RuneScape Forum Archive | Remove citadel upkeep: 05-Apr

Mar

2010

Ceecs

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First of all you made a simular thread recently. There is no need for duplicates. Let us hope that soon they going to work on some clan related stuff. Ceecs - leader of Ceecs Clan

Rank in Star Find, Harmed Ore, Beach FC | Ex-Rank in Fast SC

Ceecs Clan: DUTCH ONLY RS3 clan & Winner of the Iron Skilled Cup 2015!

21-Aug-2017 09:58:28

Oct

2010

Macka

Posts: 4,318 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Could've just edited your previous thread but anyway..

I wouldn't mind seeing upkeep being removed but I also don't mind if it stays as well. I think the majority of clans would support the removal.

My physique is a product of my mindset

Macka#7877
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Taiwanese Aussie Physique Bodybuilder

21-Aug-2017 12:32:10

Feb

2020

Lord Courage

Posts: 1,023 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

1.
Capping, the idea of removing capping is that you'd don't have to cap, If you've built everything there is to build in citadel it stays built. Lower clans can have an end goal of being a Tier 7 cit, it'd still take a hell of a long time.
2.
Just because it's not been a popular idea in the past doesn't make it a wrong idea.
3.
It's up to each individual clan how they deal with people who don't cap. EoC hit my clan particuarly hard being a RCW clan, when a EoC came and PvP vanished we lost a lot of players. When Old School came it was a second knife in the back.
4.
I know it wasn't a fair comparison, but it was one fundamentally there's few players that play rs3 now than back when clans first came out, and more of them are maxed/maxed level and given the nature of how dead minigames are, are inclined to waste xp less.

If we had stats I'd use them, but we don't have any.
5.
They've already changed upkeep costs previously, so it's something they know and can do which is why I believe it takes a lot less resources than say a rework of any kind.
6.
That is a big reason why I'm campaigning for it, I'd quit the game for a long time and came back to find my citadel not only not tier 6 but delapidated tier 1. Most of my active members who'd been with us for years had quit and joined another clan as no-one wanted to take up being clan leader.
7.
But I'm now F2P and intend to either be F2P or will quit for the foreseeable future, just because it's a problem that's affected me doesn't mean it's just my problem, how many other clan's have fallen from grace and returned to find their citadel in disrepair. Not everyone understands that visiting the citadel can be a bad idea some thought they were helping. Which should be the case shouldn't it?
What's the point in locking a citadel so you never use it because you can't meet the upkeep for it....I thought the purpose was so your clan could gather somewhere....Seems a bit shit to me.

21-Aug-2017 15:22:11

Feb

2020

Lord Courage

Posts: 1,023 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

8.
Let's not forget that the clan leader forums is generally filled with "elitists" I've always felt that it's generally represented well for the overall health of clans because there's basically a lot of stuff that needs to be done. However when it comes to content like this the views come from people are slightly biased to the majority of clans that may not be representing themselves on the clan leader forums.

For example, all of those who have commented on this thread are maxed with over a bil xp and had constant mem since 2011 at least who are premier club.

9
I'm not saying get rid of the visitor requirement.

10
They should be cleared out

11
I can't imagine so either, but I imagine that'll behind a construction rework which will be a while off since they hadn't even started on smithing rework when they were talking about the plans for it. *facepalm*

12
Miscellania, you always make money out of it. Citadel xp doesn't count it's not the main reason you're there for, and it still requires upkeep every week to use those avatars, miscellania doesn't and cmon it takes 2mins to get to 100%

13
You just reiterated my point

21-Aug-2017 15:30:28 - Last edited on 21-Aug-2017 15:46:04 by Lord Courage

Feb

2020

Lord Courage

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1. Sorry forum moderators.
2. Aye

21-Aug-2017 15:47:46

Sep

2011

Ignore List

Posts: 4,879 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

Lord Courage said :
1.Capping, the idea of removing capping is that you'd don't have to cap, If you've built everything there is to build in citadel it stays built. Lower clans can have an end goal of being a Tier 7 cit, it'd still take a hell of a long time.
I agree like I said it sucks to lose something you've worked long and hard for, but isn't that what the dilapidation week is for? I personally can't see them removing it, I would love to see upkeep removed but then in its place some other form of "punishment" would only take it's place. How would you feel if the upkeep for the citadel wasn't the resources but instead 50 visitors a week?

My point here being if we fix it one way and something takes its place we'll be back here complaining about that.

Lord Courage said :
2.Just because it's not been a popular idea in the past doesn't make it a wrong idea.
I never said it's a wrong idea at all. Sometimes in life you'll find you are the lone voice which then people will come to find was right.

My point from a business and as a leaders perspective is to find the root of the problem and what about "upkeep" is the problem? well lets put it simply go into other clan and speak to them and their leaders and you'll see they will agree its upkeep but its mainly about the time to cap in the citadel or the experiece it gives.

Lord Courage said :
3.It's up to each individual clan how they deal with people who don't cap. EoC hit my clan particuarly hard being a RCW clan, when a EoC came and PvP vanished we lost a lot of players. When Old School came it was a second knife in the back.

Believe me like I said I was once there with my clan also and I almost lost my clan and my citadel, but I worked tierlessly in recruiting new members into the clan and encouraging people to visit the citadel at the very least as capping isn't mandatory. Thankfully it worked out for me.
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21-Aug-2017 15:55:23

Sep

2011

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Lord Courage said :
4.I know it wasn't a fair comparison, but it was one fundamentally there's few players that play rs3 now than back when clans first came out, and more of them are maxed/maxed level and given the nature of how dead minigames are, are inclined to waste xp less.

