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Unicornz pwn
Dec Member 2023

Unicornz pwn

Posts: 3,009 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Padomenes said :
Unicornz pwn said :
Daaaaaamn calm down. Like that wasn't even his point. I agree we shouldn't sacrifice good storytelling on the altar of diversity, by doing that you are tokenizing minorities rather than making them out as people. You completely ignored that and went full gender studies major instead.

And honestly, Armadyl being gay was a pleasant addition, but I agree, it didn't blow me away in shock. Nothing wrong with saying Armadyl comes across as someone who could be gay, if it's not meant as a negative.

I'm also not a 'whitecishetmale' so you can refrain from telling me to stay in my lane. You are still far-right in your ideology and try to associate Armadyl's behaviors to all gays. I know what ideology you are. And its not sacrificing, its ensuring that its fair to people who do not conform to your status quos of what you call "normal" which is subjective to everybody. He is right, howcome we are only allowed to have characters/storytelling which must follow your standards?
Lol
Far right
Good one

Fair is also subjective

Stop oppressing me
"Ego Te Provoco."

The Hooded Zarosian

Lorehound Extraordinaire

21-Dec-2016 05:35:29

Summerleaf
Nov Member 2012

Summerleaf

Posts: 3,313 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Unicornz pwn said :

Daaaaaamn calm down. Like that wasn't even his point. I agree we shouldn't sacrifice good storytelling on the altar of diversity, by doing that you are tokenizing minorities rather than making them out as people. You completely ignored that and went full gender studies major instead.


I actually laughed out loud (because you're funny, not because I don't think you're making a valid point)

You're right in that making tokens can have a really negative affect, but the way that I have seen Jagex deal with these kinds of issues, it tends to come off with mostly positive results.

Overall, though, looking at the numbers on how many queer characters are actually in-game, we are far outnumbered by the straight/cis population (like less than 20 character's are openly LGBTQ+).

My biggest gripe is: Why are all the straight people freaking out when we gays are "Yay! Representation!"

Like, I haven't seen anyone who identifies on the queer spectrum posting on the forums about it for the sole purpose of making a big deal out of it, it's the cishet people who bring it up, and then I feel like I have to defend my identity, since people tend to be ignorant about it.

21-Dec-2016 05:40:51

Padomenes

Padomenes

Posts: 3,662 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Unicornz pwn said :
Padomenes said :
Unicornz pwn said :
Daaaaaamn calm down. Like that wasn't even his point. I agree we shouldn't sacrifice good storytelling on the altar of diversity, by doing that you are tokenizing minorities rather than making them out as people. You completely ignored that and went full gender studies major instead.

And honestly, Armadyl being gay was a pleasant addition, but I agree, it didn't blow me away in shock. Nothing wrong with saying Armadyl comes across as someone who could be gay, if it's not meant as a negative.

I'm also not a 'whitecishetmale' so you can refrain from telling me to stay in my lane. You are still far-right in your ideology and try to associate Armadyl's behaviors to all gays. I know what ideology you are. And its not sacrificing, its ensuring that its fair to people who do not conform to your status quos of what you call "normal" which is subjective to everybody. He is right, howcome we are only allowed to have characters/storytelling which must follow your standards?
Lol
Far right
Good one

Fair is also subjective You seem so repulsed or obverse to the idea of: if a significant amount of characters or the story do not fit your status quo of what you call "normal" in your regressive views. So yes.

Fair is also universal in that everybody has the same opportunities in life as everyone else.

Summerleaf said :
Also, could someone please give me an example of how storytelling in this game has been ruined by a person of color being introduced, or an LGBT character coming out?

21-Dec-2016 05:41:41 - Last edited on 21-Dec-2016 05:46:38 by Padomenes

Ancient Drew

Ancient Drew

Posts: 5,732 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Summerleaf said :
Unicornz pwn said :

Daaaaaamn calm down. Like that wasn't even his point. I agree we shouldn't sacrifice good storytelling on the altar of diversity, by doing that you are tokenizing minorities rather than making them out as people. You completely ignored that and went full gender studies major instead.


I actually laughed out loud (because you're funny, not because I don't think you're making a valid point)

You're right in that making tokens can have a really negative affect, but the way that I have seen Jagex deal with these kinds of issues, it tends to come off with mostly positive results.

Overall, though, looking at the numbers on how many queer characters are actually in-game, we are far outnumbered by the straight/cis population (like less than 20 character's are openly LGBTQ+).

My biggest gripe is: Why are all the straight people freaking out when we gays are "Yay! Representation!"

