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Zaros the sociopath

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Angof Cywir

Angof Cywir

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A sociopath is someone who feels no remorse or shame.

This is exactly what Zaros is without a doubt after we found out from testimonial evidence that he knowingly tortured many creatures in his unethical conquest of creating new life.

The court brings to the stand the plaintiff:
the Fallen Nihil,
the product of one of Zaros' mad experiments on Freneskae!

This being was, and I quote from in-game text, "fused together through torture within the depths of Freneskae" and deemed nothing more than in insignificant failure to Zaros, left rejected on a cold planet to die, until he was saved and redeemed by said Queen of Ash. Now this Nihil has a burning vengeance to kill Zaros.

How could Zaros do this? Does he really care about mortals, even his own children? Sure, he was disappointed that he could not save the Dragonriders and what not, but his so-called feelings towards them can be interpreted in many ways. Was he really sad about them on a passionate level (like how we feel)? Or was it more on the static "tool level" or "chesspiece" kind of connection as to how he felt?

Zaros is not pro-life. He is a mad scientist who feels no remorse to beings that he openly tortures. I can see him openly performing eugenics and experimenting on humans and other races to get them to become "perfect." He even says his philosophy is all about self-improving, reaching one's highest potential, and to have mortals ascend to a master "perfect" race. In The Light Within, he says he wants to make the universe "perfect." Perfect. What does that even mean?!

"I merely wish to encourage individuals to reach their full potential. Mortal life fascinates me. It has such potential for growth; it is both fragile and resilient; and it reacts quickly to change. The current elder gods are stagnant and slow, and too fragile – Mah is proof enough of this." -Zaros, from fotg

^
Doesn't any of that scream crazy scientist vibes to anyone?
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08-Nov-2016 06:38:00

Helring
Mar Member 2005

Helring

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Oh, Zaros is completely a crazy scientist type character. He does lack many emotions, but I think he tries to get better. He wants to help mortals, its just that he's not sure how, so he's constantly striving to learn more. Its not really his fault, it seems he got all the logic and not the emotions, and Seren got all the emotions but not much logic.

Hail Zaros!
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08-Nov-2016 07:13:34

Zulkir

Zulkir

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We've known for ages now what he did to Nihils, where was your thread then?

Zaros is driven by logic, not emotion. It made no sense from his standpoint to care for or bother with this failed attempts at creating life on his own, yet this so called sociopath decided that one was worth his time, and gave it a fragment of himself to grant it proper sentient life.

We know her as Nex, a being the lesser gods fear, one Zaros has in his inner circle, and trusted as one of his highest generals.

People can't expect Zaros to be held by mortal, or better yet human emotions or reasoning, he's far beyond that, just like Seren claims what she and Guthix had was more than love. Mortal emotions and logic have mortal restrictions, you think a being like Zaros is so limited?

You claim he's Anti-Life when his entire philosophy that you claim is "Mad scientist" worthy, is actively to encourage mortals to reach their full potential, to not give into weakness. That's very caring, in his own way.
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08-Nov-2016 12:06:16 - Last edited on 08-Nov-2016 12:10:59 by Zulkir

Hguoh

Hguoh

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Angof Cywir said :
This being was, and I quote from in-game text, "fused together through torture within the depths of Freneskae" and deemed nothing more than in insignificant failure to Zaros, left rejected on a cold planet to die, until he was saved and redeemed by said Queen of Ash. Now this Nihil has a burning vengeance to kill Zaros.

Most of the time, the Nihil are not sentient, and talking to the nihil familiars indicates that they generally like how they are (note: this does not mean the beings Zaros used to make them do, just the resulting Nihil) and advise others to be like them.

There have only been two cases of Nihil achieving sentience: Nex and the fallen nihil. Nex was made sentient when Zaros implanted a shard of his being in her (though it made her incapable of being anything but loyal to him). Seeing as the fallen nihil serves the QoA, I'd guess she likely did something very similar to what Zaros did with Nex. This would mean that the fallen nihil is more than likely incapable of even considering dissent against the QoA or her cause, which would explain the stark difference between it and other nihil.

08-Nov-2016 12:12:02 - Last edited on 08-Nov-2016 12:33:38 by Hguoh

Hguoh

Hguoh

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Angof Cywir said :
Zaros is not pro-life. He is a mad scientist who feels no remorse to beings that he openly tortures. I can see him openly performing eugenics and experimenting on humans and other races to get them to become "perfect." He even says his philosophy is all about self-improving, reaching one's highest potential, and to have mortals ascend to a master "perfect" race. In The Light Within, he says he wants to make the universe "perfect." Perfect. What does that even mean?!

Well this is the fastest example of Godwin's law I've ever seen.

