forums.rs

Forums

In Defense Of Pringles

Quick find code: 341-342-835-65250304

of 21
Lianna98

Lianna98

Posts: 259 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Perhaps he seeks to be the cornerstone of civilization, and I have no beef with that seeing that he already showed he can do so if the people were willing. New Domina flourished seeing that chaos did not have a strong grip on that world compared to Gielinor or have been conquered and controlled. At least as far as we know seeing that he is its current supreme ruler, for 10 thousand years I may add. And contrary to your claim, if a world full of powerful winged beings still serve and worship Saradomin even after all they've been through, how is it that New Domina is still Saradominist? That is because their placement of faith is not centered on the individual but to Saradomin who in turn rules over them in an efficient system of government. Dependence does not ultimately breed weakness but more likely, it breeds unity and a united society will always be stronger than one centered on individual strength. The Icyene depend on Saradomin as much as he depends on them. You say dependency is weakness. Even with the Edicts enforced, how, oh how did the most of the Saradominist territories survive intact in the absence of Saradomin? Someone underestimates the uniting power of faith.

And what of Zamorakianism? You may see Zamorak as on who does not wished to be worshiped but he still requires/demands your loyalty or there will be consequence. If he was so keen on your "freedom", then why would he keep his own people in check? If in the moment when you rise to equal Zamorak and actually were given a chance to overthrow him, do you think he'd smile, clap your back, and congratulate you for attaining such strength? That you become BFFs and that's that? Notice how there is NO Zamorakian apart from Zamorak himself who is at the level of his power despite the looser principles his disciples follow. You are free to follow this path as long as you remain loyal and stay UNDER him. So much for "ultimate freedom" hmm?

---cnp---
They make me shiiiaaaiiine!

13-Oct-2015 13:30:27

Lianna98

Lianna98

Posts: 259 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Time for lore? I started way back but okay!

Here are two crucial things you've missed with the Icyene migrating to Gielinor and the concept of war in general:

Saradomin took almost ALL, if not ALL, the Icyenic warriors leaving settlements virtually undefended and very tempting targets for marauders which were most likely held in check by said warrior hosts previously.

It was also a time of war, a 4 millenia-long war. War is costly and would require so much resources. Resources that New Domina could, and most likely have, provided. The drain on resources by the war effort and the bandit raids are factors that are present in a generic wartime scenario not because the populace is dependent on their god.


Saradominists aren't rewarded merely for their faith, but because they earned it: The Imcando Dwarves were blessed by Saradomin to counter a curse inflicted by yours truly, big Z. In return, they conrtibuted to society with their rare skills. Sir Owen and Commander Zilyana both served him with stalwart faith and duty to the point that Saradomin sought to revive them despite the risks. The monks learned or were given special powers and spells to combat various foes of chaos and to aid them in spreading the word of Saradomin. This led them to help out various people in need and sought to undo much of the ruin Gielinor has become notably those wandering in Morytania. "They worship him for it" is barely even half of the picture. Saradominists contribute more to the betterment of society than Zamorakians in general who in most cases are the causes of panic and strife among the present population.

---cnp---
They make me shiiiaaaiiine!

13-Oct-2015 13:32:29 - Last edited on 13-Oct-2015 14:18:33 by Lianna98

Lianna98

Lianna98

Posts: 259 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Is this the time where we call out our factions' infamous characters? Alright then.

Before that, in defence of Sir Amik and all knight orders associated with him, all these spying was most likely stemmed from paranoia after, I don't know, the countless attempts of Zamorakians to slither inside Saradominist society to undermine and exploit its weaknesses? This is especially true seeing that Saradominists rarely have any hostile intentions towards Guthixians, Armadyleans, and Serenists in general compared to Zamorakians and Bandosians who tend to always stir up trouble. And of course, Saradomin wouldn't condone the T.K's actions in enforcing HIS order seeing that the kingdom is virtually under HIS banner. It is for the greater good of his own people as he sees it.

The thing I don't agree with Zamorakianism is not the principles themselves but how his followers have interpreted and acted on it. Now, what are you talking about "true" Zamorakians???

Solus Dellagar, on my point of view, truly took the path of a Zamorakian whether or not he claimed he did. It was ultimate freedom, attaining power to use ancient spells, having the power to massacre all those people in his whim...isn't that ultimate freedom? Did he not become "better" the moment he became so lustful of power that he is considered one of the most dangerous persons by the *.K themselves? That is basically what you're preaching yet why disown someone who has gone down that path and more? That is quite very one-sided if you ask me.

The same could go for Iban. So much was his hunger for empowering himself that it led to his own demise. A Zamorakian's fate that he most likely shared with countless others.

---cnp---
They make me shiiiaaaiiine!

13-Oct-2015 13:34:43

Lianna98

Lianna98

Posts: 259 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
While I see Lord Daquarius as unlike his predecessors, your post would do no justice if you do not mention the latter. Take Lord Sulla, orchestrated massacres under his command along with the infamous Siege of Falador, evil, ruthless but not Solus-level psychotic. He had the freedom and the power on his hands, and he did exactly what he wanted with it though it led to his death. You can't say he followed Zamorakianism "wrongly". Freedom's right there. Power attained from freedom's right there. The Kinshra benefited hugely from the spoils until their imminent defeat so you can't say progress hadn't been made, just lost in the process. Looking back at the other few known Kinshra Lords, notice how the betrayal game applies too. Insert Zamorakian seal of approval right here.

