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THE GARDEN OF KHARID - WHY

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Fish Kitten
Sep Member 2013

Fish Kitten

Posts: 1,199 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Rikornak said :
If seeds are worth way less than their respective herbs it obviously is a good idea to plant multiples of them.

That conclusion depends on a lot of competing factors, the biggest two being what the supply side of seeds will look like in the future and that herb prices are historically fluid anyway. Seeds only had settled to what they were pre-update because of the logjam that "plant power" is supposed to solve. Taking the major sources of herb drops out of the PVM tables and replacing those with a scaled number of seeds instead, may change that dynamic dramatically.

In order to qualify as a good update (since Jagex doesn't like to upend the game economy in a negative manner), this shouldn't nudge the needle too far either direction. It's too soon to really tell which way this will go.

12-Nov-2022 19:47:10

Rikornak
Oct Member 2013

Rikornak

Posts: 9,258 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Fish Kitten said :
That conclusion depends on a lot of competing factors, the biggest two being what the supply side of seeds will look like in the future and that herb prices are historically fluid anyway. Seeds only had settled to what they were pre-update because of the logjam that "plant power" is supposed to solve. Taking the major sources of herb drops out of the PVM tables and replacing those with a scaled number of seeds instead, may change that dynamic dramatically.

In order to qualify as a good update (since Jagex doesn't like to upend the game economy in a negative manner), this shouldn't nudge the needle too far either direction. It's too soon to really tell which way this will go.

It certainly is hard to tell right now, since there are two factors active, that won't remain as is:

A - Since players currently wanting to re-comp are planting seeds like insane. That will start slowing down from tuesday onwards, since the first ones will have finished that content at that point. Probably not directly at that point, but eventually herbs will start to recover and eventually rise again in value.

B - Players currently are using a massive oversupply of herb seeds, they were not even remotely able to use up without plant power. Overall more seeds do drop now, but they certainly do not drop in numbers, you could use them as the sole source (high enrage bosses aside maybe) to continously doing 10 seeds herb runs. You will have to get more from others - potentially players who'd rather sell their supply, instead of using it.

I think my thesis remains true though. The lower the value of a seed compared to the herb you'll rather plant more seeds at once, the lower the herb value compared to the seed, you'll rather plant fewer. That doesn't imply it's 1 or 10 - the other options could be viable for some things as well, but I doubt many player would plan this throughoutly. Improvements: Tooltip / (F2P) QoL v2
Quick Fixes: Invention

12-Nov-2022 19:54:31 - Last edited on 12-Nov-2022 20:04:37 by Rikornak

Daddy Roshi
Jan Member 2018

Daddy Roshi

Posts: 3,348 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Skeleton Man said :
The mystical sand seed was a nice touch, but why not just give it outright?
It has already crashed a lot and I suspect it will be worth less than 50k before too long. so ur not being forced to pickpocket for the seed since its worthless the only people affected by this is ironman accounts even still its pretty easy to get maybe an hours worth of pickpocketing? if that? dont say thats not fair to IM since they need the seeds from there anyways so killing 2 birds with one stone
200m defence 08-10-2021


comp cape 12-19-2021

12-Nov-2022 20:30:53

Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Daddy Roshi said :
Skeleton Man said :
The mystical sand seed was a nice touch, but why not just give it outright?
It has already crashed a lot and I suspect it will be worth less than 50k before too long. so ur not being forced to pickpocket for the seed since its worthless the only people affected by this is ironman accounts even still its pretty easy to get maybe an hours worth of pickpocketing? if that? dont say thats not fair to IM since they need the seeds from there anyways so killing 2 birds with one stone

The new perma teleport seed stills worth good gp. Perhaps that why a Reddit user claimed 4 mil gp/hr pickpocketing druids. They aren't being handed out to everybody because they want diligent players to earn more gp on top of xp for the new content.

12-Nov-2022 21:46:56

Jeremy Cheng
Aug Member 2013

Jeremy Cheng

Posts: 25,679 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Dilbert2001 said :
Daddy Roshi said :
Skeleton Man said :
The mystical sand seed was a nice touch, but why not just give it outright?
It has already crashed a lot and I suspect it will be worth less than 50k before too long. so ur not being forced to pickpocket for the seed since its worthless the only people affected by this is ironman accounts even still its pretty easy to get maybe an hours worth of pickpocketing? if that? dont say thats not fair to IM since they need the seeds from there anyways so killing 2 birds with one stone

The new perma teleport seed stills worth good gp. Perhaps that why a Reddit user claimed 4 mil gp/hr pickpocketing druids. They aren't being handed out to everybody because they want diligent players to earn more gp on top of xp for the new content.
True, I had to pay 5m for my magical seed and my friend had to pay 10m for his seed 2nd day of release. Ofc the gp/hr is down now, but it's still a legit moneymaker for ppl with 99 thieving.

