RuneScape Forum Archive | Azzanadra's Byzantium?

Dan-i-el

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This thread was made to discuss the 'What if' scenario where Zamorak's rebellion never happened and Zaros successfully passed the empire on to his left and right hand men, Azzanadra and Zamorak.

So, it's no mystery that much of the Zarosian empire had major Roman influences in it's design and function.
It's also known that Zaros had intended to give his most trusted commanders each a half of his empire.

So if we assume the Zarosian empire would've stuck with Roman inspiration, would this have caused a split similar to East and West Rome?

Would Zamorak have become like an angrier Charlemaigne and made an Unholy Zarosian empire?

Would Azzanadra have stayed devout and true to Zarosian ways and rule in his own equivalent of Byzantium? Azzanadrium?

What wars or schisms do you think this would've resulted in? Do you think if this had happened, that either would possibly still be standing in the present?

05-Oct-2020 00:12:16

Deltaslug

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First off, we're going to have to make a number of other things clear, no Zamorak rebellion means:
- Zamorak doesn't become a god (at least not at that time)
- there is no Avernic rebellion (at least not at that time) thus the Cthonians stay in power (for a while longer)
- there is no "God Wars" at that time

Next, empires can have a tendency to turn on itself once the outside enemies are all defeated.
At this point, the Zarosian empire was dominant but they were not the victors.
- The desert pantheon was still in play but weakened
- Saradomin was resisting
- Seren was still far to the west
- the followers of Bandos, V, and Armadyl were present

Zaros stepping down meant that he would be confident in his followers ability to win without him. Though this was his intent from the start due to his ability to affect the minds of his followers (no differently than Seren's at a meta level).

Until the majority of the Saradominist regions were conquered (or at least victory was certain .. give or take a few decades) and the Desert region, Armadylians, and Bandosians were brought to heel ... really leaving only Seren and her elves as the only 'threat', the Zarosian empire would endure.

The first immediate effect of this prolonged war would be that more Mahjarrat would die.
Remember that they still do the Ritual every 500 years. So deduct 1-2 Mahjarrat from the 100 survivors until the end of the war to unify Gielinor.
Other Mahjarrat would lose their lives in combat. It would be difficult to predict how many.
Expect 1 to 2 more to die due to their own internal rivalries.
So we'd also have to assume that Zamorak, a front line type general, would also survive what is to come. Afterall, you still have literal gods in Bandos, Armadyl, and Saradomin. A victory by Zammy against 1 of them is not assured.

05-Oct-2020 03:17:05

Deltaslug

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Another side effect is that you'd get more of a galvanization of the followers of Zaros.
Remember that when everything is going great, you tend keep everyone in line. Everyone is happy that they are winning.

So we can assume that in the end, the Zarosian Empire becomes the main power.
The wars in the desert and Hallowvale come to some sort of conclusion and many of the factions either leave the world or become followers of Zaros. Some peacefully or thru negotiation before the end. Others via subjugation.
You likely end up with a non-agression between Seren's enclave and the Zarosian empire.
The only remaining 'threat' for the time being would be the followers of Bandos who just keep raiding and being a nuisance.

Thus this time lines version of the ''God Wars' comes to an end.

Then the problems start.

Zamorak had been a believer of strength thru chaos. The Mahjarrat were born and raised in the hostile environment. They had survived there, they survived here.
But a few decades of this 'peace' and 'decadence' starts to make the Mahjarrat soft. Especially since there are few left to fight and going offworld to try to conquer say Abbinah and Hallow are not in the plans and likely to resource intensive (at this time) to attempt.

Some Mahjarrat like Lucien and Zemoreguel do things that would border on going against Zaros' laws. Sliske would get bored. Some Mahjarrat would wish for another opportunity for glory.
Others though would take to the 'civilized' life too well.
Others ... would still follow Zaros to the end.

Decades would pass, Zamorak would bide his time. Things would play out much like they did in our current time line.
Different names.
Different elder artifacts.
But the same result.
A semi-empowered/god adjacent Zamorak would cause an uprising.
Unlike last time, Zaros would not be there to be struck down.

Azzandra would lead the loyalists. Zamorak would lead the rebels.

05-Oct-2020 03:17:11 - Last edited on 05-Oct-2020 03:27:18 by Deltaslug

Deltaslug

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Much like the Roman Civil Wars, it would be devastating.
Client states (ie: Saradominist, Desert Pantheon) and mercenaries (Bandosians) would be dragged into.
Saradomin and others would take the opportunity for revenge for having been ousted from the prized world.

