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Wilderness and Free Trade Vote Thread is locked

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Mystic Monad
May Member 2005

Mystic Monad

Posts: 12,305 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Anima Hanky,
I do agree with Phthartic on one issue that is not a matter of opinion--as contained in this Jagex rule, which is spelled out further in the rule itself:
"You may create more than one account, but if you do, you may not log in more than one account at any time, and they must not interact with each other in any way. This includes 'drop trading' or any other method of item transfer."
Transferring money or items from one of your own accounts to another of your own accounts is against Jagex rules no matter how you accomplish it--by drop trading, trading through a friend, or any other method.
You can get your accounts banned for doing so.
Don't do it!

21-Jan-2011 09:53:14

Mystic Monad
May Member 2005

Mystic Monad

Posts: 12,305 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
About Jagex bringing back free trade and the old wildy just to make money:
Even if that is true, so what?
Companies make money by satisfying their customers. That's how free market economies work. And we still do have enough of a free market economy left in this world that the incentives for companies to serve their customers are still generally in place.
Personally, I think Jagex is bringing back free trade and the wildy both because the majority of players want them to *and* because it will be better for their company economically.
And I have no problem with either reason.
Obviously Jagex serving its customers--the players--well is a good thing. I don't think anyone would argue with that.
But Jagex making more money on the game is *also* a good thing for all the players. More income means the ability to hire more employees who will put more work into making the game even better.
The idea that profits = bad is socialist nonsense.
Yes, Jagex knew very well that a large majority of players wanted free trade and the old wildy back.
The poll proved this for all but a few die-hard conspiracy theorists.
Having demonstrated that most players actually *do* want to bring back free trade and the old wildy, Jagex is now proceeding to do just that.
No conspiracy theory is required to understand what's taking place here.
It's a simple matter of Jagex simultaneously giving most players what they want and improving their company's bottom line.
I simply don't see anything wrong with that.

21-Jan-2011 10:07:57 - Last edited on 21-Jan-2011 10:09:13 by Mystic Monad

dunforgiven

dunforgiven

Posts: 102,158 Ruby Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Anima Hanky

20-Jan-2011 23:55:46
...Well, let's get that sorted out first....
do you understand what the word "mainly" means. it doesnt mean "EVERYONE SINGLE ONE IS". it means the majority are. ye, im sure that out of a million and a quarter,there were a few adults that voted that way, and im sure there were a few skillers that voted that way, and im sure tere were a few one account users that voted stictly on the one account, but all of these are in the majority.
on the other side, yes, there are some mature teens that skill, and voted no. there is even a possibility that a few pkers voted no.
...but drop trading is the way around it. It's not unfair, it's not cheating. ...
drop trading to your second account both vialates the rule concerning account interaction, and is unfair to the players that have to earn the money on low level accounts. it is both unfair and cheating. this isnt an opinion its a fact stated by jagex.
since you dont know the rules. here is it in plain black and white.
____________________________________________________
"4. Can I give items to another player from one of my accounts, so that they can then give the items to another character that I play?
No, this goes against the rule. You may not transfer items between your accounts in any way"
Location: Home > Customer Support > Rules of RuneScape > Multiple logging-in
______________________________
when you learn why its unfair for your low level account to have money it didnt earn when facing another account that has no one to earn money for it, then ill stop treating you like the child you are. all you can see is how unfair it is for you to be able to earn it, and not use it on the account you want. thats is a childs view: "me only" children only see unfairness when it is against them. when they have the advantage, they cant see how its unfair to the other person.
THAT is the attitude most players wanting pking back have shown.
frankly my dear, I couldn't give a dam. never had a river to build one on.
veteran of 4 runescapes

21-Jan-2011 10:47:14 - Last edited on 21-Jan-2011 13:00:08 by dunforgiven

[#LHG9INIEP]

[#LHG9INIEP]

Posts: 169 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
agent did I just see what I thought I saw when you posted just there. your saying hes thinking ONLY about himself yet the only argument you managed to come up with to counter the wilderness and free trade was that "it will effect YOUR runecrafting" agent you are a hypocrite. Try looking at what you posted several hundred pages ago, then come back and say that to him again.I see the point that your making, but to say it as you have is as childish as it gets.