Let me be clear: yes, Zaros is a sociopath, but that doesn't mean that he'd support a stupid idea like eugenics. Eugenics presupposes that some genetic traits are inherently more valuble than/superior to others, and completely ignores the inherent value in genetic variation and that some/most genetic traits have situational viability. So yeah even ignoring the ethical concerns, eugenics is an utterly stupid idea. And given Zaros has given up trying to force mortals to follow him and his ways (relying instead on them being willing to follow him) it would be nigh impossible to implement such a program (as it necessitates a wide adherence to the rules imposed).

And to clarify TLW point, that was from back when Zaros had just left Freneskae. I'll let Zaros explain it. First in quote:

I saw it as my divine right. The failure of my empire opened my eyes, however. Since then, I have had much time to consider my failures. I was acting no better than Mah, attempting to control mortals. I see my role now being to lead mortals – the young gods included – towards uplifting themselves. And to work with those powerful few who have stepped beyond the need for guidance. I see this in you.

08-Nov-2016 12:28:09

Hguoh

Hguoh

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And second in memory:

Upon my return to Gielinor, I searched for Mah's elder sisters, hoping to convince them to aid in my transcendence. Instead I discovered a horrifying truth about this world. I know now what its true purpose is. It is not for mortals. It is not for me. And only the powerful have a hope of surviving. My path is clear. Though I cannot create life, I can forge it into stronger forms. Perhaps one such form will be our deliverance. My empire has taught me that pushing mortals meets with resistance, so I must learn to pull them instead: to lead them from the shadows. I must become the guiding voice within their heads - their drive, their urgency, their passion and their betterment. I shall become the mortals' will to power. There is little time, and this will take all my efforts.

Acknowledging Zaros as a sociopath, he has a very logical rationale behind his actions (besides: MUAHAHA mad scientist-ing it up) and for genuinely helping mortals survive (hint: it helps him survive).

08-Nov-2016 12:32:58 - Last edited on 08-Nov-2016 12:35:03 by Hguoh

Wahisietel
Oct Member 2005

Wahisietel

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Hguoh said :
Angof Cywir said :
Zaros is not pro-life. He is a mad scientist who feels no remorse to beings that he openly tortures. I can see him openly performing eugenics and experimenting on humans and other races to get them to become "perfect." He even says his philosophy is all about self-improving, reaching one's highest potential, and to have mortals ascend to a master "perfect" race. In The Light Within, he says he wants to make the universe "perfect." Perfect. What does that even mean?!

Well this is the fastest example of Godwin's law I've ever seen.

Let me be clear: yes, Zaros is a sociopath, but that doesn't mean that he'd support a stupid idea like eugenics. Eugenics presupposes that some genetic traits are inherently more valuble than/superior to others, and completely ignores the inherent value in genetic variation and that some/most genetic traits have situational viability. So yeah even ignoring the ethical concerns, eugenics is an utterly stupid idea. And given Zaros has given up trying to force mortals to follow him and his ways (relying instead on them being willing to follow him) it would be nigh impossible to implement such a program (as it necessitates a wide adherence to the rules imposed).

Zaros's dog practices Eugenics though. Zaros is evil confirmed. You never were our brightest star, Khazard. 'Vermin slaughtered like lambs'? What does that even mean?

08-Nov-2016 13:51:38

Quael
Jan Member 2018

Quael

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Zaros was made with no emotion. According to jmods, emotion was an alien, a new thing to him. When he created the Nihil he created them to save one race. Zaros really doesn't care what he did in the past, or show and kind of regrets for abandoning them. He is still a god with no emotion, learning what it is.
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08-Nov-2016 13:55:29

Hguoh

Hguoh

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Wahisietel said :
Hguoh said :
Angof Cywir said :
Zaros is not pro-life. He is a mad scientist who feels no remorse to beings that he openly tortures. I can see him openly performing eugenics and experimenting on humans and other races to get them to become "perfect." He even says his philosophy is all about self-improving, reaching one's highest potential, and to have mortals ascend to a master "perfect" race. In The Light Within, he says he wants to make the universe "perfect." Perfect. What does that even mean?!

Well this is the fastest example of Godwin's law I've ever seen.

Let me be clear: yes, Zaros is a sociopath, but that doesn't mean that he'd support a stupid idea like eugenics. Eugenics presupposes that some genetic traits are inherently more valuble than/superior to others, and completely ignores the inherent value in genetic variation and that some/most genetic traits have situational viability. So yeah even ignoring the ethical concerns, eugenics is an utterly stupid idea. And given Zaros has given up trying to force mortals to follow him and his ways (relying instead on them being willing to follow him) it would be nigh impossible to implement such a program (as it necessitates a wide adherence to the rules imposed).

Zaros's dog practices Eugenics though. Zaros is evil confirmed.

Ah, but only after Guthix uplifted him and made him a guardian of Guthix. Guthix is evil confirmed.

But wait, Guthix also tinkered with us. That must mean that we are evil as well.

Oh noes!!! :P

08-Nov-2016 14:08:50

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