Like, I haven't seen anyone who identifies on the queer spectrum posting on the forums about it for the sole purpose of making a big deal out of it, it's the cishet people who bring it up, and then I feel like I have to defend my identity, since people tend to be ignorant about it. Don't rise to it. He's clearly trolling. Prepare for hell on RuneScape in Naval Cataclysm!

Pokemon battle? Friend Code: 4614-0426-2439

21-Dec-2016 05:43:39

Unicornz pwn
Dec Member 2023

Unicornz pwn

Posts: 3,009 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Summerleaf said :
Unicornz pwn said :

Daaaaaamn calm down. Like that wasn't even his point. I agree we shouldn't sacrifice good storytelling on the altar of diversity, by doing that you are tokenizing minorities rather than making them out as people. You completely ignored that and went full gender studies major instead.


I actually laughed out loud (because you're funny, not because I don't think you're making a valid point)

You're right in that making tokens can have a really negative affect, but the way that I have seen Jagex deal with these kinds of issues, it tends to come off with mostly positive results.

Overall, though, looking at the numbers on how many queer characters are actually in-game, we are far outnumbered by the straight/cis population (like less than 20 character's are openly LGBTQ+).

My biggest gripe is: Why are all the straight people freaking out when we gays are "Yay! Representation!"

Like, I haven't seen anyone who identifies on the queer spectrum posting on the forums about it for the sole purpose of making a big deal out of it, it's the cishet people who bring it up, and then I feel like I have to defend my identity, since people tend to be ignorant about it.
I've always just found rich characters with a coherent backstory to be far more enticing and good for representation than a dime a dozen diversity checklist. Angof, Armadyl, these are characters whose identities mesh well with who they are as characters and give us insightful lore.

cont.
"Ego Te Provoco."

The Hooded Zarosian

Lorehound Extraordinaire

21-Dec-2016 05:49:41

Unicornz pwn
Dec Member 2023

Unicornz pwn

Posts: 3,009 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I have no problem with making a character gay, or trans, or disabled, and leaving it at that, but the instances where we do have a minority character I think general complaining/phobic behavior is just as pointless as cheering diversity while ignoring good storytelling in order to make everyone feel equal.

Good storytelling includes naturally occurring diversity, and I think there's a middle ground to be found. And I think Jagex has done a pretty good job with it so far, it never seems forced, so in that regard I think Ascertes has a point, but his concern is completely hypothetical, because I've yet to see them sacrifice the story for diversity, and I hope that continues.
"Ego Te Provoco."

The Hooded Zarosian

Lorehound Extraordinaire

21-Dec-2016 05:51:10 - Last edited on 21-Dec-2016 05:54:31 by Unicornz pwn

Padomenes

Padomenes

Posts: 3,662 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Unicornz pwn said :
Good storytelling includes naturally occurring diversity, and I think there's a middle ground to be found. And I think Jagex has done a pretty good job with it so far, it never seems forced, so in that regard I think Ascertes has a point, but his concern is completely hypothetical, because I've yet to see them sacrifice the story for diversity, and I hope that continues. Your "middle ground" is "as long as they are kept very few".

Could you please state how storytelling in this game would be ruined by the introduction of more people of color being introduced, or an LGBT character coming out?

21-Dec-2016 05:54:28

Unicornz pwn
Dec Member 2023

Unicornz pwn

Posts: 3,009 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Padomenes said :
Unicornz pwn said :
Good storytelling includes naturally occurring diversity, and I think there's a middle ground to be found. And I think Jagex has done a pretty good job with it so far, it never seems forced, so in that regard I think Ascertes has a point, but his concern is completely hypothetical, because I've yet to see them sacrifice the story for diversity, and I hope that continues. Your "middle ground" is "as long as they are kept very few".

Could you please state how storytelling in this game would be ruined by the introduction of more people of color being introduced, or an LGBT character coming out?
I never said that it should be kept few, I said it should never be done at the expense of the story. By that logic there are countless opportunities for inclusion.

I also said I've yet to see diversity lead to harm to storytelling in this game, and people like Mod Raven do it masterfully, so you really don't have a point to argue other than virtue signaling at this point.
"Ego Te Provoco."

The Hooded Zarosian

Lorehound Extraordinaire

21-Dec-2016 05:56:36

Summerleaf
Nov Member 2012

Summerleaf

Posts: 3,313 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Unicornz pwn said :
I have no problem with making a character gay, or trans, or disabled, and leaving it at that, but

Whenever I hear:

"I have no problem with _____ But..."

I stop reading, because something ignorant or phobic usually follows.

21-Dec-2016 05:59:33

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