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Frost Dragon Orbs

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Abby Taylor
Nov Member 2019

Abby Taylor

Posts: 2,206 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
From what I can gather, the original purpose of the damage reflecting orbs was to curb bots.

According to the wiki:
"Initially on release, frost dragons were only capable of using melee and magic. Due to heavy botting, they were eventually given a ranged attack and a reflect ability."


However seeing as they have been in the game for over a decade, and botting has been slowly pushed back by bot nukes, client updates, and the 2012 botwatch program, I think there are some good arguments towards changing how the frost dragon orb works.

Firstly, for some the orb is irrelevant since higher tier gear and weaponry released over the years have enabled some players to burst down dragons so quickly that the orb doesn't even have time to spawn.

It's impossible to predict when the orb will appear, since it's timing is random, this means that you will hit yourself with the first attack when it shows up. and if you qued up an ultimate ability you could actually end up killing yourself instantly.

Frost dragon bones have went from 16,000 gp to over 25,000 gp. And I don't think many players bot them these days.


Suggestions:


Personally I would remove the orb / ranged attack all together. Since it's purpose was to curb BOTS, but it's actually more of a nuisance and problem for normal players.
Regular players have had to come up with strategies to deal with the orb, but if you aren't a bot then it shouldn't have to be something you worry about...

of course I know that removing the orb completely is a bit of a stretch, so I think that a good compromise would be to reduce the unpredictability of it, at the very least preventing players from dying instantly from something they can't counter attack.

I suggest having the dragon light up, just before the orb appears, giving enough time to stop attacking.
~or~
Greatly reducing the reflected damage of the first attack.
200m Woodcutting: 08/08/2021

Completionist: 09/10/2021

28-May-2022 01:44:28

Abby Taylor
Nov Member 2019

Abby Taylor

Posts: 2,206 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Before anybody tells me to just work around it, or get better at the game, or "practice"

I've been training ranged at frost dragons for about a week, and have killed probably multiple thousands of them over the years. 10k+ If I had to guess.

I've probably died about 5 times over the years because of the orb, usually on the FIRST TICK OF ITS DAMAGE, since it's not predictable or blockable.


I would automatically disregard any argument in favor of just getting better on 2 points.

1. You can't get better at predicting
randomized
spawns.

2. Since it's purpose was to combat BOTS it shouldn't be such a huge inconvenience to non-botting players.
The burden of skill should not lay on the innocent party.


A great real life comparison would be to packaging used by stores to reduce shoplifting.
A few years ago, the store I worked with was experiencing a lot of shoplifters who were taking products out of their packaging to avoid setting off the security stickers that were on the packages.

To counter this, the store began using hard, rigid plastics that were difficult to cut through. and next to impossible for a person to open in a store quietly without being noticed by somebody. This effectively reduced shoplifting.

However as a result, many customers complained about the packaging being inconvenient for them. Some even ended up getting cuts and scrapes trying to open the product at home. Which was an unintended consequence of the harder plastic packaging.

Which eventually led the store to consider different options for reducing shoplifting.

Great suggestion by f a k e news:
"Give them a special attack bar just like with ripper demons."
200m Woodcutting: 08/08/2021

Completionist: 09/10/2021

28-May-2022 01:47:01 - Last edited on 28-May-2022 23:12:16 by Abby Taylor

Daddy Roshi
Jan Member 2018

Daddy Roshi

Posts: 3,348 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Draco Burnz said :
Isnt this pretty much like the Living Wyverns cold effect?

So i dont see any reason to remove it. agreed and if u have issues killing them fast enough dont use big hitting abilities halfway through ur kill to not risk killing urself with the reflect
200m defence 08-10-2021


comp cape 12-19-2021

28-May-2022 17:08:14

Abby Taylor
Nov Member 2019

Abby Taylor

Posts: 2,206 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@Roshi

What is "halfway through a kill" exactly?
Since the orb appears at random, my suggestion is to add some predictability to it, so you don't have to just "guess"

You're chastising my skill level, but what I'm promoting is skill in place of luck.

I don't think combat mechanics should continue to be luck based and unpredictable, that's not in line with how other bosses are.
200m Woodcutting: 08/08/2021

Completionist: 09/10/2021

28-May-2022 20:41:57 - Last edited on 28-May-2022 20:43:17 by Abby Taylor

Daddy Roshi
Jan Member 2018

Daddy Roshi

Posts: 3,348 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Abby Taylor said :
You're chastising my skill level, but what I'm promoting is skill in place of luck. how am i "chastising" ur skill level? Once its about half dead dont hit it with big attacks is all im saying im not chastising anything predict when its gonna use its ability hit it hard at first then if u think ur not gonna kill it fast enough step away and wait for the orb just make sure auto retaliate is off so u dont auto attack again if uve killed over 10k like u said u should have a descent feel for when orb is gonna happen even if ur early on ur guess

Ive killed far less of them than u have but even I can guess when orbs gonna happen idk if its actually random or is after a set amount of attacks but it still isnt hard to predict
200m defence 08-10-2021


comp cape 12-19-2021

28-May-2022 22:28:17

Abby Taylor
Nov Member 2019

Abby Taylor

Posts: 2,206 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Daddy Roshi said :
Abby Taylor said :
You're chastising my skill level, but what I'm promoting is skill in place of luck. how am i "chastising" ur skill level? Once its about half dead dont hit it with big attacks is all im saying im not chastising anything predict when its gonna use its ability hit it hard at first then if u think ur not gonna kill it fast enough step away and wait for the orb just make sure auto retaliate is off so u dont auto attack again if uve killed over 10k like u said u should have a descent feel for when orb is gonna happen even if ur early on ur guess

Ive killed far less of them than u have but even I can guess when orbs gonna happen idk if its actually random or is after a set amount of attacks but it still isnt hard to predict

It's totally random. I've actually done tests in legacy, and the orb does not always appear after the same number of attacks.

I'm suggesting some sort of indication or predictability to the orb, not it's removal entirely (although that would be good too if you want my opinion).

Since this orb was made to stop
B O T S

It shouldn't be such an inconvenience to normal players such as myself, requiring not only strategy and timing but also, just being unfair and unpredictable.
200m Woodcutting: 08/08/2021

Completionist: 09/10/2021

28-May-2022 23:08:47 - Last edited on 28-May-2022 23:09:55 by Abby Taylor

Daddy Roshi
Jan Member 2018

Daddy Roshi

Posts: 3,348 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Abby Taylor said :
f a k e news said :
Give them a special attack bar just like with ripper demons.

This is a great suggestion ^_^
I'll add it to my OP. while it is a good idea I dont see how it would work if its random it would have to be set to a specific interval and if that happens like u want whos to stop bots from botting it again? I understand it was made to prevent bots and yes there are less of them around but they still exist regardless so adding a feature to show when it does the orb effect will just allow them to come back and bot them again its just a matter of making a new script to make them stop attacking when the bar is almost full defeats the purpose of the orb entirely
200m defence 08-10-2021


comp cape 12-19-2021

29-May-2022 00:36:24

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