If we had stats I'd use them, but we don't have any.
I agree there are less people compared to back then but it doesn't mean clans and citadels are dead. My clan has a 1500 total level recruitment but believe me should I remove them I could fill 2 clans with 500 people with people of all levels in a week or 2 (who are members) and since they are low level explaining the citadel and showing them that you can get free xp they would be willing to do it.

Lord Courage said :
5.They've already changed upkeep costs previously, so it's something they know and can do which is why I believe it takes a lot less resources than say a rework of any kind.
I didn't say its impossible - don't get me wrong im not opposed to removing upkeep at all, my concern is what would it be replaced with? becuase we'll only come back and complain about how bad the new one is.

Believe me even the small things are a pain in the backside - Recently I asked Mod Moltare about adding a broadcast for when an admin turns the ability for guests to join/talk off - he said himself it may sound like an easy thing but because of the way its coded and interacts its a lot harder to do.
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21-Aug-2017 16:02:45

Sep

2011

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Lord Courage said :
6.That is a big reason why I'm campaigning for it, I'd quit the game for a long time and came back to find my citadel not only not tier 6 but delapidated tier 1. Most of my active members who'd been with us for years had quit and joined another clan as no-one wanted to take up being clan leader.
This comes down to clan structure - One of the main reasons I've seen clans fall from grace is because the owner quits/leaves and the admin structure wasn't in place to guide the clan and take care of the citadel.

This aspect is sad but its what I've seen happen over the last 6+ years. But it isn't due to the upkeep though. - Like I said I do also want to see it removed but I also don't mind if it isn't but the main thing i'm doing here is playing devils advocate to iron out the details so you think about both sides of the argument.

Out of curiosity - Have you spoken to your old members and asked them why they left the clan? I'd be interested in how many say it was because of the citadel and for those who say citadel what specifically about it.

Lord Courage said :
7.But I'm now F2P and intend to either be F2P or will quit for the foreseeable future, just because it's a problem that's affected me doesn't mean it's just my problem, how many other clan's have fallen from grace and returned to find their citadel in disrepair. Not everyone understands that visiting the citadel can be a bad idea some thought they were helping. Which should be the case shouldn't it?
What's the point in locking a citadel so you never use it because you can't meet the upkeep for it....I thought the purpose was so your clan could gather somewhere....Seems a bit shit to me.
The aspect of it being locked sucks yeah I agree, but if the clan is dead then whats the use for a place to meet?
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21-Aug-2017 16:22:09

Sep

2011

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Lord Courage said :
8.Let's not forget that the clan leader forums is generally filled with "elitists" I've always felt that it's generally represented well for the overall health of clans because there's basically a lot of stuff that needs to be done. However when it comes to content like this the views come from people are slightly biased to the majority of clans that may not be representing themselves on the clan leader forums.

For example, all of those who have commented on this thread are maxed with over a bil xp and had constant mem since 2011 at least who are premier club.
I wouldn't go assuming. I own 1 clan and help run 9 others. Believe me I'm well versed in the problems clans experience. My total experience has nothing to do with that, Should I have had 100m total xp but had the same views would you have said the same thing?

A lot of the clan leaders within the forums and outside have played the game for a long time and as per the long time naturally would have gained xp...so you cant use membership or xp as a rebuttal.

In addition those other 9 clans are not in the clan leader forums. Moreover the one thing I have done in the last 6 years of being a clan owner is networking with all kind of clan leaders in and out of the clan leader forums. Have you?

For those leaders I have spoken to who have complained about upkeep with their clan the root cause has been the time it takes to cap or the experience from the plots themselves.

So believe me I'm not just sitting in my own little bubble or above an ivory tower.

Lord Courage said :
9.I'm not saying get rid of the visitor requirement.
I'm not saying you are but would you be happy if it was increased a lot and used to determine how active a clan and or its citadel is?

Feel free to add me in game - or if you're in the clan leader discord to poke me in their and we can have a text/voice chat about this all.
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21-Aug-2017 16:31:01 - Last edited on 21-Aug-2017 18:06:45 by Ignore List

Feb

2020

Lord Courage

Posts: 1,023 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile

I agree there are less people compared to back then but it doesn't mean clans and citadels are dead. My clan has a 1500 total level recruitment but believe me should I remove them I could fill 2 clans with 500 people with people of all levels in a week or 2 (who are members) and since they are low level explaining the citadel and showing them that you can get free xp they would be willing to do it.

How would you go about doing this? I've never managed to recruit more than 50 a day since 2012 with a minority of them being P2P, do you mean you or as a clan?

This is slightly unrelated but I've not trained skills that far because I don't enjoy it, I enjoy the clan aspect and the PvP but i've never grinded I find it boring, people are so focused on xp, what's everyone going to do when everyone has 5bil xp, it's crazy to see how many players have max xp on leaderboards and are no longer p2p, because there's nothing else in the game to keep them going.

I wouldn't mind sitting hours at the citadel if I knew that if my clan has a breakdown all won't be lost like it was before. I'm not an active player and don't plan to be one again like a lot of people who get tired of RuneScape but haven't found anything that fills the void yet. I just want to be able to be able to upgrade a citadel and for it to stay upgraded. Upkeep doesn't need to be replaced by another system, if you're worried about clans having bonus xp due to avatars, use the visitor count for the avatars alone.

Part of the reason my clan's never evolved is because I don't use voice chats (I play everything on mute) and rarely use anything beyond RS to keep in contact with my clanmembers, I want to keep the game as a game. Also I quit for long periods, I'd like to be able to carry on making progress where I left off, and not by locking the citadel if my clan want to use the citadel (I mean as a meeting room not using the plots) then they should be able to do so without the fear that simply by entering

21-Aug-2017 18:48:02

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Remove citadel upkeep: 05-Apr