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Nelfarion44

Nelfarion44

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Umbrardor said :
Breaking character as in veering from the debate. Also, when I'm on these forums, I try to base everything I say on official content. I don't make real world examples and I stick to what is canon. That's the reason why I never complained about what you said the mod said. It felt like I just needed to roll with "segregation" and "walls" (which was why my first response to your quotation of the mod was so messy).

I absolutely hate how whatever the mods say about the gods is what is considered fact. For example, this thread and what the mods said about Saradomin really irks me. I want a god I can truly hate. A big fat blue jerk. Instead, they make him out to be a flawed but tolerant god, waiting for redemption.

Just out of curiosity, what do you think of Zamorak?

21-Feb-2014 04:38:15

Umbrardor

Umbrardor

Posts: 177 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Zamorak is not the right god for the majority. Few are able to understand the full depth of his teachings. Rather than cause chaos for the sake of progress, they cause chaos because they have the power to. When I spoke to Moldark, the emissary for Zamorak, I identified two key points in his religion. The first is "Strength through
Chaos
". The second is "Readiness to accept
Power
". With chaos, progress is achieved. With power, the advantage of initiative is taken. I find nothing wrong with that. I've just noticed how minor the use of the first occurs. When I come across Zamorakian followers in Gielinor, I find that the motives behind their actions are for power and the favor of their god (for more power).

Short and clean: His teachings are correct, his followers are blinded by power.

21-Feb-2014 05:05:14

Nelfarion44

Nelfarion44

Posts: 3,877 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Umbrardor said :
Zamorak is not the right god for the majority. Few are able to understand the full depth of his teachings. Rather than cause chaos for the sake of progress, they cause chaos because they have the power to. When I spoke to Moldark, the emissary for Zamorak, I identified two key points in his religion. The first is "Strength through
Chaos
". The second is "Readiness to accept
Power
". With chaos, progress is achieved. With power, the advantage of initiative is taken. I find nothing wrong with that. I've just noticed how minor the use of the first occurs. When I come across Zamorakian followers in Gielinor, I find that the motives behind their actions are for power and the favor of their god (for more power).

Short and clean: His teachings are correct, his followers are blinded by power.

A lot of Zamorakians has hybridized and bastardized Zamorak's actual philosophy, even the mods say so. They use Zamorak's philosophy to revel in chaos for their own sake.

21-Feb-2014 12:29:37

Balustan

Balustan

Posts: 19,291 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Nelfarion44 said :
Umbrardor said :
Zamorak is not the right god for the majority. Few are able to understand the full depth of his teachings. Rather than cause chaos for the sake of progress, they cause chaos because they have the power to. When I spoke to Moldark, the emissary for Zamorak, I identified two key points in his religion. The first is "Strength through
Chaos
". The second is "Readiness to accept
Power
". With chaos, progress is achieved. With power, the advantage of initiative is taken. I find nothing wrong with that. I've just noticed how minor the use of the first occurs. When I come across Zamorakian followers in Gielinor, I find that the motives behind their actions are for power and the favor of their god (for more power).

Short and clean: His teachings are correct, his followers are blinded by power.

A lot of Zamorakians has hybridized and bastardized Zamorak's actual philosophy, even the mods say so. They use Zamorak's philosophy to revel in chaos for their own sake.

This is correct they basically take Zamorak's name as if it gives them the right to cause sensless destruction which is actually not the case. Jagex have done a bad job at portraying this however.
Lewis
|
Quester
|
Scottish

27-Feb-2014 23:08:25

Umbrardor

Umbrardor

Posts: 177 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Balustan. What if I were to tell you Zamorak himself does not follow the value of his teachings? That he is like his followers. That he uses chaos as an excuse to seize power at every opportunity for his own benefit? If I said this, would you be able to defend Zamorak?

28-Feb-2014 02:04:13

Nelfarion44

Nelfarion44

Posts: 3,877 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Umbrardor said :
Balustan. What if I were to tell you Zamorak himself does not follow the value of his teachings? That he is like his followers. That he uses chaos as an excuse to seize power at every opportunity for his own benefit? If I said this, would you be able to defend Zamorak?

He is not like (most of) his followers. He has even denounced Lensig (Dawn) in Missing, Presumed Death. He does use his philosophy to gain power, but also, that we gain power with him. We help him, he helps us.

Mod Osborne genuinely believes Zamorak aspires to see greatness in our world.

28-Feb-2014 04:23:31 - Last edited on 28-Feb-2014 04:24:37 by Nelfarion44

Balustan

Balustan

Posts: 19,291 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Umbrardor said :
Balustan. What if I were to tell you Zamorak himself does not follow the value of his teachings? That he is like his followers. That he uses chaos as an excuse to seize power at every opportunity for his own benefit? If I said this, would you be able to defend Zamorak?

You would be incorrect. Btw I am not Zamorakian and do not actually like Zamorak's philosophy or methods but he is a great character who is grossly misrepresented in game.
Lewis
|
Quester
|
Scottish

02-Mar-2014 15:54:43

Vardan

Vardan

Posts: 1,237 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
There seems to be a disconnect between the Saradomin in the game and the Saradomin in their heads. In game they basically have him kick the dog every chance they can to try to show that he's not pure goodness and love. The way they do this however is by having him commit stupidly evil acts in an attempt to "grey" him. They talk about him wanting to protect his followers but in the game they portray him as abusing them. They talk about him not wanting to kick all the other gods out unless their a threat, but then they had that goblin hint that Armadyl and Saradomin might clash again in the future. I wish they'd be a bit more consistent between how they want to portray him, and how they actually portray him.
We sleep soundly in our beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do us harm.

03-Mar-2014 01:51:19

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