RuneScape Forum Archive | ~~Brotherly Love~~

Reaper Ben

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All over again?

19-Oct-2010 13:42:56

Englishkid62

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Yeah, so it's like a writer gets really depressed when he doesn't seem to get any support or the writing project is just too daunting. And I have just been so depressed.
So, I'm still waiting for these people to complete a read

Charmed
Caydock
2Ol2
Cheeze
Kylebooker
XD
Hopefully I don't have to chase them up on Facebook!
Anyway, these days I'm more absorbed by The Sims 3 and my imaginary husband.
And Ruben, since you're a regular visitor here and I just read your responses to my story again, what did you say your beliefs were, when you said you don't agree with me? I wanna know what sort of hater you are (Joking

), and views and stuff on this kind of thing.

19-Oct-2010 19:43:43

Reaper Ben

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Well, it's complicated

(Isn't it always?) Non of what I am about to say is meant to be harmful to anyone.
I don't believe that people of the same gender should marry each other. I understand that some people blame in it on the fact you can't choose who you love, but I'm not sure I agree with that. Like Caydock said, it's a choice. You might find this weird, but I chose never to love, until I am sure that I want to spend the rest of my life with that person. Until I am sure that she is the one, I choose not to fall in love.
I'm not saying this has been working well for me

But at least, I don't act on my feelings. I choose.
I don't look down on people who do choose same gender love, I just disapprove of what they did. My favorite teacher is like that. I'm sure that he is, but everyone has doubts. Does that stop me for thinking highly of him? No. He is my favorite teacher, no matter what he thinks. He actually disagrees with me on a lot of things, but none the less; I don't let what other people believe stop me from befriending them.
Do I agree with what others believe? No, but I won't take negative action against him/her just because of that. I'm just not that kind of person. I believe in faith, but does that mean I'm angry at them, no. I don't agree with them, nothing else. I'll try to convince them other wise, but further then that, I can do nothing.
So why have negative thoughts about them? There is nothing I can do, except try to convince them other wise, talk. That's all. Even though I don't agree with same gender marriage, and I strongly disagree with it. But that doesn't mean that I hate them. I just disagree. I hope that they will change their ways.
That's what I think raw. Lol, I don't have the time to re-read what I said, cause I got to go. But I hope that non of this offends anyone, if it does, please ask a mod to hide it.
I also hope it reflects what I think well

There you go.

20-Oct-2010 16:24:16

Englishkid62

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That's interesting. You're not the first person here to disagree with same gender marriage nor will you be the last, but here is what I think.
1) What exactly do you mean by, you don't believe they *should* marry each other? You don't believe they should want to, or be allowed to? And why shouldn't they? The society have failed to provide evidence that the reason for marriage is for procreation, nor does it undermine the society's interest, other than the fact that it conflicts with religious views. So the only thing holding the progress of humankind is religion yet again.
2) Some people do say that you can't help who you love. But that is by no means a choice. Even if you consider so, it is no more of a choice than, say, someone chooses to believe in God. A religion is more of a choice in every single way.
3) Now look at religion itself, and for example, I take Christianity. How many souls would have been alive, were it not because of this religion? Millions. I'm talking about crusade, burning of women at the stakes, and other bullying that led to suicides. Think about how many lives they have harmed. Now think about how many lives 'gay' people ever harmed. I haven't got the exact figure, but I can bet that Christians have hurt more people than 'gays' ever did in the history of man.
4) So why should we be more accepting to Christians, than 'gays'? Why should we accept that being a Christian is a better 'choice'? Why should we even let it govern how we perceive other people, and decide what others should and shouldn't do?
5) So, my view is this. For all the damage Christians brought to mankind, they shouldn't even be allowed to disagree with anything. They have no right to hope that others should change and become like them, and they should start atoning for their crimes. I also disapprove that Christians prevent others' rights to be happy in life, and get married. Their choice of being a follower shouldn't be able to control how we want to live our lives.

