RuneScape Forum Archive | The net is closing in

Aug

2023

UrekMazino

Posts: 7,214 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Hmm... just realised the embedded links are not working...

15 countries representatives tackling loot box threat:
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-09-17-15-european-gambling-regulators-unite-to-tackle-loot-box-threat

19 year old spends $13,500 on MTX in 3 years:
https://kotaku.com/meet-the-19-year-old-who-spent-over-10-000-on-microtra-1820854953

FIFA player did not know he spent over $10,000 and had no idea until he managed to force EA to release his information, also shocked by how much data EA collected on him:
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-07-23-fifa-player-uses-gdpr-to-find-out-everything-ea-has-on-him-realises-hes-spent-over-usd10-000-in-two-years-on-ultimate-team

Streamer spent over $20,000 in 5 years, baited in by the competitive advantage it could give him:
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017-10-20-interview-with-the-whale

0.15% of the players contribute to 50% of the revenue:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2014/03/01/why-its-scary-when-0-15-mobile-gamers-bring-in-50-of-the-revenue/#4079ff864065

Man spends $30,000 on a single game, thinks its unethical that game devs don't tell players the price of the purchases:
https://yukaichou.com/gamification-interviews/exclusive-interview-man-spent-30000-single-game/

Man spent $2,000,000, treated like shit by the game support:
https://venturebeat.com/2016/10/14/the-deanbeat-this-player-spent-2-million-in-a-mobile-game-then-he-led-a-boycott/ °l||l° Modest Skillers T7 Citadel | Skilling clan recruiting players. °l||l°
•ï¡÷¡ï• Cwar United for CW games/Ardy task/Trim req. •ï¡÷¡ï•
120 Summoning Familiar ideas .

03-Oct-2018 15:49:12

Aug

2023

UrekMazino

Posts: 7,214 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Dilbert2001 said :
You post in these RSOF forums, everybody can comment on it. Since you also asked a question regarding the Irish law, only the Irish government can answer it. Why don't you go ask the Irish government if you have question only they can answer? Many webistes just reported this Irish government news. They, and I, obviously don't make laws for Ireland and don't speak for them.
Of course anybody can reply, I'm just saying its pointless if you're not going to address it. Since you seem to not understand me, let me explain more clearly, the main point of my question was how can players unwittingly spent thousands on dollars on in game purchases without realising it and that somehow is not categorised as predatory practices.

Dilbert2001 said :

Didn't know the Irish government spoke for the world

They speak for the Laws of Ireland, not the world.
Gee, I wonder how I misunderstood you. Oh wait, I didn't.

Dilbert2001 said :
They are the Irish government. Their answer is for the ENTIRE WORLD, not just "you". °l||l° Modest Skillers T7 Citadel | Skilling clan recruiting players. °l||l°
•ï¡÷¡ï• Cwar United for CW games/Ardy task/Trim req. •ï¡÷¡ï•
120 Summoning Familiar ideas .

03-Oct-2018 15:53:36

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,176 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

UrekMazino said :
Dilbert2001 said :
You post in these RSOF forums, everybody can comment on it. Since you also asked a question regarding the Irish law, only the Irish government can answer it. Why don't you go ask the Irish government if you have question only they can answer? Many webistes just reported this Irish government news. They, and I, obviously don't make laws for Ireland and don't speak for them.
Of course anybody can reply, I'm just saying its pointless if you're not going to address it. Since you seem to not understand me, let me explain more clearly, the main point of my question was how can players unwittingly spent thousands on dollars on in game purchases without realising it and that somehow is not categorised as predatory practices.

Dilbert2001 said :

Didn't know the Irish government spoke for the world

They speak for the Laws of Ireland, not the world.
Gee, I wonder how I misunderstood you. Oh wait, I didn't.

Dilbert2001 said :
They are the Irish government. Their answer is for the ENTIRE WORLD, not just "you".

I already answered you they are not "predatory practices" according to the Irish government. Anybody can spend as much money as they want on any e-commerce products. They define laws, as well as what is common e-commerce products and instead of "predatory practices".

