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Blasty
Feb Member 2017

Blasty

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Thanks for your reply, Solanumtinkr :)

Solanumtinkr said :
The situation you are describing is called a Post Scarcity Society , though such situations never tend to last, not historically any way. The current system is based in perpetual growth in order to sustain itself, the 90's saw the introduction of the IT revolution (You've all heard of companies like Google!) that stopped the economies from hitting a wall back then, as massive growth in those sectors pulled out fat out of the fire. At present there is nothing to take its place, maybe it'll sort itself out, maybe not but some resources are threatening to run out and that is going to create problems of its own. That is except maybe a big push into space, mad as it sounds a big push in that direction may serve to solve some problems in the long term.


Ooh, I hadn't really thought about it this way before - that post scarcity can be considered something that comes and goes as society's demands and ability to create fluctuate. I think this is an interesting way to put it, as it raises a question about what the eventual limits might be. Space exploration might provide more resources, but what's going to be next, and after that? How will society's resource demands change over time, and will those changes correlate with new ways of producing? In a state of essentially unlimited ability to produce, would society's demands also become equally as unlimited?

Lots of interesting questions :p
Blasty
// @BlastytheBlue // Blasty#5167
| Co-owner of Mine Nation

03-May-2017 04:17:03 - Last edited on 04-May-2017 05:16:07 by Blasty

Blasty
Feb Member 2017

Blasty

Posts: 9,319 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Solanumtinkr said :
Creating the world you are talking about would require a big shift in thinking and how we live. Automation is going to keep being cheaper than people doing certain jobs and they will only keep getting better at it. People used to say that horses would never be replaced by the industrial revolution, they would always be needed, Yes, as burgers and ridding for fun, but not in the same numbers, Not a fate I'd enjoy personally, I don't know about you :P . So it would require a big shift as that takes hold and we'd have to make sure it's as disaster proof as we can. Humans should be left to do what they do best, have some fun, and explore everywhere. On Earth there is just very few places left to truly explore.


Haha, I don't think I'd enjoy the fate of becoming a burger and being ridden for fun either ;P

I do like the sound of having fun and exploring though :)

I had a conversation about the limits of exploration with someone recently, and something we discussed was that even if there might be a limit to what you can meaningfully explore about the earth itself, the limits of exploration are much deeper when you also consider the depth of information in research. People currently dedicate their entire lives to fields of research to make a chip into that depth, and the amount of depth is so great that no one truly knows all fields at their full depth.

If you look at it in that way, it kinda seems like there's a possibility that there is no limit to exploration :O
Blasty
// @BlastytheBlue // Blasty#5167
| Co-owner of Mine Nation

03-May-2017 04:32:36

Blasty
Feb Member 2017

Blasty

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Solanumtinkr said :
Even if you could snap you fingers to go to every solar system in the galaxy, one for ever snap, it would still take 250m years or so to visit them all, that might keep us busy for a while lol. And that would only be amongst many. We just have to make sure these tools being conceived of and made are there to support us rather than outright replace.


That's a really good point, and I don't think it's something that people consider much when they think about space travel - the distances are so monumental that, based on our current understanding, even relatively close celestial object comes with huge communication delays that are physically impossible to reduce.

Another way to look at it is that even if you had a family member on a planet 4 light years away, you would have to wait 8 years before you could even know they received your message, let alone what their response is to it.

On the topic of building tools to support us rather than replace us, it looks like Elon Musk is on currently working on that :p
https://www.recode.net/2017/3/27/15079226/elon-musk-computers-technology-brain-ai-artificial-intelligence-neural-lace

Solanumtinkr said :
Am I the only one envisioning ratings being a driving force in such an "unlimited resourse" economy?


Haha, this thought reminds me of an episode of Black Mirror called Nosedive. I think the answer to that depends on how the rating system is implemented - you could say that your brain is a system that internally rates what your next action should be, or that a presidential election is a crowd-sourced rating system for who would make a good president :p

Thanks again for your reply, I enjoyed reading and responding :)
Blasty
// @BlastytheBlue // Blasty#5167
| Co-owner of Mine Nation

03-May-2017 04:44:14 - Last edited on 03-May-2017 04:56:23 by Blasty

HeroicSnorro

HeroicSnorro

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I was about to mention how one might be able to transfer information at superluminal speeds with help of a phenomenon called 'Quantum Entanglement'. However, I decided to read up on it a bit more, and unfortunately you cannot transfer info through it. The following Wikipedia article was quite interesting:

No communication theorem
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No-communication_theorem

Unfortunate, but I suppose we'll have to find some other way to try it.

