RuneScape Forum Archive | Wilderness and Free Trade Vote

dunforgiven

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...If merchants were not providing a wanted and needed service...
wrong, it was neither needed nor wanted, nor is it needed or wanted now.

...If merchants were not providing a wanted and needed service, they could not make any money at all....
wrong. it was called taking advantage of others. it was called monoplizing. in real life, it would have been called a crime. frankly my dear, I couldn't give a dam. never had a river to build one on.
veteran of 4 runescapes

18-Jan-2011 19:05:50 - Last edited on 18-Jan-2011 19:07:13 by dunforgiven

[#LHG9INIEP]

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agent B, is it a crime to buy a chocolate bar for 45p and sell it for £1. no... thats practically what that is, hes just selling it for more to people who want it? and as for just going WRONG when you dont agree with some, well its showing us all just how narrow minded you are.You arent willing to accept anyone else's argument yet your throwing plenty at us yourself? Not only that but merchers NEVER effected the community when free trade was available, they flipped items, brought low sold higher. if u didnt want to buy for that price, youd find someone else, there was always someone selling cheaply, whether its because there in need of the money fast or if they just want to sell all there stuff fast it will be cheap****;-- you said to me, "if u think that you must be more of an idiot then mega" tbh i dont take offence from that, i agree with 90% of what hes putting forward and think that there well backed up and arent complete BULL like the stuff your spewing.whining kid.

18-Jan-2011 19:25:56

[#0EZAYVTV1]

Posts: 967 Gold Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

the g.e will probably stay in the game guys. it doesn't make any sense to pull it from the game when it is utilized so much by an awful lot of people. most people dont want to search around world to world looking for items they need, when they can just go to a centralized place and purchase that item.

18-Jan-2011 20:14:08 - Last edited on 18-Jan-2011 20:15:08 by [#0EZAYVTV1]

dunforgiven

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zer0skillzX

18-Jan-2011 19:25:56
agent B, is it a crime to buy a chocolate bar for 45p and sell it for £1. no...
if you and your choorts buy up all the bars for 45p and sell them at 1 pound (i think thats what that is) and they are only worth 45p, then yes it is a crime (at least in the us). its called a monopoly. its called price fixing. it is illegal in many parts of the world.

...just how narrow minded you are...
im narrow minded. im talking about compromise and insisting on having it your way.
...Not only that but merchers NEVER effected the community
when free trade was available..
then explain why jagex was FORCED to create two seperate updates JUST TO SAVE ONE SKILL. without the blast furnace and the kingdom of mis, smithing was a dead skill. only merchant and cheats could do it.
jagex deliberately set it where it had an incentive to help low level accounts by smelting and smithing the ores and coal they got as drops into armor and weapons. instead merchants created a situation where you had to pay for your exps by buying up all the small groups of coal and ores for a fraction of their worth, and selling them ABOVE their worth. since there was so many successful merchants (due the the merchants bible) successful pkers and pkers mains that needed levels to make money selling rune plates, they had an endless demand for overpriced ores and such.
allow me to give you an example from my own history.
when i was a young (just learned to make steel) smither, i learned you couldnt mine enough coal and iron to keep your smithing levels close. at the time (pre bata), you had to buy your coals and ores in certs of 5 items. a cert of 5 coal sold for 1k. this meant i couldnt make money off smithing useing it.
i asked a seller "how am i suppose to make money smithing things at this cost?" his answer: "people like you ruin the game." what he meant, was people that expected to buy ores cheap enough to make money ruined things for merchants. frankly my dear, I couldn't give a dam. never had a river to build one on.
veteran of 4 runescapes

18-Jan-2011 20:20:53 - Last edited on 18-Jan-2011 20:30:29 by dunforgiven

Phthartic

Posts: 1,730 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Agent--
What is your definition of worth?
There is a difference between what a chocolate bar is worth to an individual and what it costs to make it. The difference is what makes up profit, and as of yet, we do still allow most companies to make a profit in the US.
But don't take this as support for price manipulation clans; I'm totally with you on them. I just think you might be conflating honest merchers and price manipulators. I think even some degree of price manipulation is permissible here in the real world US economy.

18-Jan-2011 20:27:20 - Last edited on 18-Jan-2011 20:31:27 by Phthartic

dunforgiven

Posts: 102,158 Ruby Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

heres an example.
mith plates alch for 3500 (or something in that region, it works for this). it takes 4 coal and one mith to make a bar and 5 bars to make a plate. this means the bar is worth 700 and the ores and bars are worth about 120 for coal, and 200 for mith.
instead mith sells for 500 and coal sells for 200. it cost 1500 for a bar, and 7500 for a mith plate. thats more than double its worth.
some would argue that the exps you get for making the plate is worth the extra 4k, but they arent.
it might be worth an extra 1 k at most for the few exps you gain making the plate. but the bars themself are not worth 7500.
E A Z Y D

18-Jan-2011 15:43:03
...whats to argue about...
they still have not said precisly how it will return. there is a possiblity that they will make it where it is not as insulting as it has appeared to be so far. frankly my dear, I couldn't give a dam. never had a river to build one on.
veteran of 4 runescapes

18-Jan-2011 20:33:27 - Last edited on 18-Jan-2011 20:38:43 by dunforgiven

Phthartic

Posts: 1,730 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Yes, I never bother to do the math, but I know just by feel that these days I can't expect to make money by making stuff from raw materials, e.g. logs to bows, ore to armor etc.
When I started RS (in early 06) I assumed that was the way an honest workmanlike player made money. I figured there weren't many people with a high enough smithing level, for example, to make rune items, or a high enough mining level to mine rune, so the price of rune items reflected their relative rarity. But by the time I was high enough level to do this sort of work, the prices were dropping to where the profit to be had from craftsmanship was very slight, and eventually the relationship inverted, so I now had to pay for my experience, just as you say.
I'm not sure of the cause for this though.
It COULD be that trade restrictions had some complex interaction with the economy beyond my level of interest in economics to bother trying to understand (Money bores me TBH; even IRL).
Or it could be that more and more people getting higher levels in mining and smithing (in our example) made rune items more common, thus driving the price down regardless of trade limits or merchants.
This explains why I'm neutral to free trade on economic grounds while being very opposed on botting/cheating grounds.

18-Jan-2011 20:55:36

[#0EZAYVTV1]

Posts: 967 Gold Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

do you guys think that free trade will drastically change the g.e prices, or just slightly, or maybe it will just vary on the item?

also who will set the g.e. prices? will they hire someone to act as chief economist to set fair prices?

18-Jan-2011 21:01:51 - Last edited on 18-Jan-2011 21:03:56 by [#0EZAYVTV1]

Phthartic

Posts: 1,730 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I don't feel qualified to comment much on this topic, other than to say that for items that have been trading with lots of junk accompanying the full upper limit of cash (a high "street value&quot

would seem destined to rise in price.
I NEVER do those sort of transactions though; I either buy from the GE or I get it myself through drops, etc.

18-Jan-2011 21:08:17

[#LHG9INIEP]

Posts: 169 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

neo, the prices of the g,e will drastically change, and the dont need to, jagex knows every trade in the game, they have a system that records it and sets prices automatically based on the average amount people are paying, just as it is with the g.e (to some extent) nowadays. but with the g.e there is a limit to how high or low a price can go. along with that there are price manipulators who effect it even more, they wont be so much of an issue after the free trade update.despite the bs agent is saying.

18-Jan-2011 21:09:32

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Wilderness and Free Trade Vote