nov-2019 03:21:19 - Last edited on 19-Nov-2019 03:22:21 by ELITE STACK

Kalea Sprite

Posts: 1,658 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Johan Rayne said :
~ someone buying up every ounce of steel not because they will use it but in order to raise the price by 10k% is at the very least unethical ~
Indeed, about a dozen years ago, or so, there were even a trade limits. Compared to now, trading was a highly regulated interaction that capped trades to 3,000 to 60,000 gold pieces based on membership, quest points, etc.

While those trade limits (not to be confused with the GE buy/sell volume limits) appear to have been set in place to address the bot, rwt and other problems, flip/merch/investing was also kept in check within the cap of the "balanced trade" system.

And then, back in 2010-11 the "Wilderness and Free Trade Vote" dismantled the "balanced trade" system, removed the price restrictions (but kept the GE buy/sell volume limits) and the result is the system we have today.

Theos said :
~ Not everyone plays Runescape the same way ~
Well ya, but Jagex is the Dungeon Master of the game, they're not only the storyteller but they make the rules and referee the game.

But, flipping, merching, investing, or whatever you want to call it, is not something that they appear keen to "normalize."

According to the Runescape Wiki // Grand Exchange // Pricing

"... Jagex can also intervene and set the prices themselves, and they reserve the right to intervene when they believe price manipulation is occurring on an inexcusable scale ..."

When "Free Trade" returned there was some concern voiced about a rise of overpowered flipping/merching/investing, etc., however those discussions were perhaps drowned out by the excitement for the Wilderness returning, etc.

Still, the official sales pitches for the return of "Free Trade" emphasized philanthropy, the ability to give expensive gifts to friends rather than merching, etc. Jagex appeared to avoid promoting flipping, merching, etc.

Why do you believe "merching" is a game mechanic? 'o.0'

Something interesting happened.

19-Nov-2019 16:40:25

Kalea Sprite

Posts: 1,658 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

ELITE STACK said :
~ 3 people bought out around 5k santas from 660m to 988m yet the price crashed back down ~
So, your anecdotal evidence suggests a "pump and dump" pattern, a pattern of price manipulation, honestly it looks like a scam and should be investigated.

Or, if you prefer, it appears to be a "Wealth Redistribution Scheme," where a number of people lost their banks, the question is who ended up with all the cash?

On the other hand, it would appear that the offical reasoning for unleashing "Unbalanced Trades," "Free Trade," or whatever you want to call it, is simply to allow for friends to share gifts.

As such, any expenditures that are beyond the +/- 5% trade threshold must actually be considered as gifts.

Therefore, trades beyond +/- 5% shouldn't be tallied in player run price checking threads because the official reasons for allowing such overpayments is philanthropy, that is gift giving.

So, with respect to the topic, if there is a perceived excess of tokens, a perceived oversaturation of tokens, then it's simply reflective of Jagex's aim of promoting philanthropy and gift giving, to cultivate a sharing and caring community that loves to help each other out. 'o.0'

Something interesting happened.

19-Nov-2019 16:44:16

Mar

2014

ELITE STACK

Posts: 8,082 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Merching has been a thing way before the ge came out. Like in osrs before the ge came out I made 90m in under 1 month from merching with little gp. Merching/flipping is not against the rules, almost everyone does it. If it was 90% of the community would be banned.

Partyhats used to be 50k each why would you be bothered if tomorrow someone logged in and found 100 partyhats in their banked after offline for 10 hours? It's not overpowered and merching has existed since 2001. Merching is just as difficult as killing solak. I need my blue charms back.

19-Nov-2019 16:51:37

Mar

2014

ELITE STACK

Posts: 8,082 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Kalea Sprite said :
ELITE STACK said :
~ 3 people bought out around 5k santas from 660m to 988m yet the price crashed back down ~
So, your anecdotal evidence suggests a "pump and dump" pattern, a pattern of price manipulation, honestly it looks like a scam and should be investigated.

Or, if you prefer, it appears to be a "Wealth Redistribution Scheme," where a number of people lost their banks, the question is who ended up with all the cash?

On the other hand, it would appear that the offical reasoning for unleashing "Unbalanced Trades," "Free Trade," or whatever you want to call it, is simply to allow for friends to share gifts.

As such, any expenditures that are beyond the +/- 5% trade threshold must actually be considered as gifts.

Therefore, trades beyond +/- 5% shouldn't be tallied in player run price checking threads because the official reasons for allowing such overpayments is philanthropy, that is gift giving.

So, with respect to the topic, if there is a perceived excess of tokens, a perceived oversaturation of tokens, then it's simply reflective of Jagex's aim of promoting philanthropy and gift giving, to cultivate a sharing and caring community that loves to help each other out.

Nope they bought all those santas and failed to push the price past 1b like they thought they could. They ran out of gp. If they sold them the price would have crashed to 250-400m. I need my blue charms back.

19-Nov-2019 16:53:13

Mar

2014

ELITE STACK

Posts: 8,082 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

People also use several alts to merch items too not limited to discontinued items. Merching will always exist discontinued or not and there will be players who make alot of money. If you ban merching then the game might as well shut down too. And if ppl don't merch they will just stake their money. Staking arguably makes more money then merching. I need my blue charms back.

19-Nov-2019 16:56:27 - Last edited on 19-Nov-2019 16:59:09 by ELITE STACK

Kalea Sprite

Posts: 1,658 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

ELITE STACK said :
Nope they bought all those santas and failed to push the price past 1b like they thought they could. They ran out of gp. If they sold them the price would have crashed to 250-400m.
So, you've confirmed that these individuals attempted to manipulate the prices.

You've also confirmed that wealthy individuals, or groups, etc., have the ability to actually control the economy, as such, you've confirmed that the economy is being monopolized.

This does not appear to be aligned with the reasoning to allow for unbalanced trades as it appears to be a type of scam.

Hopefully, Jagex is looking into the situation and nullify any abuses. 'o.0'

Something interesting happened.

19-Nov-2019 17:28:21

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Stop TH Promo Oversaturation