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Our self regulating market

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I Jonyfrecle

I Jonyfrecle

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Just to be clear: This thread is discussing the fundamental problems with a self regulating market and possible solutions, NOT whether or not price manipulation is actually taking place (because that is impossible to prove)

I Ieft RS in 2012 and came back 8 months ago and having been re-learning everything about the game since then. What I've found curious about the rares market is the way that the price of a rare is determined.

From what I grasp, and correct me if I'm wrong, but the current market value of a rare is said to be whatever previous trades have taken place been traders recently , and posted to the thread or discord channel. Of course, anyone can choose to pay that price or not, it's up to them, but if someone wanted to buy a rare, they would have to expect to pay something around that current market value, determined by previous trades.

I'm sure I'm not the only one that sees the issues with this type of price determination.
1) Not all trades that happen are posted
2) Trades can be fabricated

Number 2 is a problem because anyone with a vested interest in the price of rares can influence it's price. Just to be clear, for example, if I have 10 red partyhats and systematically post red partyhat trades with increasing value from different accounts, I can make a lot of money. It seems to me that this method of traders self regulating their own market is flawed, I'm curious to know how long this price check system has been going on, when was it introduced?

I don't like to be a person that present problems without presenting solutions, so I would propose something I saw in OSRS called tokens, and make it possible to trade them on the GE.
1 platinum token = 1k
If I want to buy something worth 100b I can use 100m platinum tokens

This would allow anonymous GE trading, taking the price control element out of players hands.

Thoughts?

18-Dec-2020 10:42:23 - Last edited on 18-Dec-2020 10:46:16 by I Jonyfrecle

Tenebri
Jan Member 2015

Tenebri

Posts: 39,201 Sapphire Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
you are right on 1 and 2, not all trades happen and many are fabricated. but there are voices from both sides, the ones wanting to buy and the ones wanting to sell. (and a 3rd the ones that are doing both)
with these voices they can call conflict and there is a thread for a discussion of these rares.
the past year rares have skyrocketed not just doubling in price but tripling. its hard to say the exact reason (even though many think they do know)
i think this method of trading was working for a while. but it has been this year where bigger problems have occured from it. especially with manips when youve had your face in the rare market long enough, you get to see familiar names with questionable prices and also questionable post. but its impossible to prove with out j mod manually investigating. and you know godonlyknows when something is going to happen..... the these people that are obviously maniping prices

i do agree something needs to be done in terms of how we keep track of prices to get it more accurate even if that means when this goes into the game it will effect the prices of rares a lot, whether that be increasing them or making them crash... if the end result is harder to manip and being more accurate with real trades then thats great.
i use to say the method we have is fine, probably threads still around with me saying that, but as time has gone on its gotten a lot worse

whether it be the platinum token thing or something else needs to be a step in that direction

and how long its been this way, years and years the disc item price is now on v64. and it use to take a long time for it to reach is max limit.

v55 was was august 2019, so thats 9 in 1 year, using that as a stepping stone we can say about 7 years its been this method of keeping track on rare market.
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18-Dec-2020 11:07:12

Kehl

Kehl

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I feel like this same exact idea of going past max cash in the GE gets brought up every single month now. They already said it’s too difficult to implement something like this in the GE. It would take a TREMENDOUS amount of labor and money to only change something affecting the top 1% and for cosmetic items that bring no utility.

In one of the streams this year, they did consider adding tokens to be used outside of the GE though to make it easier to trade instead of relying on summoning shop spirit shards.

18-Dec-2020 12:31:12 - Last edited on 18-Dec-2020 12:31:50 by Kehl

I Jonyfrecle

I Jonyfrecle

Posts: 3,702 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Kehl said :
I feel like this same exact idea of going past max cash in the GE gets brought up every single month now. They already said it’s too difficult to implement something like this in the GE. It would take a TREMENDOUS amount of labor and money to only change something affecting the top 1% and for cosmetic items that bring no utility.

In one of the streams this year, they did consider adding tokens to be used outside of the GE though to make it easier to trade instead of relying on summoning shop spirit shards.

Feel free to propose an alternative solution. Unless you feel the current method of rares valuation works well, in which case, no need.

18-Dec-2020 12:46:47

Kehl

Kehl

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My alternative solution was to just create a completely separate system similar to the GE where only these new tokens can be used instead of GP+tokens and only a limited amount of items can be included in there such as having only discontinued rares in there. I’m not sure how much less labor intensive and cost effective this solution was though.

18-Dec-2020 13:09:14 - Last edited on 18-Dec-2020 13:10:42 by Kehl

I Jonyfrecle

I Jonyfrecle

Posts: 3,702 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Kehl said :
My alternative solution was to just create a completely separate system similar to the GE where only these new tokens can be used instead of GP+tokens and only a limited amount of items can be included in there such as having only discontinued rares in there. I’m not sure how much less labor intensive and cost effective this solution was though.

I like it!

18-Dec-2020 13:26:15

Richie B5
Nov Member 2011

Richie B5

Posts: 237 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Kehl said :
I feel like this same exact idea of going past max cash in the GE gets brought up every single month now. They already said it’s too difficult to implement something like this in the GE. It would take a TREMENDOUS amount of labor and money to only change something affecting the top 1% and for cosmetic items that bring no utility.

In one of the streams this year, they did consider adding tokens to be used outside of the GE though to make it easier to trade instead of relying on summoning shop spirit shards.

I always hated when people use "but it will take a long time" as an excuse to not do something. That only means start sooner and stop procrastinating. There is a clear difference between a complaint and an objection. That is a complaint and we need to push forward with what WE want. Accepting complaints as valid objections will lead to us having this conversation all over again a year from now. 15 Year RS veteran - stock trader for fun - intellectual - salesman

18-Dec-2020 13:32:22

Kehl

Kehl

Posts: 331 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
It’s not my complaint it was mentioned in stream. There’s limitations and sometimes companies have to weight benefit vs costs and return on investment.

18-Dec-2020 13:59:57 - Last edited on 18-Dec-2020 14:01:09 by Kehl

Kehl

Kehl

Posts: 331 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I Jonyfrecle said :
Kehl said :
My alternative solution was to just create a completely separate system similar to the GE where only these new tokens can be used instead of GP+tokens and only a limited amount of items can be included in there such as having only discontinued rares in there. I’m not sure how much less labor intensive and cost effective this solution was though.

I like it!

Thank you!

18-Dec-2020 14:00:33

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