But during all of this, there would be no Zaros.

Who would win? Hard to tell. Most likely whoever had more support. By this point Zaros wouldn't care. He had other projects in mind now.
Whomever won would now lead the tattered empire into a new definition of Order or Chaos.

There would be no burning of Forinthy.
There would be no awakening of Guthix.
The Mahjarrat would be depleted much as they are now, but whichever side won, the handful that were left would be the defacto rulers and administrators of the world. Just losing one of their kind every 500 years (or simply using the prisoners of the losing faction for the Ritual ... much like how Azzandra was imprisoned for a long time ... )
Though they would probably carve up their territory with each Mahjarrat ruling over their own fiefdom, being unified in name only.

It would only likely be until something external came along like Tuska or some second attempt at an invasion by a god like Saradomin or the Queen of Ashes or Xau-Tak would a true problem arise for the empire.
Then, you would have the Dragonkin.

Not that any of this mattered. Unless Zaros found a way to ascend ... or deal with the Elder Gods ... or deal with Mah ... the world of Gielinor would be at risk. The empire lost. Assuming Zaros cared in this time line, since he would not have suffered the concept of betrayal by Zamorak.

05-Oct-2020 03:30:33 - Last edited on 05-Oct-2020 03:37:12 by Deltaslug

Dan-i-el

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I believe that with half an empire in his hands, Zamorak would end up with the desire to become a God anyway, chasing the staff and stone, differently to the real time line, but with the same end result, minus killing Zaros.
Zamorakianism would then replace the state religion in the Western, now Zamorakian, empire.

Now, whilst Zaros may have handed his empire to his followers, that didn't mean he doesn't care, rather, he's just too busy. Plus, his whole ideology is progression and potential, allowing others to grow their potential is his thing, so he'd still very much be interested in safeguarding the still-Zarosian East Empire (or however it would've split, maybe north/south would make more sense).
This could then potentially provoke a second god war, assuming they previously defeated most other factions. Zaros would not be emperor, but would still be chief deity of the Zarosian pantheon (which would likely end up including Azzanadra, assuming he scrambles to match Zamorak in a cold War of sorts?)

So then we end up in a god war between God-emperor Zamorak and Zaros+Azzanadra, albeit Zaros only having time to intervene when absolutely necessary, this would at least be enough deterrent to stop Zamorak just outright killing Azzanadra before he could acquire any level of God-hood himself.

Overtime, I believe the Zamorakian empire would end up on the retreat, up into Forinthry, which we'll assume would be Zamorak's imperial throne, as the Zarosian loyalists still ultimately have superior magics, prayers and strategies, as well as constant innovation to give them that extra edge and unlike the real timeline, despite being halved, they'd still have plenty of manpower and an organised leadership and guidance from Zaros still.

05-Oct-2020 10:20:37

Dan-i-el

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Fast forward a few years, Zamorak's empire is now on the backfoot, Azzanadra having managed to reclaim and reunify most of the empire, through great effort.

Azzanadra and Zamorak would end up fighting over the Stone of Jas up in Forinthry, Zamorak blowing up Forinthry in a last ditch attempt to get revenge on the loyalists, creating the wilderness, under different events, but same result.

Afterwards, we'd assume a battered, but surviving Loyalist empire stands with the surviving Zamorakians going into hiding, maybe some of the Mahjarrat claiming independent fiefdoms in further reaches of the continent at best, and some Zamorakians cults here and there.

With most threat removed, Zaros would go off and do his research, leaving the Zarosians to rebuild. I think however, eventually, Mah would reawake at some point anyway, becoming so weak that she starts drawing her power back just like in CoM.
This then prompts a set of events similar to CoM to occur, we'll assume with success since either Seren or Zaros would have to kill Mah as she slipped in and out of her nightmares in a severely weakened state.

Realising the threat of the Elders, this would prompt Zaros and the empire to start seeking a solution to the elder Gods anyway. If Guthix was able to know of Dark Anima, then Zaros either already does, or would be able to discover it and maybe even lead Zarosian expeditions to establish research colonies on Anachronia... Anaechronia? (whatever it's called).

I've not taken into account Sliske yet because with less Gods around, I'd need to think more about what he could get up to.

05-Oct-2020 10:33:33

May

2014

Baby ash

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I believe Azzanadra is genuine to Zaros. I don't think he needs to follow Zaros

I honestly believe he is a god and he just doesn't know it. Azzanadra is quoted in lore as being so powerful he can destroy armies and he did destroy the Mesoratt thinking they killed his brother.

