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Guthix's Dark Memories?
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Copying my reddit post here:
Soooo, this is an interesting one.
None of the lore here contradicts previous lore. It expands and adds nuance to it. it adds emotion and depth where previously there was nothing. Reading up on the forum post you linked via twitter, most people seem to have gathered that, but I'll try and explain it a bit.
Let's look at the Seren one, spoilers ahead be warned, and examine it.
You are reading it as a literal step by step account of what happened. You are reading it as a scientific report, rather than the memories of a sorrowful being who's millennia long relationship has ended.
If you've ever been in a relationship that has ended I would ask you to look back on that relationship and think about it. How does it make you feel? You'll notice that you (likely) don't break it down into a step by step literal recounting, but you instead remember key moments that change the overall feel.
You could have been in a truly loving relationship, but the other person had to leave for some reason. So you remember the beautiful times you had together, the moments spent on romantic walks or the meaningful conversations you had beneath the stars. You romanticise it and make it something beautiful. You probably choose to forget the petty arguments about leaving the seat up, or about who's turn it is to do the washing up. Instead it becomes this bright shining moment of love that you can look back on with fond memories.
Your memory though, is not the truth, certainly not the whole truth.
Perhaps you were in a relationship that was really happy, then you discovered that they cheated on you. Suddenly your memories are tainted. You see them as manipulating you, mocking you, betraying you. It hardens your heart and all the good moments are pushed aside until only the betrayal remains.
Memories are as often fiction as they are truth. They're flavoured and coated with emotion and that completely changes it from one person to another. Your ex, for example will have a completely different memory of the relationship and will think back on it differently. But neither one of you is wrong, you merely have different feelings about it.
So, let's go back to Guthix and his memory of Seren.
Did he really never love her?
No, of course he did. He even admits it in the lore entry, but he claims otherwise. Because if he didn't really love her, then he's not a monster for leaving her. Not a monster for letting herself shatter herself into pieces. No, he's just a victim of her power and that's far easier to digest.
Did he love her as much as she loved him? That's the question to ask.
Did he love her as much as he loved his Naragun wife? That's the question to ask.
Would their love have been enough to save him? Would their love have been enough to change him?
When creating characters in RuneScape we try to make believable relate-able characters. We will add nuance and emotion to them because that's what makes people interesting. Sure he was a big powerful deity who was strong enough to banish all the other gods... but he was flawed and he was lonely and he was filled with grief and love and regret and... etc.
You may not like the revelation that their love wasn't absolutely perfect. But few people do appreciate discovering that love, like everything else, is complicated and flawed.
So, in clarification, no this doesn't contradict any established canon. It enhances, flavours and builds on it. Remember the source. Remember the god and remember all the things he had to deal with. The weight of responsibility for an entire world and the guilt for letting someone he loved suffer and remember that these are his thoughts, his words and, as difficult as it might be to believe, Guthix wasn't infallible.
So you're right to question the lore, that's why we wrote it. We wanted to build discussion and questions about the subject. But I would ask that you don't immediately jump to "lorefail" when there's a discussion to be had instead.
Soooo, this is an interesting one.
None of the lore here contradicts previous lore. It expands and adds nuance to it. it adds emotion and depth where previously there was nothing. Reading up on the forum post you linked via twitter, most people seem to have gathered that, but I'll try and explain it a bit.
Let's look at the Seren one, spoilers ahead be warned, and examine it.
You are reading it as a literal step by step account of what happened. You are reading it as a scientific report, rather than the memories of a sorrowful being who's millennia long relationship has ended.
If you've ever been in a relationship that has ended I would ask you to look back on that relationship and think about it. How does it make you feel? You'll notice that you (likely) don't break it down into a step by step literal recounting, but you instead remember key moments that change the overall feel.
You could have been in a truly loving relationship, but the other person had to leave for some reason. So you remember the beautiful times you had together, the moments spent on romantic walks or the meaningful conversations you had beneath the stars. You romanticise it and make it something beautiful. You probably choose to forget the petty arguments about leaving the seat up, or about who's turn it is to do the washing up. Instead it becomes this bright shining moment of love that you can look back on with fond memories.
Your memory though, is not the truth, certainly not the whole truth.
Perhaps you were in a relationship that was really happy, then you discovered that they cheated on you. Suddenly your memories are tainted. You see them as manipulating you, mocking you, betraying you. It hardens your heart and all the good moments are pushed aside until only the betrayal remains.
Memories are as often fiction as they are truth. They're flavoured and coated with emotion and that completely changes it from one person to another. Your ex, for example will have a completely different memory of the relationship and will think back on it differently. But neither one of you is wrong, you merely have different feelings about it.
So, let's go back to Guthix and his memory of Seren.
Did he really never love her?
No, of course he did. He even admits it in the lore entry, but he claims otherwise. Because if he didn't really love her, then he's not a monster for leaving her. Not a monster for letting herself shatter herself into pieces. No, he's just a victim of her power and that's far easier to digest.
Did he love her as much as she loved him? That's the question to ask.
Did he love her as much as he loved his Naragun wife? That's the question to ask.
Would their love have been enough to save him? Would their love have been enough to change him?
When creating characters in RuneScape we try to make believable relate-able characters. We will add nuance and emotion to them because that's what makes people interesting. Sure he was a big powerful deity who was strong enough to banish all the other gods... but he was flawed and he was lonely and he was filled with grief and love and regret and... etc.
You may not like the revelation that their love wasn't absolutely perfect. But few people do appreciate discovering that love, like everything else, is complicated and flawed.
So, in clarification, no this doesn't contradict any established canon. It enhances, flavours and builds on it. Remember the source. Remember the god and remember all the things he had to deal with. The weight of responsibility for an entire world and the guilt for letting someone he loved suffer and remember that these are his thoughts, his words and, as difficult as it might be to believe, Guthix wasn't infallible.
So you're right to question the lore, that's why we wrote it. We wanted to build discussion and questions about the subject. But I would ask that you don't immediately jump to "lorefail" when there's a discussion to be had instead.
12-Jun-2018 09:02:32
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