RuneScape Forum Archive | Epidemics, Pandemics, Outbreak

NexOrigin

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Joel said :
If there’s reason to believe (with data backing it up) people are more likely to gather in homes during the evening after work and that was potentially contributing to the spread, then maybe that formed part of their decision to implement a curfew. Why didn’t Ontario? If there was a higher plan to control us? Ontario didn’t because as I mentioned, indicators have shown that people here are now listening and staying home, rendering the need for an enforceable curfew unnecessary. Do you have any citations for that data?

Joel said :
Perhaps because 25 at a skating rink (is it outdoors?) just simply skating around, keeping distance from one another is slightly different than hockey… which is a contact sport, therefore closer proximity to one another - logic. And yet, city buses are still filled with people. No logic.

Oh, and of course, logically, the people who institute these bans on things like hockey, that logic and those bans don't apply to them and their friends.

CAUGHT! Brampton Ontario Mayor Patrick Brown Breaks His Own Pandemic Rules

https://youtu.be/Q4F4Jqr0bE8

Patrick Brown RETURNS to hockey rink: Different ice time, different Mercedes, new security!

https://youtu.be/84LpWhrqXE0

DEBUNKING Patrick Brown’s 5 Lies: Mayor caught breaking own lockdown rules at hockey rink

https://youtu.be/p4_aJf2makQ

Bylaws updated AFTER we caught Mayor Brown BREAKING rules — and we’re taking legal action

https://youtu.be/vNj0uQlFoFc

YOU'RE not allowed to play hockey because it's a health risk, but THEY'RE allowed to play and it's not a health risk. Logic? I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

02-Feb-2021 02:01:13

Feb

2005

Joel

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NexOrigin said :
Sure, but I'm backing up my reasons with verifiable facts. Like I said, I'm willing to cite a source for any claims I make. I'm not just arbitrarily making claims with nothing to back them up with. What verifiable facts? Simply that anal swabbing exist? Ok, so how do you make the leap from something existing (and not even in China being widely used), to it being widely used/mandated across the board for everyone when even after a second wave, not once have we been mandated to undergo regular testing?

NexOrigin said :
So when I ask why things such as lockdowns, mandatory mask orders, etc., were not done at a more critical time, the response I get is "the science changed". But now here you are, presenting the same the same argument that I have been presenting, and calling it illogical, just as I claimed it was illogical to advocate against masks at a critical time.

What if I simply said "the science changed", as is the response I have been given? We’ve already gone over criticisms and things that could have been handled differently in the first few months. But now we’re talking about after a year pretty much and rather than the handling, something completely different - asserting control over us - is there any credible evidence to suggest this based on the last 12 months? No, like I’ve said. Pure, speculation on what could be.

NexOrigin said :
If the number of cases keep spiking in the general population, regardless of lockdown measures, etc., would you feel that mandatory testing for the general population was justified? Again, speculation. Based on what? This hasn't happened. Lockdowns have worked thus far, and when lockdowns initially haven’t worked, restrictions just got tightened (like in Ontario from November into January) - Still don’t see any letter in my mailbox requiring me to appear for my backend to be tested though.

Joel

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02-Feb-2021 02:02:43

FiFi LaFeles

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Logic doesn't enter into it. Politicians have always believed themselves to be above the Rules they seek to impose on the unwashed masses. It's nothing new and has been happening in all areas of daily life long before Covid. They are all self-seeking weasels but some of them are also stupid weasels, and get caught.

Le Chat Guerrier

Bwian's Towel & Grief Shop

02-Feb-2021 02:07:07

NexOrigin

Posts: 2,592 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Joel said :
NexOrigin said :
Sure, but I'm backing up my reasons with verifiable facts. Like I said, I'm willing to cite a source for any claims I make. I'm not just arbitrarily making claims with nothing to back them up with. What verifiable facts? Simply that anal swabbing exist? Ok, so how do you make the leap from something existing (and not even in China being widely used), to it being widely used/mandated across the board for everyone when even after a second wave, not once have we been mandated to undergo regular testing? I've already explained my reasoning. Go back and re-read it. I'm not going to sit here explaining myself over and over to the same points.

Joel said :
Again, speculation. Based on what? This hasn't happened. Lockdowns have worked thus far, and when lockdowns initially haven’t worked, restrictions just got tightened (like in Ontario from November into January) - Still don’t see any letter in my mailbox requiring me to appear for my backend to be tested though. It's not speculation, it's a hypothetical question.

And it DID happen, that's why Doug Ford was contemplating a curfew in Ontario. He opted against it for the time being to "wait and see" how Quebec's curfew affected the infection rate.

Nice avoiding the question though.

I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

02-Feb-2021 02:12:01

Feb

2005

Joel

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NexOrigin said :
Joel said :
.... Do you have any citations for that data?

Joel said :
Perhaps because 25 at a skating rink (is it outdoors?) just simply skating around, keeping distance from one another is slightly different than hockey… which is a contact sport, therefore closer proximity to one another - logic. And yet, city buses are still filled with people. No logic.

Oh, and of course, logically, the people who institute these bans on things like hockey, that logic and those bans don't apply to them and their friends.

...

YOU'RE not allowed to play hockey because it's a health risk, but THEY'RE allowed to play and it's not a health risk. Logic?
Not sure what citation you need. Just google Cell Phone Data Covid Ontario. I think it was University of Toronto that was doing some data analysis. I don't remember which of the outlets I read about it - My point was more about that data being available to analyze and potentially base decisions on.