He was the only one so powerful to create a magical barricade to protect his kin from Tumeken

Every god attained godhood in 1 of two ways:

1) KILLING ANOTHER
2) EXPOSURE

Azzanadra I totally believe is in possession of an Elder Artefact. The core of everything he believes, the source of all Zarosian religion. The elements of Fumus, Umbra, Curor and Glacies.. Smoke, shadow, blood and ice.

In the wiki of the elder artefacts, Mod Osbourne said that one artefact was in the Khardian Desert... It's still in the Khardian Desert. What did Azzanadra grant you access to in Desert Treasure?

Ancient Magicks Spellbook. The Spellbook itself is still in the pyramid.

Could that not be the CODEX artefact? could there be 2? One in the desert and lunar spellbook in priffidnas.. Seren is already a goddess. It wouldn't affect her. The codices of light and dark anima older than the current cycle of elder gods... Left on freneskae and taken to gielinor by Seren and Zaros.

OR... The elder twelve speaks of 1 codex, the compatible codex. Jas refers to shadow anima as toxic. She wants nothing to do with it. Therefore will have left the Ancients Codex on Frenesake, she may have created Gielinor with the magic of the light codex, discovered by guthix and found by the moonclan and Seren. The book itself sitting in Cadarn Priffdinas now.

Wiki suggests the old cycles had artefacts, there are prototypes and possible more than the elder 12.. Is the measure on Freneskae the measure she mentions? could there be newer and like wise is Ancients Spellbook the prototype for the Lunar Spellbook

With the ancients spellbook entrusted to Azzanadra as Zaros knew his genuine affiliation to him. He attained power from having it

17-Oct-2020 00:27:44 - Last edited on 17-Oct-2020 09:15:01 by Baby ash

Dan-i-el

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I'm afraid the ancient spellbook isn't anything special, it's simply a mass produced book of spells, or rather, was, that over 4000 years has become a rare find in the 6th age, especially after the Zarosian extermination.

Nowadays, only ancient Zamorakians, ancient Zarosians, the player and a rare few lucky adventurers have access to one such spellbook, although with Soran slowly rebuilding a Zarosian following, it may yet return to a more common practice amongst wizards.
The spellbook itself however is nothing divine, it's simply an amalgamation of spells developed by humans, Mahjarrat, Demons and Vampyres in Senntisten, using the advanced elements taught by Zaros via, presumably, the Pontiffs, which acted as tutors, magical researchers and philosophers alongside religious duties. In that regard, it was written the same way as the ordinary spellbook, through research, trial and error, not by an elder God.

Azzanadra is not yet a God, but as stated in CoM, he is close. He is still technically an ordinary Mahjarrat as of now, but perhaps strong enough to go toe to toe with a lower tier 6 God maybe.
Zaros may help him ascend in future however and we've already seen that Zarosianism is more a pantheon, with Orcus and Nex having their own temples, but ultimately still loyal to Zaros also, there is no reason Azzanadra cannot also have his own place as a Deity under Zaros.

I believe you may not be completely out of the ballpark however. Shadow magic specifically, may have a deeper connection to shadow anima, shadow realm and a possible artifact, but not the ancient spellbook itself.

17-Oct-2020 13:04:11

Dan-i-el

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Oh, I also just remembered!
Miasma magic!

Although partially removed from the game (Miasmic barrage still exists as a weapon ability for Zuriel's staff), was a rare experimental branch of the ancient spellbook pioneered by Zuriel during the Zarosian extermination.

It's unlikely most other ancients users know much about it, since the Senntisten equivalent of a wizard's guild would've been destroyed, and any temples that taught magic, erased and replaced by saradominist and zamorakian churches, so potential for spreading this rare experimental magic was very slim.

However, it is proof that the spellbook was just the 2nd age equivalent of the current normal spellbook, as it was developed by... Well, anyone and everyone with magic ability.

Miasma magic was sadly something I never got to use, however, lorewise, I predict that it was essentially plague magic, to complement the existing blood, ice, smoke and shadow spells, to further give zarosians (assuming Zuriel was Zarosian, that is, he might not have) that edge, by covering yet another aspect of magical warfare.

I imagine that Jagex removed it for the same reason the old disease damage mechanic was removed, it would be cool if it could be re-explored in a mini quest or something though, adding a new selection of ancient spells. As far as I know however, the lore behind this magic is still Canon however, evidenced by the fact at least one spell/ability still exists in-game.

17-Oct-2020 13:32:13

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