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HP Feedback #1: Response.

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H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Not the best start, Jagex - but it's nice that there is an open line of communication here. I'll go point for point.

Daily Missions

You're saying - if I read it correctly - that the first two daily missions will now have large xp lamps and the points, and the third mission will have only hero points.

Moving in the right direction, but if you offer additional ANYTHING for having to spend upwards of 30 minutes in game doesn't really solve the problem of daily missions taking longer than daily challenges did. This also doesn't acknowledge that you are waffling on whether or not treasure hunter keys are "bad" for the game, "only bad if you don't pay for them", or "good" Many players would like to see Treasure Hunter keys awarded for these missions.

Furthermore, players would like to target skills they can complete daily missions in, like they could before.

It -is- definitely nice to hear that any new content update will simultaneously come with special missions, because some may not have been keen on that simply by implication or previous communication.

Much of the uproar here is NOT just about XP.

Visibility

This is the area you're doing the best work in, by a mile. Thank you for making the pass less present in the general RuneScape forefront.

Content Buffs

In regards to combat buffs - there's certainly a lot of hardliners out there who are going to lean hard on the integrity aspect of PvM. I personally felt like Jagex had payed enough attention there, and that the larger part of the issue with content buff rewards were their placement in the MTX-centric Premier Club track.

Giving everyone who plays accessible content buffs (even combat in my opinion, if they are going to work like DTDs) isn't a problem. Giving people who pay for additional services a clear cut advantage in obtaining these buffs (especially combat buffs)? That's where things went south in a hurry.

(cont.)
Quest Cape Owner since 2021

Maxed
- July 31st, 2022

07-Sep-2023 06:14:54

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Ironmen Accounts

It really felt like Jagex was punishing the RS3 Ironman community due to the game mode's biggest draw on our side of the fence being that Jagex doesn't monetize ironmen into massive amounts of debt.

Should Ironmen be able to claim XP after completing challenges? Yes.
Should Ironmen be able to earn cosmetics? Yes.
Should Ironmen be able to claim Hero Satchels when progressing to them? Yes.

I don't play as an Iron, but if you want the battlepass to actually encourage those players to engage with it, don't be stingy with rewards. They can correct me on this - but earning things for themselves, regardless of what it is, absolutely falls into the spirit of the game mode.

Progression

You balanced this update around only THIRTY PERCENT of the playerbase being able to actually complete the track?

Jagex. Here's your sign. Right here.

A MAJORITY of your players should be able to complete the pass without having to pay you additional money to do so. A MAJORITY. PERIOD.

...and it's here where we get into the data we have to wait for you to obtain. What kind of data are you looking for? Engagement? How many people manage to complete the pass without buying in? THE OPPOSITE (i.e. how much profit this brings in?)

On this particular point, you do not need the extra data. The people have spoken. Listen to them and fix it. Please.
Quest Cape Owner since 2021

Maxed
- July 31st, 2022

07-Sep-2023 06:28:00 - Last edited on 07-Sep-2023 06:30:01 by H 1 L D A

Maglusek
May Member 2023

Maglusek

Posts: 11 Bronze Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I'm Ironman and I don't want any XP or combat buffs, I want nothing but plain regular gameplay. If you're IM and you're looking for special events, xp buffs, combat buffs, then why you even playing IM in the first place? go mainscape and play with all the buffss, boosts and everything you want.

07-Sep-2023 07:40:20

H 1 L D A
Apr Member 2020

H 1 L D A

Posts: 1,666 Mithril Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
I suppose it is a good thing Jagex is trying to gather data from the Iron community specifically, because "I don't want anything" is a take I think Jagex has tried to adhere to with this and previous tracks.

There are Irons who feel they should be able to unlock cosmetic items at the very least, and have little to no use for the oddments they have accumulated over the years.

If the majority opinion is like yours Mag, I don't think they need to change anything.
Quest Cape Owner since 2021

Maxed
- July 31st, 2022

07-Sep-2023 07:44:29

Cb555
Apr Member 2011

Cb555

Posts: 3,544 Adamant Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
Their balancing for dailies seems to assume 240 pts/hour. Even at this rate they actually take: T1 2-3mins + T2 7-13mins + T3 13-25mins (+2mins delay on login/hop if doing only these) though, so their numbers still claim they are faster than they actually are (MoW method aside).

Furthermore, in my experience, this rate is only possible if you play in certain ways as MOST forms of gameplay DO NOT COUNT. This is partially offset by the fact that afk training methods tend to account for a disproportionately large amount of playtime - around 50-60% of it in my experience, but nonetheless the fundamental counting method is severely flawed.

In practice, dailies ended up as ~150 hero points/hour and weeklies as a whopping zero points in the very active 30 minutes it took me to do them all.

Only 4 types of gameplay count at 240+/hour:
1) Marks of War grinding (200pts/hour from the 1k marks/hour)
2) Fast clue step grinding for points per step on top of time points via teleports, etc.
3) AFK-type grinding via core skilling/combat methods
4) Unhealthy minute counting for 1 xp tick/min (via alch/disassembly stack) while doing other content...

All in all I cannot see the average point rate when playing NORMALLY being anything higher than 180-200pts/hour.
-
The 30% reaching 120 by design feels like a blatant admission that they lied when they said this was to drive engagement instead of primarily as a premium track.
120 is the primary target point for almost all players as it is when the core rewards end, therefore almost all players need to feel 120 is an attainable level without MTX otherwise it will fail by design as a non-premium battlepass. 99 can never be considered an end point as it leaves you with an incomplete reward set (the most obvious bit being only 2 of the 3 conjure overrides - it clearly not being practical to complete a set is a great way to make people give up before they even begin and is therefore a fatal design flaw).

07-Sep-2023 23:12:59 - Last edited on 08-Sep-2023 02:17:44 by Cb555

Pulseironic
Mar Member 2020

Pulseironic

Posts: 361 Silver Posts by user Forum Profile RuneMetrics Profile
H 1 L D A said :

Should Ironmen be able to claim XP after completing challenges? Yes.
Should Ironmen be able to earn cosmetics? Yes.
Should Ironmen be able to claim Hero Satchels when progressing to them? Yes.


as an ironman i say no to the first, and yes to the others. the cosmetics and things i got from the challenge rewards was all i cared about. xp was a side note and back when i was doing one at a time literally worthless 5/28 times! just let me have access to dg token boxes and give me SOMETHING to spend oddments on after ive claimed every cosmetic in its store. notepaper will work and is the least impacting thing available.

08-Sep-2023 04:47:51

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