03-Oct-2018 15:57:03

Aug

2023

UrekMazino

Posts: 7,214 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Dilbert2001 said :

"Oh yea, you're right, that's exactly why Valve, Blizzard, 2K, and other big name game developers have decided to remove loot boxes in several countries including Belgium, Netherlands, and 13 other countries."

No "laws" were passed. They used their existing laws and that's only in Belgium. Netherlands did not request anybody to remove loot boxes.
Ok fine, that was poor wording on my part, what they did was modify the law to include loot boxes under gambling laws.

Dilbert2001 said :
They asked for changes to their games and DOTA2 only made change to real money player trading, so did PUBG, but no loot boxes were removed in Netherlands.
Yes, Valve was being sly about it, but don't you start thinking that gamers will stop there, they will continue to push for more changes, especially since they're already been successful in some front.

Dilbert2001 said :
What other companies removed loot boxes in the "13 other countries"? What 13 other countries are they? Who removed their loot boxes. Please tell.
Hmm.. got ahead of myself, not yet banned, but will be addressed
https://www.engadget.com/2018/09/17/loot-boxes-illegal-gambling-regulators-europe-us/

But really, asking for what other companies? You're moving the goal post now, even 1 company would've been enough to address your previous point. °l||l° Modest Skillers T7 Citadel | Skilling clan recruiting players. °l||l°
•ï¡÷¡ï• Cwar United for CW games/Ardy task/Trim req. •ï¡÷¡ï•
120 Summoning Familiar ideas .

03-Oct-2018 15:57:54 - Last edited on 03-Oct-2018 15:58:50 by UrekMazino

Aug

2023

UrekMazino

Posts: 7,214 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Dilbert2001 said :
I already answered you they are not "predatory practices" according to the Irish government. Anybody can spend as much money as they want on any e-commerce products. They define laws, as well as what is common e-commerce products and instead of "predatory practices".
I didn't ask for your or the Irish government's opinion, I asked how can someone unwittingly spend thousands of dollars on in game purchases, virtual items that do not exist. °l||l° Modest Skillers T7 Citadel | Skilling clan recruiting players. °l||l°
•ï¡÷¡ï• Cwar United for CW games/Ardy task/Trim req. •ï¡÷¡ï•
120 Summoning Familiar ideas .

03-Oct-2018 15:59:55

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,176 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

UrekMazino said :
Dilbert2001 said :
I already answered you they are not "predatory practices" according to the Irish government. Anybody can spend as much money as they want on any e-commerce products. They define laws, as well as what is common e-commerce products and instead of "predatory practices".
I didn't ask for your or the Irish government's opinion, I asked how can someone unwittingly spend thousands of dollars on in game purchases, virtual items that do not exist.

Because they have money and they can use their money on anything they want to buy. Now this is my own opinion.

03-Oct-2018 16:13:48

Aug

2023

UrekMazino

Posts: 7,214 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Dilbert2001 said :
Because they have money and they can use their money on anything they want to buy. Now this is my own opinion.
Again not address my question, I didn't ask why they are allowed to spend the money, I'm asking how did they spend all that money and not realise they spent that much money until much later.

UrekMazino said :
FIFA player did not know he spent over $10,000 and had no idea until he managed to force EA to release his information, also shocked by how much data EA collected on him:
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-07-23-fifa-player-uses-gdpr-to-find-out-everything-ea-has-on-him-realises-hes-spent-over-usd10-000-in-two-years-on-ultimate-team
This guy could've gone his entire life not knowing he spent over $10,000 on FIFA if not for new/modified laws that allowed him to force EA to release his information. °l||l° Modest Skillers T7 Citadel | Skilling clan recruiting players. °l||l°
•ï¡÷¡ï• Cwar United for CW games/Ardy task/Trim req. •ï¡÷¡ï•
120 Summoning Familiar ideas .

03-Oct-2018 16:17:03

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,176 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

UrekMazino said :
Dilbert2001 said :
Because they have money and they can use their money on anything they want to buy. Now this is my own opinion.
Again not address my question, I didn't ask why they are allowed to spend the money, I'm asking how did they spend all that money and not realise they spent that much money until much later.

