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Space and Time question

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Solanumtinkr

Solanumtinkr

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I have been ponding something, if an object was suspended in time, so that it would reappear in that point in space, but say 10 minutes later, then in theory it should emerge outside the atmosphere as the planet is moving through space at about 65,000 mph. Right?

Though if it didn't it would have some fascinating consequences for space itself, as it would mean that "space" had been traveling along with the planet itself. Or at least a portion of it. Though other things could effect the resultant emergence co-ordinates.

Say you can give it the shove required to reappear 10 mintues later, what whould happen? O_o Reappearing on Earth exactly where it was given the shove just seems to be really stupid.

So does anyone here have enough background in such space time buffoonery to take a stab at it? The purpose of adventure is to shine light into dark places,
Poke monsters with a sharp stick, Then steal anything that isn't nailed down!
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22-Feb-2017 18:51:42 - Last edited on 23-Feb-2017 09:35:35 by Solanumtinkr

Weyburns
Nov Member 2021

Weyburns

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space is traveling too, but at a different direction and not in the same way. essentially space is expanding at a rate faster than it technically should be since the big bang, and the visible universe is essentially what we consider the universe, but there is space outside of the visible universe but no light has hit that yet.

Earth is just moving based on gravity of the sun, the sun is moving based on the gravity of the solar system, and the solar system is moving based on the big bang.
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22-Feb-2017 21:12:51 - Last edited on 22-Feb-2017 21:14:42 by Weyburns

Solanumtinkr

Solanumtinkr

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So in short the object would turn up somewhere else, but would depend on a fair few factors as to exactly where? The earth is going about 65k mph the solar system is going about 517k mph and the galaxy 900k mph.

Then you have to factor in space expansion and how local space may behave, if other factors like gravity have an effect?

So if we could "drop anchor" and have it appear where is was in space but 10 mins later is could be a long way away ? :P The purpose of adventure is to shine light into dark places,
Poke monsters with a sharp stick, Then steal anything that isn't nailed down!
To the Manor Born QFC 185-186-367-65788716

22-Feb-2017 21:42:51

Weyburns
Nov Member 2021

Weyburns

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yea, and gravity is stupidly hard to get away from, from what I understand the only solution would be finding a wormwhole that opened up and wrapped around itself into the same area just 10min into the future.

i know this is more off topic, but to just leave earth something needs to travel roughly 25,020 mph, and the only current understanding of pausing time is moving faster than light, and at that point you'd be moving faster than 25k mph anyways if you couldn't find a wormhole as stated above.
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22-Feb-2017 21:53:01

Solanumtinkr

Solanumtinkr

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Well gravity and energy can both warp time, I'd think they are only part of the equation and a small bit at that. For years people said the physics of light sabres was impossible that warp travel was also impossible in any way shape or form and that teleporting would be the equivielant of a nuke in beam form.

Wrinkles have been found for each case. So if people want to travel to the stars then understanding exactly what is going on space wise would probably be a great idea, especially in relation to time. We only have the barest understanding of either. So a wrinkle maybe there as well.

After all we wouldn't be trying to climb out of the gravity well so to speak but to go around it, but it could be that even outside of normal factors that it still has the same effect. But I doubt it is that far reaching, but you'd still need to increase velocity afterwards but at least then you'd have gravity assist to build it up as you "fall back".

IF a bubble can protect a ship at warp like NASA is now considering, then I'd think it is not beyond the realms of possibility. We just lack a deep enough understanding to try an attain it. Still one cannot succeed at something if you never try, and a fair few things have been learned through determination and accidents, as has methodical research.

I'd think at the very least, even if it never works as intended, we might learn more about the nature of what makes the vast majority of the universe what it is. The purpose of adventure is to shine light into dark places,
Poke monsters with a sharp stick, Then steal anything that isn't nailed down!
To the Manor Born QFC 185-186-367-65788716

22-Feb-2017 22:37:47

A13d

A13d

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I'm not a space guy but wouldn't it depend on the circumstances that caused the object to be suspended? If you mean the object is literally not progressing through time then to my understanding it has to be traveling at lightspeed in which case who the hell cares what a 65k mph planet is doing or the rest of the moving stuff in the universe for that matter since its time coordinate is static anyway, or maybe you mean the object is literally bound by some black hole tier gravitational field from your "planet" and literally does not move at all (technically that would be suspended in space, not time) then it would just have the same position relative to that planet's coordinate system 10 minutes later.

But based on your "reappearing" description it sounds like you mean the object is undefined in space-time for a certain 10 minute interval, so yes then you would have to have some funky wormhole stuff going on where gravity or w/e contorts the continuum enough to spit you back out in the same x, y, and z but with t+10min but even then defining some wormhole mapping to some specific coordinates gets weird because even those coordinates themselves are constantly being warped because of the expansion of the universe and a bunch of different forces so you can't really have coordinates that are meaningful to any objective frame of reference, just relative to where in space-time the object was at a different point.

23-Feb-2017 02:23:31

A13d

A13d

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The problem with that is now you have to pick and choose which forces you want to play a role in your new more local frame of reference, like if you wanna just define a coordinate system that moves with the speed of the planet then sure your object will travel with the planet and then you'll have to define forces that cause a wormhole that takes the distance the planet will travel in 10 minutes into consideration before spitting out the object, or maybe now u want to take into consideration the expansion of the universe but not the speed of the planet and u could define some wormhole that meets that criteria and then the object wouldn't even be close to where the planet was 10 minutes ago, you can pick and choose what scenarios you want to do or even just say screw it, I have no clue of all the trillions of things acting on this object at this point in x, y, z, and t but I'm going to define some scenario anyway that encapsulates all of them so that 10 minutes later I'm at "this coordinate" (whatever the hell that means) u and sooner or later u realize that this becomes about as made up and meaningless as everything I just typed

sources: I watched the vsauce black hole video once

23-Feb-2017 02:23:37

HeroicSnorro

HeroicSnorro

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This is an interesting question indeed. The universe itself is roughly spherical and expands outwards, as expected from something originating from a Big Bang event. Now, we can define polar coordinates to pinpoint any location in the universe.

Now here's where things get interesting. If these coordinates are absolute (measured in a certain unit of length. Light years, for example) you would find that your object would appear ten minutes worth of universe expansion closer to the absolute centre of the universe as the object had not experienced the expansion the rest of the universe did. When also factoring in the relative movement of Earth versus the Sun, Sun versus the galactic core and the Milky Way versus the local supercluster you would find that this object has likely travelled an enormous distance.

But what if we were to take relative polar coordinates to describe the suspension in time coordinate in space? This would mean that the radius of the universe sphere will always amount to 1, even if it expands through time. This means that relative lengths will grow as the universe expands (0.1 universe radius will amount to a longer absolute distance 14 billion years into this universe than 0.1 universe radius of when it was just 15 minutes old). If we were then to apply this phenomenon to an object which is put into stasis for ten minutes something really freaky happens: the object will have grown proportional to 10 minutes worth of universal expansion.
Unfortunately Earth does not remain at the same relative polar coordinate with respect to the absolute centre of the universe due to the aforementioned effects, so if you were to pop something into stasis on Earth you will need a proper spaceship to recover your object I think.

A very interesting thought experiment indeed! If I made a mistake in my reasoning somewhere please let me know! Sometimes, less is more.

23-Feb-2017 05:04:30

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