Also, I don't think I have mentioned how the Kinshra keep slaves whilst I never saw humans, or any other race for that matter, enslaved under Saradominist rule. The demon you'd most likely have pointed out to be "enslaved" would be the one in the Wizard's Tower. Fyi, it was a demon that kept spawning back and could not be banished so he was contained instead to prevent him from doing any further damage. Insert Saradominist seal of approval here. Also, if anything, it is Zamorakians who keep summoning demons into Gielinor, you don't see Icyene being summoned and causing havoc and massacring innocents now do you?

The harsh treatment on Zamorakians can be traced to all the atrocities their fellow followers have done, are doing, and are about to do. The Saradominists, to contain the situation, do not take chances with them now based on past experiences. Notice how you do not see mass executions of dwarves (mainly Guthixians), aviansie (Armadylean), elves (Serenists), and other races not connected to Zamorak and Bandos? That's because their factions are generally civil enough to co-exist with. Only those Saradominists involved with the H.A.M are causing tensions.

---cnp---
They make me shiiiaaaiiine!

13-Oct-2015 13:37:02

Lianna98

Lianna98

Posts: 259 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Now let's see what happens if Zamorakians come into contact with them. The gnomes, Guthixians, highly intellectual, highly advanced, generally peaceful. Their formidable military is being drained in a war with Khazard's forces. Military they could have used to better defend themselves when a bigger threat comes but nooooo... Khazard needs to slaughter them so the gnomes could progress at the cost of their own lives.

Chaos dwarves... nothing like having your entire race cursed leading you to shun magic unless you wish to become a mindless husk of chaos.

Then there's various cults that involve the sacrifice of innocents and themselves just to bring great ruin to a peaceful city. Cults like the ones in The Blood Pact, trying to summon a necromancer and be a potential threat to Lumbridge, or the wizards summoning Delrith in hopes of bringing improvement to Varrock by reducing it to a smoldering ruin are just one of the many "true" Zamorakians you do not wish to mention.

I could go on and on about this but to cut it short, these ARE Zamorakian ways admit it or not. They made use of their freedom and power attained from it as they saw fit. I don't fully doubt Zamorak's teachings but the way his followers acted upon it? Gielinor would most likely be doomed if ever Zamorakianis* prevails. Unlike Zarosian logic, which if presented by a decent Zarosian, could challenge me and my stand on Saradominism, Zamorakian logic is well beneath me simply because no matter how one puts it, Saradominism will always be the better option, not for oneself, but for Gielinor if compared.
They make me shiiiaaaiiine!

13-Oct-2015 13:39:08

Lianna98

Lianna98

Posts: 259 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I've seen a lot of posts claiming Saradominism would never work out but if one would stop and just look at how our real world parallels so much to Saradomin's way of things... We are living under the watchful eye of those above us, controlled blindly by everything placed in our reality, we yearn to be free of all the barriers set by our governments but we can't because it's for our own good despite the idea that those in control are working something else behind it all. But despite everything, the wars and conflicts, our civilization is moving forward containing, resolving said conflicts, before moving on. It's just the Order of things.

If you're still reading/skimming up to this part, thanks for taking note whether you disagree or not. I was just totally in the mood and the dam burst. Anyway, thanks for reading/skimming. Cheers!
They make me shiiiaaaiiine!

13-Oct-2015 13:41:20

Siegfreid
Apr Member 2012

Siegfreid

Posts: 1,129 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@Lianna98

Excellent posts, said all that really needs to be said. If you ever feel like discussing lore with fellow Saradominists, you're more than welcome to stop by Aegis of Saradomin.
The
Aegis
Endures


We are united in Saradomin's light. From this unity we draw strength.

13-Oct-2015 13:50:41

Hazeel

Hazeel

Posts: 6,735 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@Lianna98

A true Zamorakian is free, seeks power, becomes strong, and never gives up on gaining more power, yes. So many Zamorakians, including some that may be considered unsavory, are "true Zamorakians."

However a true Zamorakian is also someone who seeks to raise others up so they may gain power as well....such as Zamorak himself.

Why is this? Because when society grows in power, so do we. When a new invention, technique, skill, or improvement is brought and shared to the world, we all gain from it. Needlessly enslaving or killing people limits the growth they could have given society if they had grown to be powerful. By limiting their growth, you have limited the growth of society and yourself by extension.

With that said, there's nothing wrong with bloodlust. Zamorak and the other Mahjarrat are a very bloodthirsty race, afterall. Thus it's important to focus that bloodlust. Use it on enemies or creatures who provide use in death (food, dragonhide, etc.). Don't use it on someone who has so much more to offer to both you and the world while they live.

Likewise, enslaving your enemies is more merciful and more efficient than killing them. But when you enslave your people, your potential allies, and your own society, you are limiting them on their growth. When you refuse to share your own discoveries, techniques, knowledge, and power with your allies, you are denying them the chance to improve on what you have and thus you are operating based on a desire for dominance. Your are letting your desire for control overtake your need for power, and this is not Zamorakian.

@Kanarthasis

Stop trolling. Runescape doesn't need a hero...it needs a villain. An all encompassing force of evil that will remain ever-threatening and use chaos to make the peoples of Gielinor tolerate each other, grow strong together, and fight side by side against this evil. I am that villain.

14-Oct-2015 05:33:49 - Last edited on 14-Oct-2015 05:34:22 by Hazeel

Quick find code: 341-342-835-65250304 Back to Top