21-Oct-2010 12:54:37 - Last edited on 21-Oct-2010 13:06:58 by Englishkid62

Englishkid62

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As for The One...what if I tell you that, there is no such thing? What if I tell you that there are only relationships, and some work better than others? What if I tell you that it is all about what you put into the relationship, and how much both partners commit and invest in it?
But, just so you know, if religions are fighting 'gays', either by actively preventing their progress or just 'disagree', do expect retaliation. The default line is indifference, and nobody disagrees with each other, and let each other carry on. Once religion had crossed that line, well, don't start complaining when things don't quite go their way. 'Gays' don't have a reason to hate religion until they cross that line.

21-Oct-2010 12:57:11 - Last edited on 21-Oct-2010 13:02:53 by Englishkid62

Reaper Ben

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1) What exactly do you mean by, you don't believe they *should* marry each other? You don't believe they should want to, or be allowed to? And why shouldn't they? The society have failed to provide evidence that the reason for marriage is for procreation, nor does it undermine the society's interest, other than the fact that it conflicts with religious views. So the only thing holding the progress of humankind is religion yet again.
--
I disagree with you. I can't quite explain why I believe that they should not marry with each other. I guess it just has to do with opinion and moral issues. But as for religion holding society back, I strongly disagree with that. It is not religion that holds society back, it's humanity's mindset. It is religion that allowed for the value of human lives. Before Christianity, humans were often worth less then animals. But now, humans have great worth. Isn't that an progress? Religion does not hold society back, the stubborn humans do.
--
2) Some people do say that you can't help who you love. But that is by no means a choice. Even if you consider so, it is no more of a choice than, say, someone chooses to believe in God. A religion is more of a choice in every single way.
--
? I don't understand what you are meaning to say here, you claim that you can't choose to believe in God, but that religion is a choice?

21-Oct-2010 17:48:29

Reaper Ben

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3) Now look at religion itself, and for example, I take Christianity. How many souls would have been alive, were it not because of this religion? Millions. I'm talking about crusade, burning of women at the stakes, and other bullying that led to suicides. Think about how many lives they have harmed. Now think about how many lives 'gay' people ever harmed. I haven't got the exact figure, but I can bet that Christians have hurt more people than 'gays' ever did in the history of man.
--
Christianity itself did not kill the people, idiots that wished to use people's faith to their advantage did. In the Bible, human lives are valued and it is one of the ten commandments not to kill. People that do kill in the name of Christianity are hypocrites, for lack of a better word.
Think about the crusades, were they really about taking Jerusalem for religious reasons? Never in the Bible does it say that Christians have to take back Jerusalem, the crusades were entirely about the land and riches. The pope needed money, so he called for a religious warfare that he knew would fill his pockets. And the people had no choice but to obey, think about it: They can't read the Bible, so they don't know anything about it. The pope is basically God, and if he excommunicates you, you go to hell and loose all hope. People back then had no choice but to go out and do the pope's biddings.
The pope and his chamber used the people's ignorance to get rich. If they were the only religion allowed, then they get all of the money. So that is why they killed so many people. These murders were not caused by Christianity itself, but self-absorbed religious dudes who wanted to get rich.