21-Jan-2011 14:48:47

dunforgiven

dunforgiven

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zer0skillzX

21-Jan-2011 14:48:47
...your saying hes thinking ONLY about himself ...
im saying that he is basing his definition of fairness on what is good for him, not the other person.
as for as rc and the wild goes, yes, i am thinking of me AND OTHER RUNECRAFTERS. im not the only runecrafter around. the thing is, i have no problem with the wild returning, as long as they take rc out of the wild. that is not hypocrital, because the reason people like you want the wild there is so you can have easy pking. that isnt what the wild is about. it was never suppose to be what the wild is about, yet you insist that it has to be that way. im not the one being hypocritial.
you want to know what hypocritial is, think of this. you have all these people insisting the wild be dangerous, yet they insist on having safe pking. that should be a contradictory phrase. instead, people like you see it as normal.
the risk should be no greater than the reward, but there is no reward in rcing worth the risk of facing death dots. it should also be no less, yet the abyss pkers face no risk, yet get huge gains.
that is not the way the game should be. that is not an adult view. that IS a hypocritical view, i e, the wild should be a dangerous place for anyone except a pker.
frankly my dear, I couldn't give a dam. never had a river to build one on.
veteran of 4 runescapes

21-Jan-2011 17:55:36 - Last edited on 21-Jan-2011 17:59:59 by dunforgiven

Phthartic

Phthartic

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At last! We have a supporter back who I disagree with on the large issues, but that I can agree with practically everything he said!
I never bothered to do the math to determine what the ratio of the two multivote cheating rates would have to be to make "yes" lose in a fair vote, but it sounds like Mystic did anyway. I'll stipulate to 13 or 14 to one. Which is exactly why I've said what I have about there probably being a majority in favor.
But don't forget there were more biases in the polls than just multivoting. And that while the idea of every "yes" voter voting 13 times sounds and is ludicrous on the face of it, a dedicated core of the two groups that would profit most from the proposal winning (PKers and Botters) would be capable of much higher rates to offset the more "normally active" voting supporters.
It sounds like you've actually considered the evidence on the thread, but aren't willing to agree that there are personality differences between the two camps that would lead one to expect more cheating from one side than the other even without actual admissions of cheating on the thread, but that's fine. As I say, it never was important to the final result.
"Yes, Jagex knew very well that a large majority of players wanted free trade and the old wildy back."
Come on! You're still going to stick to that? Again, that being the case, why design the votes so different than a normal poll? Just because it's a big change to the game doesn't require all those machinations. Just do a regular quick poll like every other one, advertise it heavily, get your "large majority" to agree with you and be done with it.
As far as them making money I have no disagreement beyond what I have recently said about my personal inability to intentionally make money from cheaters or by corporate dishonesty.
@ Agent--
You're right to observe the hypocrisy of the PKers. I particularly enjoy when they say they want a dangerous wildy, but no Revenants in the restored old wildy....

21-Jan-2011 18:29:21 - Last edited on 21-Jan-2011 18:30:54 by Phthartic

Sc Jw
Jun Member 2019

Sc Jw

Posts: 1,643 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
@Phthartic
"You're right to observe the hypocrisy of the PKers. I particularly enjoy when they say they want a dangerous wildy, but no Revenants in the restored old wildy...."
That had me laughing in real life. Yeah, I think the revs should stay, no reason to move 'em. Maybe not interrupt player vs player combat, but stay none the less.
After all, the wildy should be dangerous to everybody, not just clue scroll hunters and abyss runners.

21-Jan-2011 18:41:41

[#A04LMSI5H]

[#A04LMSI5H]

Posts: 198 Iron Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Hmm, Wildy is not very much dangerous now, I think bringing back the old wildy is fine, but they should make the rev count *2-x3 (even x4)times as the current, to balance the PK clans, so Pk clans should be aware of rev too.
A clan of Pks getting attacked by half a dozen of revenant knights would be awesome.
As for free trading..*** will get spammed by RWT.
Enough said.

21-Jan-2011 18:53:02

Mystic Monad
May Member 2005

Mystic Monad

Posts: 12,305 Opal Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Agent B MiB,
Unfortunately for your arguments about removing rc (really, the entrance to the abyss) from the wildy, Jagex *intentionally* put it there during the days of the old wildy because the speed of abyss rcing was *supposed* to be offset by the danger of being pked. That was the trade-off, and Jagex was quite explicit about it at the time.
To now say that the entrance to the abyss should be removed from the wildy is to go against the very reason Jagex put it there in the first place.
Listen up, everyone: I'm not a pker. I have no interest in pking. RC was my second 99. I love rcing (in the old way). And I think that the entrance to the abyss should stay in the wildy just where it always was. It balances the risks with the rewards.
RC pkers get huge gains?
I don't think so. At most they get a glory, a pile of * *** worth a piddling amount that won't fit into their invy anyway, and maybe if they're lucky some black dhide. Not exactly fat city! RC pking is near the bottom of the barrel for pking rewards.
Conversely, abyss rcers really don't lose that much when they die. The biggest nuisance is losing your pouches. But if you're smart about it and pre-plan, you can often retrieve them after dying to a pker. And now you can actually buy the two largest pouches at GOP anyway.
And no risk for the pkers?
Not if the ess runners have anything like the gumption that the ones I used to hire at the nat altar did. We’d hear reports of a pker, hear the pker's level reported, and quite often one of the runners would say, "Okay, I'm getting rid of that pker." Next thing you know, the pker was dead and the runner was gloating about the loot and we were all having a good laugh--that is, if the pker didn't log.
And then we went on with our rcing. ^_^

21-Jan-2011 19:03:34

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