13-Nov-2022 08:09:34

Abby Taylor
Nov Member 2019

Abby Taylor

Posts: 2,214 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
So I was annoyed with the juju farming potion as well. But I've been doing runs with 10 seeds planted in all 7 patches, and I've typically been able to harvest all the patches before the potion runs out.

or it runs out for a couple herbs on the last patch which isn't so bad, 3 or 4 herbs out of a yield of like 300? it's not a big deal to me.

keep in mind I have the trollheim teleport, Mystical sand seed, explorers ring 4, 120 farming cape, refilling ecto phial...

I'm comped so with all these benefits i'm getting a typical yield of like 42 herbs per patch, after planting 10 seeds.
200m Woodcutting: 08/08/2021

Completionist: 09/10/2021

13-Nov-2022 08:24:46

Rikornak
Oct Member 2013

Rikornak

Posts: 9,258 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Abby Taylor said :
So I was annoyed with the juju farming potion as well. But I've been doing runs with 10 seeds planted in all 7 patches, and I've typically been able to harvest all the patches before the potion runs out.

or it runs out for a couple herbs on the last patch which isn't so bad, 3 or 4 herbs out of a yield of like 300? it's not a big deal to me.

keep in mind I have the trollheim teleport, Mystical sand seed, explorers ring 4, 120 farming cape, refilling ecto phial...

I'm comped so with all these benefits i'm getting a typical yield of like 42 herbs per patch, after planting 10 seeds.

I mean instead of meddling around with the potion (since most potions have a base duration of 6 minutes) itself they just could extend the jandiko effect to something long enough to get in an herb run reliably - or they do the same thing they did for mining: The super potion has the regular effect in addition - so you've got that effect for an hour. Improvements: Tooltip / (F2P) QoL v2
Quick Fixes: Invention

13-Nov-2022 09:14:16

Roddy Piper
Jan Member 2011

Roddy Piper

Posts: 13,757 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
"getting a typical yield of like 42 herbs per patch, after planting 10 seeds."

Ouch. Just using Jagex's chart, showing about 3x yield for 10 compared to 1.

You could expect to get 14 for 1 seed. And then 28 for the other 9.

13-Nov-2022 11:52:08

Dilbert2001
Jun Member 2006

Dilbert2001

Posts: 30,311 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Jeremy Cheng said :
Dilbert2001 said :
Daddy Roshi said :
Skeleton Man said :
The mystical sand seed was a nice touch, but why not just give it outright?
It has already crashed a lot and I suspect it will be worth less than 50k before too long. so ur not being forced to pickpocket for the seed since its worthless the only people affected by this is ironman accounts even still its pretty easy to get maybe an hours worth of pickpocketing? if that? dont say thats not fair to IM since they need the seeds from there anyways so killing 2 birds with one stone

The new perma teleport seed stills worth good gp. Perhaps that why a Reddit user claimed 4 mil gp/hr pickpocketing druids. They aren't being handed out to everybody because they want diligent players to earn more gp on top of xp for the new content.
True, I had to pay 5m for my magical seed and my friend had to pay 10m for his seed 2nd day of release. Ofc the gp/hr is down now, but it's still a legit moneymaker for ppl with 99 thieving.

Players dictate the ultimate prices of all items, the Garden teleport seed included. The idea in fixing the economy is to reward active participants. If everybody is going to get the same rewards without working for them we won't see active participants in the economy. We learned from the failure of the rationing scheme in the Chinese "Great Leap Forward" and what it did to their economy. :D

On the other hand if farmers and Bourgeois all have to work for the rewards if they want the better rewards, it narrow the gap and social and economical tensions between them. :)

13-Nov-2022 15:34:03 - Last edited on 13-Nov-2022 15:38:55 by Dilbert2001

Fish Kitten
Sep Member 2013

Fish Kitten

Posts: 1,199 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Rikornak said :
The lower the value of a seed compared to the herb you'll rather plant more seeds at once, the lower the herb value compared to the seed, you'll rather plant fewer.

That certainly makes sense on paper, but in practice your results might not be as expected. And once more, what you're describing above is a player who buys their seeds, and sells the herbs as they harvest them.

To me, that doesn't make a lot of sense if the aim is to maximize a profit and that all goes back to how volatile the herblore market is overall. Limiting that to just herbs (i.e. excluding secondaries), the price fluctuations can be insane. Go look at the historical graphs on wiki for something like toadflax to get a better of picture of this. IMO, timing the market is the most important thing if you're looking to get the most out of your efforts. And since broad fluctuations can stretch over a six month period or more, planting less seeds with more yield and then stockpiling it all, would make more sense if a player's goal is absolute profit.

But to each their own.

13-Nov-2022 19:46:45

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