21-Oct-2010 17:57:29

Reaper Ben

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4) So why should we be more accepting to Christians, than 'gays'? Why should we accept that being a Christian is a better 'choice'? Why should we even let it govern how we perceive other people, and decide what others should and shouldn't do?
--
Who says we do? The fact that people tend to be more towards Christian views is based on opinion. Nothing says that you have to accept christians more than happy people (The other word was censored), people do so just because they agree with one more than the other.
--
5) So, my view is this. For all the damage Christians brought to mankind, they shouldn't even be allowed to disagree with anything. They have no right to hope that others should change and become like them, and they should start atoning for their crimes. I also disapprove that Christians prevent others' rights to be happy in life, and get married. Their choice of being a follower shouldn't be able to control how we want to live our lives.
--
I think that somehow in your life you had a bad experience with a religious person. Most likely a monastery in which you were forced to live in. I understand, there are those that twist christianity and do with it as they like. But can you really condemn a whole religion because some nut case out there forced it upon others? Can you hate the cook just because someone what had bought his muffins, poisoned them, and gave them to you?
But like I have said before, Christianity is not the cause, humans are. If people did follow what the bible states, then there would no war or crimes. The fact that there is proves, that theses people were not Christians. They were people that used Christianity as an excuse to murder, pillage, and get rich.
Christians don't prevent others' to be happy, society does. Who gets to decide whether same gender marriage is allowed or not? The people do. Not christians. Once again, it's public favor that wins. I'm saying whether they are right or wrong, but it's the masses that decide.

21-Oct-2010 17:59:54 - Last edited on 21-Oct-2010 18:10:40 by Reaper Ben

Reaper Ben

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As for The One...what if I tell you that, there is no such thing? What if I tell you that there are only relationships, and some work better than others? What if I tell you that it is all about what you put into the relationship, and how much both partners commit and invest in it?
But, just so you know, if religions are fighting 'gays', either by actively preventing their progress or just 'disagree', do expect retaliation. The default line is indifference, and nobody disagrees with each other, and let each other carry on. Once religion had crossed that line, well, don't start complaining when things don't quite go their way. 'Gays' don't have a reason to hate religion until they cross that line.
--
If you did tell me that there is no such thing as the one, you would not have convinced me. I believe so, and forever will.
As for the fact that religion has crossed the line, i agree and I apologize for them. I have thought about this before, and the way that religion reacted was wrong. They were scared, and still under the influence of those that twisted the Bible.
Think about it, back in the days, the pope was supreme. If anyone believed differently than he did, they would die. Although, by the time same gender marriage came to be, people still had some leftovers of that mind set. They were afraid of something that they did not understand and reacted violently to it.
It is for that reason that most 'happy' tend dislike religion. Because religion attacked them, they are only defending themselves. But you have to understand this concept: If a cook bakes delicious goods, then gives them out to all for free. Each person receives ten cookies. Some decide to keep them, others to share all of them so that plenty can taste the cookies. But there are these others who purposefully poison the cookies then shares them.
Can you blame the cook for the poisoned cookies? No you can't. It's the same with religion.
I hope that none of the above was offensive.

21-Oct-2010 19:28:13

Englishkid62

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1) I disagree with you. I can't quite explain why I believe that they should not marry with each other. I guess it just has to do with opinion and moral issues. But as for religion holding society back, I strongly disagree with that. It is not religion that holds society back, it's humanity's mindset. It is religion that allowed for the value of human lives. Before Christianity, humans were often worth less then animals. But now, humans have great worth. Isn't that an progress? Religion does not hold society back, the stubborn humans do.
--
As far as I was concerned, when you say they ‘should’ not marry each other, you implied that even if they wanted to, it shouldn’t be allowed or that they should have it in themselves to refrain from doing so because of ‘moral’ issues. It is moral for two consenting adults to marry and have their union recognised by the society. If your moral tells you that is wrong, then the moral itself is wrong, and we should question why we were taught them at all.
And how did the religion not hold the society back? Centuries of arguing that the Earth is flat, that the Earth is the centre of the universe, stem cells projects, that the world is less than 6000 years old, that evolution is a pile of rubbish. And do not presume that before Christianity the world was a worse place, as you have not lived in it. There had been many religions that preached respect and seemed to have a set of ‘moral codes’. And even now, humans do not necessarily have great worth either. I can also argue that religion is a stubbornness of a sort, as with all things faith related – it tells you it is virtuous to believe even when mountains of evidence is pointing to the contrary. That is stubbornness dressed in plastered art.

23-Oct-2010 21:49:13

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