Joel said :
There are definitely certain rules which we could question (your sock example earlier was a fine one) but most of the above does have some sense of logic to it and doesn’t immediately point to the explanation that we’re being taken over & controlled for the sake of it. Like I've said, there are clearly things we can criticize - I've seen a few packed busses in Toronto actually, beyond questionable! I agree that its bad and shouldn't happened. That doesn't really dispute my earlier remarks in response to what we were actually talking about though.

Joel

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02-Feb-2021 02:12:33

NexOrigin

Posts: 2,592 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

FiFi LaFeles said :
Logic doesn't enter into it. Politicians have always believed themselves to be above the Rules they seek to impose on the unwashed masses. It's nothing new and has been happening in all areas of daily life long before Covid. They are all self-seeking weasels but some of them are also stupid weasels, and get caught. Exactly. This is why people need to be paying attention. This is why I call out the illogicality and hypocrisy. I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

02-Feb-2021 02:14:35

Feb

2005

Joel

Forum Moderator Posts: 32,973 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

NexOrigin said :
I've already explained my reasoning. Go back and re-read it. I'm not going to sit here explaining myself over and over to the same points. You made a giant leap from one thing to another thing based on speculation and paranoia - just so we're clear on that point

NexOrigin said :
It's not speculation, it's a hypothetical question.

And it DID happen, that's why Doug Ford was contemplating a curfew in Ontario. He opted against it for the time being to "wait and see" how Quebec's curfew affected the infection rate.

Nice avoiding the question though.

Wait, you didn't ask the hypothetical question with regards to a curfew, you asked about mandatory testing - to which I said, hasn't happened. Here:
NexOrigin said :
If the number of cases keep spiking in the general population, regardless of lockdown measures, etc., would you feel that mandatory testing for the general population was justified?
My response that tightened lockdowns have worked when they've needed to so why would we need to impose widespread testing at massive cost to the taxpayer when a tight lockdown has proven to be sufficient enough.

I don't think I would support widespread mandatory testing for everyone as there's simply no need since there's steps you can take before that even becoming a consideration - e.g tighter lockdowns. Does that answer your question directly enough?

In any case, you're trying to make an argument for why widespread backside testing would be 'plausible' in a time when vaccine rollout has started to hopefully put this behind us. Just another point based on paranoia.

Joel

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02-Feb-2021 02:20:28

NexOrigin

Posts: 2,592 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Joel said :
Not sure what citation you need. Just google Cell Phone Data Covid Ontario. I think it was University of Toronto that was doing some data analysis. I don't remember which of the outlets I read about it - My point was more about that data being available to analyze and potentially base decisions on. If you're just going to say "google it" when I ask for a citation, don't expect anything more from me when you ask for a citation. I'm just going to say "google it".

Joel said :
Like I've said, there are clearly things we can criticize - I've seen a few packed busses in Toronto actually, beyond questionable! I agree that its bad and shouldn't happened. That doesn't really dispute my earlier remarks in response to what we were actually talking about though. I'm pointing out the illogicality. Not every remark I make has to disprove a point you're making.

My intention in response to your point about outdoor hockey rinks being a "health risk" was to point out the hypocrisy and the lack logic in allowing city buses to still continue packed with people.

You can't play hockey, it's a health risk, so get back on the bus filled with people, and sit there for an hour until you get to your stop.

I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

02-Feb-2021 02:21:46

FiFi LaFeles

Posts: 24,106 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Yeah, I don't disagree about calling out numbskull individuals like the illustrious Mayor Brown.
We have several prominent figures over here who are utter hypocrites and have been busted.

However, I still don't buy into the notion that entire vast organisations, or Westernised countries, are in collusion in order to gain mass control of the world's population.

And that's going to be pretty much my last utterance on that specific line of thought.

Le Chat Guerrier

Bwian's Towel & Grief Shop

02-Feb-2021 02:24:17

NexOrigin

Posts: 2,592 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Joel said :
NexOrigin said :
I've already explained my reasoning. Go back and re-read it. I'm not going to sit here explaining myself over and over to the same points. You made a giant leap from one thing to another thing based on speculation and paranoia - just so we're clear on that point

It wasn't a giant leap, and I explained in detail why I used that reasoning. Just so we're clear on that.

Joel said :
Wait, you didn't ask the hypothetical question with regards to a curfew, you asked about mandatory testing - to which I said, hasn't happened. The spike in covid cases happened... We weren't talking about the curfew at that point, we were talking about the mandatory testing.... and how it was applied to travellers:

NexOrigin said :
Joel said :
Exactly, not mandated for everyone, only those who choose to ignore guidelines and continue to travel or those who need to travel for essential reasons, and only now has that been imposed as a result of recent spikes in cases and deaths, so hardly unjustified? If the number of cases keep spiking in the general population, regardless of lockdown measures, etc., would you feel that mandatory testing for the general population was justified?

If you're not even going to pay attention to the things that YOU have personally said, then why am I even trying to have a conversation? You're just trying to contradict anything I say, even ignoring your own comments in order to try and take my comments out of context... I'm better than you, but that doesn't mean you're not great!

02-Feb-2021 02:27:41 - Last edited on 02-Feb-2021 02:28:11 by NexOrigin

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