-=HeroicSnorro=-
Sometimes, less is more.

04-May-2017 01:18:07

Solanumtinkr

Solanumtinkr

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HeroicSnorro said :
I was about to mention how one might be able to transfer information at superluminal speeds with help of a phenomenon called 'Quantum Entanglement'. However, I decided to read up on it a bit more, and unfortunately you cannot transfer info through it. The following Wikipedia article was quite interesting:

No communication theorem
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No-communication_theorem

Unfortunate, but I suppose we'll have to find some other way to try it.

-=HeroicSnorro=-
People like having stuff. They really like going fast, really, really fast..but they love faster than ever communications more, it's almost an obsession. By hook or by crook, if there is any wrinkle or reasonable major manipulation for FLT communications, we'll find it...even if we have to keep looking. Something is only impossible until we find out we were wrong, which is business as usual :P
The purpose of adventure is to shine light into dark places,
Poke monsters with a sharp stick, Then steal anything that isn't nailed down!
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12-May-2017 18:26:57 - Last edited on 12-May-2017 18:27:45 by Solanumtinkr

HeroicSnorro

HeroicSnorro

Posts: 2,081 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Solanumtinkr said :
HeroicSnorro said :
I was about to mention how one might be able to transfer information at superluminal speeds with help of a phenomenon called 'Quantum Entanglement'. However, I decided to read up on it a bit more, and unfortunately you cannot transfer info through it. The following Wikipedia article was quite interesting:

No communication theorem
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No-communication_theorem

Unfortunate, but I suppose we'll have to find some other way to try it.

-=HeroicSnorro=-
People like having stuff. They really like going fast, really, really fast..but they love faster than ever communications more, it's almost an obsession. By hook or by crook, if there is any wrinkle or reasonable major manipulation for FLT communications, we'll find it...even if we have to keep looking. Something is only impossible until we find out we were wrong, which is business as usual :P


Exactly. If you would've told someone from the Middle Ages that people would be travelling the globe by airplane, communicating with others around the world nearly instantaneously and that we actually turned the tables around on a disease and killed it ourselves they would've called us mad, crazy and practicers of dark magicks.

Yet 600 years later and here we are. Who knows how far technology will have progressed even within the next hundred years. I seriously hope that some lifespan enhancing stuff will come along too, because the idea that I will not (currently) live to see all those wondrous things happen makes me a bit sad.

Here's to hoping!
Sometimes, less is more.

14-May-2017 03:36:02 - Last edited on 14-May-2017 03:36:28 by HeroicSnorro

Blasty
Feb Member 2017

Blasty

Posts: 9,319 Rune Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Hi all, hope you're doing well :)

Kurzgesagt recently published a video about trends in automation, and why current trends in automation are different to past trends in automation.

It features a couple interesting examples of how automation has affected economic productivity, standards of living, and population.

The video is pretty nicely animated, and introduces some interesting perspectives on what changes we might see in the world if the trend of automation continues to increase.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSKi8HfcxEk

Here's another video by CGP Grey on a similar topic that's also well done and interesting to watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Pq-S557XQU
Blasty
// @BlastytheBlue // Blasty#5167
| Co-owner of Mine Nation

12-Jun-2017 15:57:48

Weyburns
Nov Member 2021

Weyburns

Posts: 4,823 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Blasty said :
Hi all, hope you're doing well :)

Kurzgesagt recently published a video about trends in automation, and why current trends in automation are different to past trends in automation.

It features a couple interesting examples of how automation has affected economic productivity, standards of living, and population.

The video is pretty nicely animated, and introduces some interesting perspectives on what changes we might see in the world if the trend of automation continues to increase.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSKi8HfcxEk

Here's another video by CGP Grey on a similar topic that's also well done and interesting to watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Pq-S557XQU


didn't see the kurz video in my feed, stupid youtube, i'll watch it later for sure

the Kurz video was meh, they try to make it look like automation will be doomsday. There will be way more jobs out there that humans will do because humans prefer humans than he thinks. Flipping burgers, sure that could be an easy analogy, but won't most humans prefer their burgers and shit to be cooked by a real human? The only real benefit i could see from this is McDonald's where price is their main point, but real restaurants that want to give real good tastes? unlikely.

Look at call centres, no one wants to talk to robots, robots can't be persuaded or anything. Look at sales positions, etc.

even if he's completely right, society will shift to something different, like in Wall-e, where working isn't our primary focus, but enjoying life becomes our primary focus.
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12-Jun-2017 17:24:47 - Last edited on 12-Jun-2017 18:55:53 by Weyburns

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