UrekMazino said :
FIFA player did not know he spent over $10,000 and had no idea until he managed to force EA to release his information, also shocked by how much data EA collected on him:
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-07-23-fifa-player-uses-gdpr-to-find-out-everything-ea-has-on-him-realises-hes-spent-over-usd10-000-in-two-years-on-ultimate-team
This guy could've gone his entire life not knowing he spent over $10,000 on FIFA if not for new/modified laws that allowed him to force EA to release his information.

This person has already answered his own question:

"Myself and my fiancee are fortunate to have a healthy disposable income , so this kind of amount wouldn't have caused a strain on us financially. I do however, have the utmost sympathy for those in a position of low income who may also be or become addicted to buying loot boxes."

He spent $10,000 because it was "disposable income" so he did not take any notice. If it wasn't disposable income to him, he would have checked his monthly bank statements and found out much much much earlier.

GDPR is a common law regulating normal commerce and e-commerce including loot boxes, not any "new/modified loot boxes" laws that don't exist. That's exactly what the Irish Government stated in-game purchases, not just loot boxes should be legally handled.

03-Oct-2018 16:49:49

Aug

2023

UrekMazino

Posts: 7,214 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Dilbert2001 said :
This person has already answered his own question:

"Myself and my fiancee are fortunate to have a healthy disposable income , so this kind of amount wouldn't have caused a strain on us financially. I do however, have the utmost sympathy for those in a position of low income who may also be or become addicted to buying loot boxes."

He spent $10,000 because it was "disposable income" so he did not take any notice. If it wasn't disposable income to him, he would have checked his monthly bank statements and found out much much much earlier.
That wouldn't have changed anything as the money would've already been spent. As stated in the article, Michael was lured in by the sales offers during special events like black friday, FUT birthday etc. and would spend money without a second thought, do you think checking his bank statement would make any difference? Because it sure as hell did not for this 19 year old who spent $13,500 on a mobile game.

https://kotaku.com/meet-the-19-year-old-who-spent-over-10-000-on-microtra-1820854953

BTW, this was listed in my earlier reply, you haven't responded to them yet.

Dilbert2001 said :
GDPR is a common law regulating normal commerce and e-commerce including loot boxes, not any "new/modified loot boxes" laws that don't exist. That's exactly what the Irish Government stated in-game purchases, not just loot boxes should be legally handled.
It is new, it was approved in April 2016 and enforced in May 2018, that's why Michael was only able to force EA to release his information on the very day it was enforced, literally the 2nd sentence in the article. °l||l° Modest Skillers T7 Citadel | Skilling clan recruiting players. °l||l°
•ï¡÷¡ï• Cwar United for CW games/Ardy task/Trim req. •ï¡÷¡ï•
120 Summoning Familiar ideas .

03-Oct-2018 17:07:12

Jun

2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,176 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

UrekMazino said :
Dilbert2001 said :
This person has already answered his own question:

"Myself and my fiancee are fortunate to have a healthy disposable income , so this kind of amount wouldn't have caused a strain on us financially. I do however, have the utmost sympathy for those in a position of low income who may also be or become addicted to buying loot boxes."

He spent $10,000 because it was "disposable income" so he did not take any notice. If it wasn't disposable income to him, he would have checked his monthly bank statements and found out much much much earlier.
That wouldn't have changed anything as the money would've already been spent. As stated in the article, Michael was lured in by the sales offers during special events like black friday, FUT birthday etc. and would spend money without a second thought, do you think checking his bank statement would make any difference? Because it sure as hell did not for this 19 year old who spent $13,500 on a mobile game.

https://kotaku.com/meet-the-19-year-old-who-spent-over-10-000-on-microtra-1820854953

BTW, this was listed in my earlier reply, you haven't responded to them yet.

Dilbert2001 said :
GDPR is a common law regulating normal commerce and e-commerce including loot boxes, not any "new/modified loot boxes" laws that don't exist. That's exactly what the Irish Government stated in-game purchases, not just loot boxes should be legally handled.
It is new, it was approved in April 2016 and enforced in May 2018, that's why Michael was only able to force EA to release his information on the very day it was enforced, literally the 2nd sentence in the article.

Michael could have been "lured" by any Black Friday sales on a car and such too.

GDPR is not a new law specifically to video games, let alone loot boxes.

03-Oct-2018 17:13:50

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